Who won this evolution/ID debate?

Personally, I don't understand why Shermer keeps debating like this considering he's had a history of getting owned by none other than Hovind.Added by edit.Actually, I know it's unwise to go against Percy, but I highly recommend listening to the first 60 minutes first. I'm more interested in the tone of the debaters and what might the audience think as a result of the tone.In a debate, facts aren't the only things that count. For example, I could tell you your breath stinks by saying "hey, your breath stinks" or I could say "I can smell your breath."Right now, I'm feeling more sympathetic toward Meyer and Sternberg.My question is how are they doing this? How come IDists always sound better in person even though their arguments are BS?Edited by Taz, : No reason given.

I'm still listening to it. My question is what kind of audience did they have? Because brought up in the debate are some pretty hefty concepts and words.

Perhaps I could learn a lot from you after all. I've been trying to live as a liar for a while. You could teach me how to lie more shamelessly.Added by edit.Perhaps I should be a little more clear. We've been telling you for years that the process isn't completely random. Although it's vital to the process, I would argue that randomness only makes up a small part of the overall process. And yet here you are continuing to say that the process is completely random.It seems like lying must be the christian thing, then, since you've been telling us that you're some sort of preacher at your church and that you're a very christian person. So, I have to conclude that in order to be morally superior you have to be a liar.And I'm still waiting for that apology about the leaked email about global warming. I made it clear in that thread that if you couldn't cite directly from the emails the parts where those researchers specifically said they doctored the numbers, then you had no grounds to accuse the scientific community of an international conspiracy. All you did was keep linking us to blogs that linked to other blogs that linked to yet other blogs of people's opinions on the matter. If one is patient enough, one could keep clicking on the links after links until one gets to the texts of those emails taken out of context.So, I've established that you're a liar. But not only that, you seem to have a problem admitting that you're a liar.Seriously, Buz, it's getting tiring and old. I cringe every time I see a self proclaimed "man of god" lie so casually.Edited by Taz, : No reason given.