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Author Topic:   Gun Control & 2nd Amendment
New Cat's Eye
Inactive Member


Message 200 of 218 (552478)
03-29-2010 12:11 PM
Reply to: Message 187 by Theodoric
03-27-2010 9:17 AM


Re: Judge, jury and executioner?
WE decide when we are justified in "taking the law into our own hands" through the appropriate means according to the particular case.
Just to be clear here. You are advocating that an individual has the right to determine when, where and how they should be able to shoot someone?
Nope.
The appropriate means would be those deemed legal by the courts n'stuff.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 187 by Theodoric, posted 03-27-2010 9:17 AM Theodoric has seen this message but not replied

  
New Cat's Eye
Inactive Member


Message 214 of 218 (552811)
03-31-2010 8:59 AM
Reply to: Message 212 by RAZD
03-30-2010 8:18 PM


The constitution does not restrict how much regulation can be imposed on gun ownership so long as the ability to form citizen militias is not infringed,
But the Supreme Court said that what can't be infringed is the right of individuals, the People, i.e. me and you, to keep arms. Its beside the point whether or not a criteria for a militia is filled by the police.
Any law that restricts the availability of guns will reduce the number of guns used illegally, and it will coincidentally reduce the number of accidents due to guns
The amount of the reduction of accidents doesn't justify disarming citizens. But again, since the 2nd amendment says that I have a right to own them, it doesn't matter if you want to take away peoples' guns to prevent some accidents.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 212 by RAZD, posted 03-30-2010 8:18 PM RAZD has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 216 by RAZD, posted 03-31-2010 8:45 PM New Cat's Eye has replied

  
New Cat's Eye
Inactive Member


Message 218 of 218 (553067)
04-01-2010 10:13 AM
Reply to: Message 216 by RAZD
03-31-2010 8:45 PM


But the Supreme Court said that what can't be infringed is the right of individuals, the People, i.e. me and you, to keep arms. Its beside the point whether or not a criteria for a militia is filled by the police.
Curiously, what the Supreme Court has said is that states have the right to regulate firearms and weapons.
There's nothing curious about that because nobody is advocating a lack of regulation nor claiming that there is no regulation. What's curious is why you even bring that up.
Stay on point here... You're trying to say that having the police and national guard fullfills the requirements of the militia so taking away the citizens' guns wouldn't violate the amendment. But you're wrong because the Supreme Court has ruled otherwise, i.e. it is an individual right that we all have.
Interestingly, your opinion cannot alter reality.
Arrogantly, you say that while acting like you think that yours can:
Certainly the regulation of weapons similar to what is in Canada and England is justified on this basis.
A fine opinion, but like mine, it cannot alter reality.
The fact is that this can be done without violating the second amendment stipulation that militias can be formed by existing avenues,
Bafflingly, you're still ignoring the Supremem Court ruling. Fortunately, it doesn't matter if militias would otherwise still be formed, the right is that of the individual people.
You want to carry or operate a gun used to fight crime, then join a police force and get trained in fighting crime.
You want to carry or operate a gun used to fight a war, then join a National Guard unit and get trained in fighting a war.
We want to have the capability of defending ourselves and our families, protect our chickens from coyotes, protect out vegetables from rabbits, hunt food, entertain our favorite hobby, and enjoy some recreational shooting.
The reduction in the amount of violent assaults resulting in death AND the reduction in the number of accidents resulting in maiming or death IS a rational reason for the regulation of weapons.
How many deaths would be prevented? What are the adverse side-effects of the regulation?
But regardless, weapons are already regulated.
ABE:
With the only significant difference between the US, Canada and England being the gun regulations, the significantly higher rate of murder by firearms is unequivocally correlated with the possession of firearms in the US and the relatively lax regulations in the US compared to England and Canada.
quote:
Crime Statistics > Murders with firearms (per capita) (most recent) by country
quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
# 8 United States: 0.0279271 per 1,000 people
Assuming the population of the U.S. is 307 million people, 0.03 deaths per 1000 people comes out to 9210 deaths from murder by firearm.
9210...
From the CDC, I found this info:
quote:
Number of deaths for leading causes of death:
Heart disease: 631,636
Cancer: 559,888
Stroke (cerebrovascular diseases): 137,119
Chronic lower respiratory diseases: 124,583
Accidents (unintentional injuries): 121,599
Diabetes: 72,449
Alzheimer's disease: 72,432
Influenza and Pneumonia: 56,326
Nephritis, nephrotic syndrome, and nephrosis: 45,344
Septicemia: 34,234
The death prevention from firearm regulation like that of UK/Canada is negligible.
Its just too insignificant to be the main reason for taking away people's guns.
Edited by Catholic Scientist, : No reason given.
Edited by Catholic Scientist, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
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