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Author Topic:   It's a World Cup year!
caffeine
Member (Idle past 1024 days)
Posts: 1800
From: Prague, Czech Republic
Joined: 10-22-2008


Message 16 of 291 (555713)
04-15-2010 4:57 AM
Reply to: Message 9 by onifre
04-14-2010 3:50 PM


Re: Tragedy and Triumph
I think you'll be surprised big time by Argentina, a la Italy in the last cup. They won't win like Italy did, but they'll do very well.[/qs]
I didn't think there was anything surprising about Italy in the last cup - just disappointing. As for Argentina, though, not a chance. They've got some stars, but Marradonna has less understanding of football tactics than the average 7-year old fan. They've fluked a lucky run, so they might make it as far as the Quarter-Finals, but there they could well run into either England or Germany; who will demonstrate why sound tactics and organisation are important.
I could easily see Argentina losing to Korea and Nigeria and struggling against Greece though, so they might be out long before that.

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caffeine
Member (Idle past 1024 days)
Posts: 1800
From: Prague, Czech Republic
Joined: 10-22-2008


Message 17 of 291 (555714)
04-15-2010 5:01 AM
Reply to: Message 7 by Straggler
04-14-2010 3:05 PM


Re: He Shoots. He Scores
Spain to win. Brazil to do well. Argentina to do badly (my other half is Argentinian so there is some rivalry there) and England to get to the semi- finals before losing heroically but dissappointingly on penalties to Germany as always (it may be that this is impossible in terms of fixtures I haven't checked - but something like that anyway)
If you want to work out who's likely to play who in the later stages without having to think or count, go here. It's a Java applet where you just fill in the results of matches and it automatically shows you what the later fixtures will be.

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Huntard
Member (Idle past 2295 days)
Posts: 2870
From: Limburg, The Netherlands
Joined: 09-02-2008


Message 18 of 291 (555716)
04-15-2010 5:38 AM


If you can't beat them....
Join them...
I don't really care for football that much, I think they're all a bunch of overpaid sissy's. Seriously, sneeze in one's direction a little loudly and he's rolling on the ground screaming like his leg got cut off, they seriously need to harden the fuck up.
Anyway.... I'll probably just watch the games by The Netherlands, and see how far they'll get. Which will probably be the game after the group games, where they'll be thoroughly pwned.
Bunch of overpaid sissy's.... *grumbles some more*

Replies to this message:
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Jumped Up Chimpanzee
Member (Idle past 4942 days)
Posts: 572
From: UK
Joined: 10-22-2009


Message 19 of 291 (555725)
04-15-2010 6:33 AM
Reply to: Message 1 by caffeine
04-14-2010 7:23 AM


Losing to USA would be unbearable, even though there shouldn't be any shame in it as they're quite highly ranked.
I just hope England go through the tournament without displaying the fear of losing that's been our downfall in recent years. Let's go out and play positive, fast tempo but skillful football - we have the players to do it. I also think it should be an advantage to us for once that the climate in SA in June should be relatively cool.
One thing that's always stuck me as odd about USA soccer, is they don't seem to have ever produced a single world class player. I don't deny that they have some very good players, but I've never seen any really great ones. To my knowledge they have never produced anyone in the class of the current crop of top English players like Rooney, Gerrard, Lampard, Ferdinand, Terry, Ashley Cole. I know soccer isn't their biggest sport, but considering the size of their population and the apparent popularity of the sport within schools, plus the fact that they have many players now in the top leagues in Europe, I'm surprised by this. Out of 300 million people, you'd think there must be at least 1 or 2 little maestros. Anybody disagree with that observation or have an explanation for it?

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Replies to this message:
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caffeine
Member (Idle past 1024 days)
Posts: 1800
From: Prague, Czech Republic
Joined: 10-22-2008


Message 20 of 291 (555729)
04-15-2010 6:54 AM
Reply to: Message 19 by Jumped Up Chimpanzee
04-15-2010 6:33 AM


Where are the American stars?
Reyna's pretty good, although admittedly the best American players i can think of are both goalkeeprs (Howard and Friedel). The reason there are so few might just be because American kids don't spend enough time playing football. That's what we used to spend pretty much every summer doing all the time as kids, and in this sort of environment talent is going to get notice and encouraged. I'm guessing it's less common there.
As for the USA's ranking - they're aren't half as good as it makes them look. Their ranking is grossly inflated by the fact that Mexico is the only other worthwhile team in the CONACAF region - the US spends most of its time playing terrible teams, so they win a lot.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 19 by Jumped Up Chimpanzee, posted 04-15-2010 6:33 AM Jumped Up Chimpanzee has replied

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Jumped Up Chimpanzee
Member (Idle past 4942 days)
Posts: 572
From: UK
Joined: 10-22-2009


Message 21 of 291 (555731)
04-15-2010 7:12 AM
Reply to: Message 20 by caffeine
04-15-2010 6:54 AM


Re: Where are the American stars?
Reyna's pretty good, although admittedly the best American players i can think of are both goalkeeprs (Howard and Friedel). The reason there are so few might just be because American kids don't spend enough time playing football. That's what we used to spend pretty much every summer doing all the time as kids, and in this sort of environment talent is going to get notice and encouraged. I'm guessing it's less common there.
I agree they have a few good goalkeepers who might well be better than the current English goalkeepers. But, hey, goalkeepers aren't real players! They can learn that trade playing basketball.
It would be interesting if it's true that in order to become a really top level player you have to play a lot in your free-time in the street or the park as a kid. Obviously it must help, but is it a pre-requisite? I'd be interested to hear how much American kids play soccer both in and out of school.

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Replies to this message:
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Hyroglyphx
Inactive Member


Message 22 of 291 (555757)
04-15-2010 9:29 AM
Reply to: Message 6 by onifre
04-14-2010 3:05 PM


Americans will only enjoy what they get expossed to on a regular basis. Who knew we would love to watch Jersey douchebags punch women in the face so much? Be we do! Season 2 is Miami baby!
Are you sure? I was in the dentists office yesterday and I saw an ad explaining how it was going to be in the Boston area. The title was "Wicked Summah." How appropriate. I can't stand this New England accent. It drives me nuts.
MLS tried to change this by adding more breaks in the game to allow advertisers air time. Which in my opinion is pathetic that American TV has to go that route, while the rest of the world can go an hour and a half without 100 commercials.
I hate commercials with a passion. As soon as a commercial break comes on I change channels. But I swear they try and take commercial breaks at the exact same time on every channel. Assholes...

"Political correctness is tyranny with manners." -- Charlton Heston

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Taq
Member
Posts: 9972
Joined: 03-06-2009
Member Rating: 5.5


Message 23 of 291 (555760)
04-15-2010 9:44 AM
Reply to: Message 11 by onifre
04-14-2010 6:04 PM


How, if the US was built by immigrants from the countries that LOVE these sports? There always has been a strong audience. But, the audience that loves it are the "people" no one really cares about - foreigners. Watch spanish TV, it's all soccer.
More so, are you ignoring the millions of hispanics and people from europe, africa, australia, middle east, asian, etc., who currently live here and love the sport? Maybe they're not as seen as some obnoxious football fan, but they're there.
But now we're getting into why people don't follow the game, which is different to why TV networks don't promote it. TV network's specific reason is commercials, on regular, everyday games. An exception or two can be made, but overall, unless the way the game is played gets changed, normal coverage of a soccer game would suck for advertisers.
I am not arguing the relative worth of each sport, nor the relative worth of that sports' fans. I am just looking at the facts. There are 100,000 fans at every University of Michigan home game. People pay hundreds of dollars to see 1 of 80 New York Yankees home games, and those are the cheap seats. The Super Bowl is the biggest TV draw for the entire year. These are the facts. Advertisers follow the crowd.
At the same time, I wouldn't be surprised at all if soccer became the number 3 sport in the US within 20 years, perhaps even surpassing baseball at the high school and college level. We could be seeing prime time soccer on one of the major networks within maybe 15 years. Soccer is quickly becoming more popular in the States, and I see nothing wrong with that whatsoever. The more sports to pull fat kids off the couch the better off we all will be, IMHO.

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Straggler
Member
Posts: 10333
From: London England
Joined: 09-30-2006


Message 24 of 291 (555961)
04-16-2010 2:45 PM
Reply to: Message 22 by Hyroglyphx
04-15-2010 9:29 AM


As soon as a commercial break comes on I change channels. But I swear they try and take commercial breaks at the exact same time on every channel. Assholes...
You should tune into the commercialless BBC.
But of course then you might be indoctrinated with liberal evilness

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Straggler
Member
Posts: 10333
From: London England
Joined: 09-30-2006


Message 25 of 291 (555963)
04-16-2010 2:52 PM
Reply to: Message 18 by Huntard
04-15-2010 5:38 AM


Sports Stars Pay.....
Bunch of overpaid sissy's.... *grumbles some more*
Sports star pay is a huge topic of discussion in my view.
At the free-market level these guys are there on a pure meritocracy (they are the best at what they do) and what they do is commercially demanded by millions, if not billions. Making their astronomical pay absolutely what one would expect in a purely market based economy.
But...... In a less market driven environment - Is a sports star really worthy of pay scales that are a 100 times that of a teacher, a nurse , a doctor etc. etc. etc. Does value to society count for anything?
Is it right that a sports star earns tens of millions whilst even the most productive and necessary members of public society earn 100s or even 1000s of times less?

This message is a reply to:
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Replies to this message:
 Message 26 by Huntard, posted 04-16-2010 3:07 PM Straggler has replied

  
Huntard
Member (Idle past 2295 days)
Posts: 2870
From: Limburg, The Netherlands
Joined: 09-02-2008


Message 26 of 291 (555968)
04-16-2010 3:07 PM
Reply to: Message 25 by Straggler
04-16-2010 2:52 PM


I will be brief
Straggler writes:
Is it right that a sports star earns tens of millions whilst even the most productive and necessary members of public society earn 100s or even 1000s of times less?
No.

This message is a reply to:
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Replies to this message:
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 Message 31 by Jumped Up Chimpanzee, posted 04-17-2010 9:57 AM Huntard has replied

  
Straggler
Member
Posts: 10333
From: London England
Joined: 09-30-2006


Message 27 of 291 (555973)
04-16-2010 3:20 PM
Reply to: Message 26 by Huntard
04-16-2010 3:07 PM


Re: I will be brief
Oh you rampant evil communist socialist anti-American you.
I agree.
I think

This message is a reply to:
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Blue Jay
Member (Idle past 2697 days)
Posts: 2843
From: You couldn't pronounce it with your mouthparts
Joined: 02-04-2008


Message 28 of 291 (555991)
04-16-2010 4:18 PM
Reply to: Message 21 by Jumped Up Chimpanzee
04-15-2010 7:12 AM


Re: Where are the American stars?
Hi, Chimp.
Jumped Up Chimpanzee writes:
I'd be interested to hear how much American kids play soccer both in and out of school.
I think I played soccer as a kid more than I played any other sport. I played in city leagues through 3rd or 4th grade, and I played in middle school (I was the defensive star for the season, by the way; we lost in the championship, though).
In elementary school (ages 5-11), all the kids played soccer during recesses (we got about 1 hour of recess everyday, broken up into three parts) until it started snowing. Then, we played touch football (American) on the basketball court until the snow thawed.
Soccer is more popular here than most people realize; it's just that it's underdeveloped at the professional level.

-Bluejay (a.k.a. Mantis, Thylacosmilus)
Darwin loves you.

This message is a reply to:
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Blue Jay
Member (Idle past 2697 days)
Posts: 2843
From: You couldn't pronounce it with your mouthparts
Joined: 02-04-2008


Message 29 of 291 (555998)
04-16-2010 4:32 PM
Reply to: Message 5 by Taq
04-14-2010 2:21 PM


Hi, Taq.
Taq writes:
There is almost no coverage of alpine skiing anymore, but it draws big air time during the Olympics because we want to see Americans win in the Olympics.
This is the main reason why I almost never root for the USA in international competitions. Nobody in my lab, and only a few people at church, watched any of the Winter Olympics a couple months ago, and those that did watch didn't know anything about most of the events except that there was an American, and some number is assigned at the end of the competition to say who won.
Yet, despite that, our athletes somehow still win a lot of Olympic medals.

-Bluejay (a.k.a. Mantis, Thylacosmilus)
Darwin loves you.

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Jumped Up Chimpanzee
Member (Idle past 4942 days)
Posts: 572
From: UK
Joined: 10-22-2009


Message 30 of 291 (556104)
04-17-2010 9:51 AM
Reply to: Message 28 by Blue Jay
04-16-2010 4:18 PM


Re: Where are the American stars?
Soccer is more popular here than most people realize; it's just that it's underdeveloped at the professional level.
Thanks, that's interesting. I did have the impression that it was very popular in schools, and has been for some time. That's why I'm surprised that few if any really great individuals have not yet emerged. Even if the professional system is undeveloped over there, you'd think the big clubs over here would have spotted them.
Maybe it's got something to do with the young age soccer players are signed up by professional clubs in Britain (and, I believe, in the rest of Europe) compared to the college system you have for sports development. Very few British players have traditionally had a college education. In fact, most will finish formal education and become full-time professionals at around 16 (having already been in the junior teams of professional clubs). If they're not challenging for a first team place before they're 20 they either transfer to a smaller club or leave the professional game altogether. I suppose the intensive training and development they get during their teens with professional clubs could be the difference.

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