All I was interested in was what the wording was. From the English and Latin versions there is simply no question. But go to the Hebrew and Greek (I don't think there were any references to this in Aramaic) and there really are discrepancies. I was just as shocked to find this out as you probably will be if you ever do check it out.
I did not expect there to be such an important discrepency in translation. But there is.
I'd be more than happy to take a look at any of those discrepancies you mentioned. The Bible however makes it pretty clear that man's partner was meant to be woman. Genesis 2:20. Either way, feel free to tell me exactly where the discrepancies occur.
By the way I also never bought into the gay gene. I think genetically everyone is trysexual (as in people will try anything). Somethings people will enjoy, somethings not. Maybe hormones and development play a part in one's major inclinations?
Well, seeing as homosexuality wouldn't really fit in with the evolutionary model, I would be inclined to agree with your trysexual analogy. Dogs will hump teddybears, even chickens. When something has a sexual urge, it needs to be filled. However I dont think it needs alot of imagination to think that we are made to find the opposite sex attractive, and if not, we probably wont produce any offspring.
The second half of this sentence not only contradicts the first, it also goes back on your advice to me above.
Do you understand Hebrew, Aramaic, and Greek? Have you read the versions of the Bible in these languages so that you understand what they said? If not, then you do not understand the early versions and you should question later translations.
Hebrew is pretty difficult to understand. Its a rather ancient language, thus difficult to really learn as originally intended. You would have to take a look at events around that period of time to fully understand the translation. A good example is the 'Camel through the eye of a needle' metaphor. Infact there are words in French that are impossible to translate word for word to English.
Point it that if there are 20 verses that condemn homosexuality and not a single on that advocates it, there probably is a reason for it.
The idea that God would allow us to be mislead by translators is in the Bible itself. Jesus instructed that we could be mislead if we allowed ourselves to listen to church leaders instead of seeking out the truth. And always remember the admonishment to beware false prophets. It is not up to God to make sure the REAL word is conveniently placed on store shelves for you to purchase, it is up to you to do the research for yourself.
I dont quite know your Biblical interest, but you are aware that you are not meant to understand the Bible without the Spirit ? The Bible does not mislead, people do. And false prophets 'twist' the Word of God around, not actually rewrite the Bible.
So don't be lazy and start poking around. Why not learn Hebrew, Greek, and Aramaic so you can see the word of God in its most natural state and not be reliant on people who may be false prophets (or descendants of those that were mislead by one)?
Hi, not being able to learn Hebrew has nothing to do with lazyness. And it will not make a difference in my salvation. Yes, if there are any verses anyone wishes to dispute, feel free, we can discuss the original (or close to original as possible) text.
When you doubdt translations however, you might as well doubdt the validity of the actual original texts, whether they really received the Holy Spirit when they wrote the pieces or if they just made it up.
If you do this and find that all the biblical scholars I have read are incorrect, please let me know. I am totally flexible on whatever the Bible has to say... it doesn't affect me personally at all. Just bring evidence to counter their's.
Thing is holmes, that you can actually receive a revelation by reading your current Bible, irrespective of in Hebrew or not. God's Word, if not some churches, has remained constant. The NIV remains extremely similar to the King James version. If you want an example of what is WRONG today , it is when there is 'explanatory' textual changes in the Bible or changes to suit public opinion.
A great example is Onan in Genesis. To some it is unclear as to whether God killed Onan because he woudln't take his brothers sister as his wife or because he spilled his semen. Now the best case scenario is to leave the original text in and have the reader make up his mind, BUT..
38:9
But since Onan knew that the offspring would not be his, he spilled his semen on the ground whenever he went in to his brother's wife, so that he would not give offspring to his brother.
The New Revised Standard Version38:10
What he did was displeasing in the sight of the Lord, and he put him to death also.
New Standard Revision38:10
But the LORD considered it a wicked thing
for Onan to deny a child to his dead brother. So the LORD took Onan's life, too.
* Now this is a problem and a sin to change the Word of God based on popular opinion about birth control.
However to make up my mind I can take a look at the punishment for 'not accepting' your brothers wife, which was public humiliation, thus why did God put him to death ?
Point I'm making in this is that yes, new Biblical 'translations' will be sold at your bookstore, but these changes usually are pretty miniscule and can be easily tracked back to their original and rectified. Every issue and possible 'mistranslation' can be discussed, without having to have a full working knowlege of Hebrew.
So if there are any you wish to talk about, feel free.
If you do this and find that all the biblical scholars I have read are incorrect, please let me know. I am totally flexible on whatever the Bible has to say... it doesn't affect me personally at all. Just bring evidence to counter their's.
Interesting that you only found Biblical scholars that agreed that homosexuality is not a sin, yet those that have done retranslations still come up with the same framework.
Either way, feel free to point me to where you haev disagreements.
cheers
[This message has been edited by Zealot, 09-17-2003]
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