Noahs Flood

How did you end up in an argument in the first place then?I point out that the Ur flood is well documented and turned the Tigris-Euphrates basin into a lake temporarily the one rainy season every other Flud thread, and no one ever argues with me. They think you are talking about Flood Geology (Catastrophism). How did that happen? What is it about you that makes you seem wrongheaded?I'm not dissing you, I been there myself. But ask yourself these questions. You are in a thread, about a book, that claims the Black Sea refill is what caused the story. You disagree with that, you disagree with Flood Geology, yet, you are having a confused shit-toss with people on the same side of the question as you.How did that happen?

Check. Check. Reservations about the word "literally", unless you are using it to mean that the story material has been preserved word-for-word then you are liable to be confused here. Are you some sort of NIV evangelical?Nor is Flood Geology the traditional interpretation, it was invented in an attempt to explain away stratification by people who don't understand the use of genre in scripture. "Creation Science" is NOT traditional Creationism. No good. You are the one who put yourself in this spot. Blaming other people is no use, as you cannot control other people until you learn to control your own circumstances. Once you control your own mind, controlling others will be remarkably easy. No point. Everyone here knows Noah's flood is the Ur flood, to the extent that it is anything historical at all. They just don't talk much about it because it's a lot more fun to watch one side make up ridiculous pseudo-science composed of Lies, Damned Lies, and The Buzsaw Theory while the other side goes straight to hell for understanding simple geology.

The New International Version is a severely bowdlerized "dynamic equivalence" paraphrase of a reconstructed text not found as such in any ancient document. It was heavily marketed to churches beginning in the late 1970s and represents the real value of degrees earned at conservative "Bible Colleges". An "NIV Evangelical" is one of the surprising number of people who point at this loopy barely-a-commentary and claim that it is not only, the Bible, but, that it is "literally true."It's a picturesque way of identifying what are properly called pseudo-literalists. They are using "literally" as a buzzword, to mean something like "very", rather than for its actual meaning, which is, exact to the letter. True literalism is a scribal tradition, it means either you get the exact words and markings exactly right, from one generation to the next, or else when your bad copy is checked against the copy we are keeping sealed, and the error is found, then after that you will have absolutely no skin whatsoever on your back.Thus a literal translation is one that makes every effort to retain the exact meaning of the words, and the idioms formed from them, from one language to the next. "Literally true" in this proper context means that the message has been preserved through this process, from that day to this one. The Dead Sea Scrolls on the one hand and the Gilgamesh and the Atrahasis on the other, show what an awesome job has been done. This really is a text that they had in the First Century. These really are the stories they were telling in Sumer when kingship descended again from Eridu. Paper tigers. Don't just list them, though; actually make them. You are talking about the hydrodynamics of geology to actual working archaeologists and devoted amateurs. If you are going to believe these things, first understand the implications and then verify those implications. Do science, be sure. Don't risk convincing more people that there is no god just because you didn't do your homework. The gaps close, you understand? Can it? Even if there are two huge rivers flowing through it? What keeps that marshwater from draining off south to lower elevations? What indications do the Ur and Shurrupak digs give us as to the length of the flooding? What do the source texts say on this point, do they even seem to agree amongst themselves? A huge beating. But not my problem, I'm sticking with "gopher wood" for poetic reasons, and you already have too much explaining to do on this one to ever get to my lecture on Cyprus. Be specific. Which animals and why? What's their purpose on the boat? How long are they there, how much do they eat every day, how are supplies maintained? What is done with the resulting fertilizer? How many people would it take to do this work? Not, very much, my problem. With a minor quibble about your depths; demonstrate water depth in relation to sea level due to specific causes for specific lengths of time. Verify your answers against real events and real geology. Look into the meaning and usage of the word "Ur-artu". Be careful.Edited by Iblis, : grammar

I'm still reviewing the Burckle Crater material introduced by Mr. Green in Message 58. Any expert insights will be greatly appreciated. There's a claim that the impact was around 2800 BC.Burckle Crater - Wikipedia This last bit I've bolded seems faulty to me, at first. They used their chevrons in 2006 to triangulate a location, checked that location, found a crater. Sounds like science at work, yes? Then later someone is saying Oh those chevrons aren't even from a tsunami though. If so, why do they triangulate a huge crater? Unless the guys doing the work cheated somehow, know about the crater ahead of time, and even then the details elude me. At first glance it looks like their hypothesis is going well.Then I look at who they are.Holocene Impact Working Group - Wikipedia Burckle is their headline, to support their main theory, that we are getting whacked hard by rocks. Their theory isn't just getting sniffed at over aeolian chevrons, after all. So then I started looking into where their date comes from.Burckle Crater - Wikipedia That part I bolded, that seems critical to me. Where exactly does the date come from then? Who are these guys, and what do they do for a living?Archaeology I know, I know, you have seen the Velikovsky data before. Now you are seeing it again. Bear with me, it's for a good cause.Archaeology Are you starting to sweat yet? Can you feel it coming? Catastrophic. Magic. Marketing. Fear, Uncertainty, Doubt.

Hi Flyer75, I'm enjoying your argument but I'm not inclined to answer it just yet, I want to continue following its course with the current respondents.In the meantime though, I would appreciate it if you could give your views, feeling and actions, in relation to the actual New Testament commandments. I'm thinking of things like not just not killing, but not hating; not just not adultering, but not lusting; not just loving your neighbor, but also loving your enemy.When someone shoots you in the left leg, do you roll over on it to make it easier for them to pop one into your right leg as well? When someone kidnaps your daughter, do you run after them and make sure they take your wife too? When someone chains you to a truck and drags you a mile, do you grab onto the bumper and make sure you go along with them that second mile?I'm stretching, I know. But you know what I'm talking about. Do you "resist not evil" ??? Or is that just crap that you can safely ignore? Edited by Adminnemooseus, : Ya got me, marshall!

Hi glowby, welcome to the monkey-toss.I'm not giving you crap, not only is it not my job but you did manage to mention the Flud thingie. But you may get more mileage out of your question in Bible Buffet (Run-off From Noah's Flood). I'm going to stick close here to the part that is at least vaguely relevant. Does it really make any difference, to the message, if those are the exact historical details of the drowning of Uruk III? What I mean is, are those chapters in Genesis a genre of news story or court finding? Or are they, as they appear to be, an ecclectic mix of folk tale, navy drinking song, and spiritual commentary?If I were to start a club called "the Jedi Knights" which used Lucasfilm pap to teach ethics and co-operation to young people, and it caught on and made being good fun for a million kids -- would it matter that there really was no meter-wide hole in the aft ports of the mighty death star? That there were no galaxies far far away full of droids and clones and midichlorians? That your lightsaber was just a plastic toy?If god were merely "real" he would just be another idol.