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Author | Topic: Why is sin heritable? | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Larni Member Posts: 4000 From: Liverpool Joined: |
Why did Yahweh make sin heritable?
If one accepts that Adam deserved punishment and Yahweh did indeed punish him why did Yahweh also decide to punish other people (Adam descendants) so setting in motion the events that required Yahweh kill his own son. I would contend that Yahweh's 'go to' method for getting things done is suffering even to the point of making himself suffer, but that can't be right, can it?
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Larni Member Posts: 4000 From: Liverpool Joined: |
Hi PD.
Sorry if I gave you the impression that I was getting on the punishment pony I'm more interested in the title, i.e. I'm interested in whether sin is heritable and why Yahweh chose to make it that way.
What in the Bible gives you the impression that sin is heritable or that YHWH made sin heritable? Wherefore, as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin; and so death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned Romans 5:12 (King James Version) To me this means the state of being 'in sin' is passed on through generations. Yahweh seems to have decreed that all people will start off in a state of sin. As Yahweh decided by fiat that this is the case Yahweh could be seen as responsible for humans being in the sate of 'sin'. Is that your kitty in your avatar? Edited by Larni, : Kitty talk.
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Larni Member Posts: 4000 From: Liverpool Joined: |
When filling the coffers is dependent on people believing that they have commited some crime and that you're the only way they can find absolution for said crime it makes good business sense to brainwash people into thinking they are guilty from birth. I agree. However, I'm taking the position that it is all true and asking about Yahweh's motivation to make sin heritable.
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Larni Member Posts: 4000 From: Liverpool Joined: |
The 'go to' reference means that whenever Yahweh wants to get get any thing done he uses suffering.
If a mother warns her child not to drink a certain bottle of poison, and the child disobeys to do so, the child has two problems. On one hand the transgression of the command is a problem. On the other the child has received poison into thier system. Yahweh put the bottle of poison in plain, open view. He stood by as one of his creations tempted his wife, Eve. Then he made sure that all of Adam's children would be born with the same poison in their metaphorical blood stream. Yahweh apparently decided that the entirety of humanity should be forever after born with poison in their veins. Why?
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Larni Member Posts: 4000 From: Liverpool Joined: |
The kids will be impacted by the consequences of their parents choices, but the kids aren't being punished. The kids are only impacted by the actions of their patients because Yahweh decided that it should be so because he wanted it that way. He could have (in his infinite power) have chose another way. Yahweh could have decided that only the commiter of sin should suffer any consequences. Why would Yahweh choose this set of condition when he could have (in his infinite mercy) chose another way?
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Larni Member Posts: 4000 From: Liverpool Joined: |
Yahweh cursed them and their offspring. I see no reason why YHWH should have punished their off spring, as well as A+E.
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Larni Member Posts: 4000 From: Liverpool Joined: |
If sin is breaking of a moral law, why did YHWH decide that x was a moral law, sinning was to break that law and it was part of our nature to engage in x (i.e. to sin)?
YHWH creates us with sin already a component of our being. He need not have done so. What could have informed his decision to do so?
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Larni Member Posts: 4000 From: Liverpool Joined: |
This is why God is not happy with our sinful condition and why he provided one who could remove sin and death from us. Our purpose on this earth is to reflect Gods perfection...until we are perfect like him we are sinners. Peg, I'm really sorry to sound like a broken record but the point is that YHWH could remove our sin without having to create Jesus with the express intention of killing him. None of that was necessary. YHWH did not need to make sin heritable. Was there anything limiting YHWH's ability to remove sin with a wave of his hand?
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Larni Member Posts: 4000 From: Liverpool Joined: |
But if YHWH loved us he would gift us with eternal life, rather than make it contingent on our choices (which our nature specifically makes impossible).
Like a parent loving their baby, rather than making that love contingent on loving us back (a concept no baby can deal with).
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Larni Member Posts: 4000 From: Liverpool Joined: |
Maybe I should re phrase that comment: I see no reason why the off spring of A+E should inherit sin.
Note to self--- Stay off the punishment boat!
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Larni Member Posts: 4000 From: Liverpool Joined: |
Does YHWH not have to power to effect any change in reality or not?
If he does not, then I guess he may have been constrained in his use of methods to effect his wishes. If (as I'm led to believe) YHWH is a creator god then he must have the ability to tinker with his work without leaving any trace then he could have said "ok, A+E took their medicine and paid the price but I won't leave the poison in their kids".
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Larni Member Posts: 4000 From: Liverpool Joined: |
Just out of the door but I would like to address this point quickly.
It may be that he didn't make it so but that it was inevitably so - a function of the natural created order of things. But that must mean he is unable to break the natural order: true or false.
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Larni Member Posts: 4000 From: Liverpool Joined: |
Adam was given no such offer of salvation, we were. I never thought of that. Does that mean the Adam languishes in Hell as we speak?
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Larni Member Posts: 4000 From: Liverpool Joined: |
Sin inherited by all due to the sin of one is a natural feature of the b) class of hull design. That is the design that God chose in creating mankind. I understand your analogy. But it seems to indicate that YHWH cannot alter some aspects of his creation. This then implies that he did not forsee that he would be backed into a corner where his power was constrained (by the very rules he decided to implement). The only conclusion I can draw from this (if he loves us as much as we are told) is that he made a mistake that he could not correct by fiat and had to jump through all of the hoops (killing Jesus) to get around (somehow) the 'rules of reality'.
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