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Author Topic:   Biological classification vs 'Kind'
Percy
Member
Posts: 22499
From: New Hampshire
Joined: 12-23-2000
Member Rating: 4.9


Message 352 of 385 (565484)
06-17-2010 8:43 AM
Reply to: Message 316 by BobTHJ
06-15-2010 7:29 PM


Re: Mutations and Information
BobTHJ writes:
I'll try to do a little better. However, as I've previously stated I base my conclusions upon the evidence I've reviewed.
You're reaching conclusions based on "the evidence I've reviewed" when you've clearly reviewed far too little evidence to be reaching any conclusions. Also, often when pressed about your evidence you respond that such and such is just a hypothesis at this point.
Mostly what you've got at this point is Genesis and hope.
Sorry...it appears I may have misrepresented this. this is the study I was thinking of. If I understand it correctly, it shows that much of the redundancy in the genome is not due to gene duplication. I was wrong in that it didn't have anything to do with frequency.
Are you sure that's the right reference? Only the abstract is available to non-subscribers of Science, and the abstract says nothing about redundancy. What I was questioning in your statement was that there was ever a prediction about the prevalence of gene duplication, let alone a revision downward.
Another poor choice of wording on my part. What I meant was: The evolutionary prediction that this type of adaptation requires large amounts of time is falsified by these studies.
I think you've been misinformed. There's nothing in evolutionary theory that predicts that bacteria should require a great deal of time to evolve. What evolution predicts is that imperfect reproduction will cause genetic changes to accumulate over time. The shorter the generations the faster genetic changes can accumulate.
Therefore, if common ancestry is true - why does it require billions of years to get from the first life to modern life?
Let's say one of your descendants a billion years from now were to ask, "Why did it take a billion years to get from Bob to me? If evolution is true, why wasn't I produced a long time ago?" What would you answer?
Maybe you want to rephrase your question?
Here's the link to a study demonstrating this. Remember: transposons are a type of semi-functional remnant VIGE in Borger's hypothesis.
Using the link you provided, please read your reference and then post a message explaining how transposons support Borger's hypothesis that the VIGE ancestors of these transposons directed the course of evolution, as opposed to selection based upon the environment. It must be true that environmentally influenced selection could not have been a factor because with accelerated evolution the environment could not have been rapidly changing at the same time. Or did ancient historians not only fail to note the rapid changes in the local flora and fauna, but also that one year they were living in a forest, the next in a desert, and the next in a tundra.
And of course the geological contradictions of how animals that evolved and went extinct since the flood came to be deeply buried beneath miles (in some cases) of sediment is off-topic in this thread.
--Percy

This message is a reply to:
 Message 316 by BobTHJ, posted 06-15-2010 7:29 PM BobTHJ has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 354 by Wounded King, posted 06-17-2010 9:53 AM Percy has seen this message but not replied

  
Percy
Member
Posts: 22499
From: New Hampshire
Joined: 12-23-2000
Member Rating: 4.9


Message 353 of 385 (565488)
06-17-2010 9:06 AM
Reply to: Message 321 by BobTHJ
06-16-2010 3:12 AM


Hi Bob,
The kind of post I had in mind was one you posted shortly after mine, Message 297:
Wow....it looks like to me they found exactly what they set out to find.
So if creationists find evidence of a global flood 4350 years ago we're entitled to respond, "Gee, they found exactly what they set out to find!"
Or should we perhaps examine the actual evidence and address that.
Most of my posts leading up to my Message 291 were attempting to get you to notice your tendency to give short shrift to evidence and rather long shrift to unevidenced hypotheses. That context was apparently not obvious and gave the wrong impression, sorry about that.
--Percy
Edited by Percy, : Grammar.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 321 by BobTHJ, posted 06-16-2010 3:12 AM BobTHJ has not replied

  
Percy
Member
Posts: 22499
From: New Hampshire
Joined: 12-23-2000
Member Rating: 4.9


Message 360 of 385 (565558)
06-17-2010 9:27 PM
Reply to: Message 319 by BobTHJ
06-16-2010 2:42 AM


BobTHJ writes:
Yes, YEC scientists did predict Neanderthal to be human - and have for some time.
Oh, is that what "Homo holobaramin" means? Human? I didn't realize you were claiming that YEC scientists had predicted Neanderthals were human. So this would be a great example of the application of baraminology. How did they apply the principles of baraminology (which you have yet to describe, so this would be a great opportunity) to make this prediction?
By the way, the genetic analyses that indicate cross breeding between Neaderthals and humans (the criteria you're using to decide they were human) also indicate that the two lineages split about 500,000 years ago. So you think scientists are 1000 times off on some things but can be trusted on the rest? What criteria are YEC's applying to make these vastly different assessments of reliability of data from these closely related studies?
Here's an AiG review of Wood, B. and Collard, M., The human genus, Science 284(5411):65—71, 1999. I can't access the original article without a subscription...
Sure you can, right here: The Human Genus
...but unless AiG is misrepresenting the findings the study showed H. Ergaster to be completely human...
You misunderstood John Woodmorappe's description of the article. The article argued that Home egaster *does* belong in the genus Homo, while other lineages like Homo habilis do not. It wasn't arguing that Homo egaster should be reclassified as Homo sapiens.
--Percy
Edited by Percy, : Grammar.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 319 by BobTHJ, posted 06-16-2010 2:42 AM BobTHJ has not replied

  
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