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Author | Topic: Parables 101 | |||||||||||||||||||
purpledawn Member (Idle past 3457 days) Posts: 4453 From: Indiana Joined: |
Out of curiosity, why did you stop at verse 9 and equate the seeds with wisdom?
Matthew 13:18 "Listen then to what the parable of the sower means... The seed is equated with the word, just as it is in Mark and Luke. A gentle answer turns away wrath, But a harsh word stirs up anger.
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purpledawn Member (Idle past 3457 days) Posts: 4453 From: Indiana Joined: |
The parable deals with the four types of hearers and their response to the message received.
Seed on Path = When anyone hears the message about the kingdom and does not understand it, the evil one comes and snatches away what was sown in his heart. Seed on Rock = is the man who hears the word and at once receives it with joy. But since he has no root, he lasts only a short time. When trouble or persecution comes because of the word, he quickly falls away. Seed among Thorns = is the man who hears the word, but the worries of this life and the deceitfulness of wealth choke it, making it unfruitful. Seed on Good Soil = is the man who hears the word and understands it. He produces a crop, yielding a hundred, sixty or thirty times what was sown. (Luke) stands for those with a noble and good heart, who hear the word, retain it, and by persevering produce a crop. What is your teaching on wisdom? A gentle answer turns away wrath, But a harsh word stirs up anger.
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purpledawn Member (Idle past 3457 days) Posts: 4453 From: Indiana Joined: |
That's your teaching on wisdom?
How does the parable fit into that scenerio? A gentle answer turns away wrath, But a harsh word stirs up anger.
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purpledawn Member (Idle past 3457 days) Posts: 4453 From: Indiana Joined: |
You said you were going to treat this as a Bible Study.
Jesus was very clear how the parable described the different types of hearing. I do not understand how your thoughts on wisdom are associated with the parable. How does the parable help me to visualize your teaching on wisdom? A gentle answer turns away wrath, But a harsh word stirs up anger.
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purpledawn Member (Idle past 3457 days) Posts: 4453 From: Indiana Joined: |
quote:I said I do not UNDERSTAND how your toughts on wisdom are associated with the parable. I don't comprehend how your interpretation can be related to the parable. You have given me nothing to associate with the parable to enable me to remember your interpretation in the future when I hear the parable. I'm asking for clarification.I don't get what you are teaching about wisdom in relation to the parable. I don't understand your point concerning wisdom and the parable. When the disciples asked Jesus what he meant by a parable he explained it. Please explain. Have I said I don't get it? A gentle answer turns away wrath, But a harsh word stirs up anger.
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purpledawn Member (Idle past 3457 days) Posts: 4453 From: Indiana Joined: |
In a parable the various details of the story do not stand for something else. Tyndale Bible Dictionary
quote:But the servant still didn't do the most with his one talent given his view of his master's character. That's why the master said: You wicked lazy servant! So you knew that I harvest where I have not sown and gather where I have not scattered seed? Well then, you should have put my money on deposit with the bankers, so that when I returned I would have received it back with interest. The point of the story is that we will be rewarded for faithful stewardship of the gifts given us. Jar said it in Message 127:..that each of us must do the best we can with what we are given...
quote:This parable isn't about equality. It's about reward. Scripture is like Newton’s third law of motionfor every action there is an equal and opposite reaction. In other words, for every biblical directive that exists, there is another scriptural mandate challenging it. -- Carlene Cross in The Bible and Newton’s Third Law of Motion
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purpledawn Member (Idle past 3457 days) Posts: 4453 From: Indiana Joined: |
quote:Whether the master's actions were right or wrong is irrelevant to the lesson of the story. quote:Doesn't sound like Jesus of the NT or Jesus as presented today? Jesus of the NT teaches of reward and punishment as jar showed in Message 153. Squander the gifts you're given and you will lose them and suffer. Scripture is like Newton’s third law of motionfor every action there is an equal and opposite reaction. In other words, for every biblical directive that exists, there is another scriptural mandate challenging it. -- Carlene Cross in The Bible and Newton’s Third Law of Motion
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purpledawn Member (Idle past 3457 days) Posts: 4453 From: Indiana Joined: |
quote:It didn't speak of repentance but it did speak of service. The kingdom of heaven is like.... A positive phrasing would be that no matter how long one serves "God" they are equal before God. No extra points for serving longer. Scripture is like Newton’s third law of motionfor every action there is an equal and opposite reaction. In other words, for every biblical directive that exists, there is another scriptural mandate challenging it. -- Carlene Cross in The Bible and Newton’s Third Law of Motion
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purpledawn Member (Idle past 3457 days) Posts: 4453 From: Indiana Joined: |
quote:Not in this parable. The parable deals with length of service, not quality. Where do you pull quality of service from? Scripture is like Newton’s third law of motionfor every action there is an equal and opposite reaction. In other words, for every biblical directive that exists, there is another scriptural mandate challenging it. -- Carlene Cross in The Bible and Newton’s Third Law of Motion
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purpledawn Member (Idle past 3457 days) Posts: 4453 From: Indiana Joined: |
quote:A parable makes one moral or religious point. The point of the Parable of the Talents deals with not squandering the gifts God has given you. What the master in the story will be held accountable for by God is not part of the parable. It isn't the point. The discourse by Jesus starting with verse 31 is not a parable. Jesus is telling them what will happen. Clearly the sheep used their gifts wisely and helped others and the goats didn't. Scripture is like Newton’s third law of motionfor every action there is an equal and opposite reaction. In other words, for every biblical directive that exists, there is another scriptural mandate challenging it. -- Carlene Cross in The Bible and Newton’s Third Law of Motion
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purpledawn Member (Idle past 3457 days) Posts: 4453 From: Indiana Joined: |
quote:Keep your parables straight. The Parable of the Fair Employer is not the same as the Parable of the Talents. The Fair Employer hires people at different times during the day, but pays them the same at the end. The Talents is about a master who leaves and gives his servants money to manage while he is gone. Don't mix your parables.
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purpledawn Member (Idle past 3457 days) Posts: 4453 From: Indiana Joined: |
quote:The parable doesn't give us that answer. Jesus was talking to Jews. quote:It is relevant whether it is a parable or not since this thread is about parables. The kingdom of heaven is like..which means the parable is a visual aid. To understand one has to have some knowledge of the Jewish beliefs of the time so that one gets the same visual, which is difficult today. Everything comes from God. If one does nothing good with what they are given, it will be taken away and they will suffer. That is what Jesus is saying with the sheep and the goats. The goats didn't use their resources (whether large or small) to help others in need.
quote:Not what either of the parables I've addressed are telling you. Parable of the Talents: Use the resources (big or small) God gave you to serve God. Usually serving God means helping others in need. Parable of the Fair Employer: No matter how long we have served God we will be equal before God. So if you are a goat and haven't used your resources (big or small) wisely by helping others in need, then you haven't been serving God so length of service is irrelevant. If you are a sheep and have been using your resources (big or small) wisely, then the length of time you have been serving doesn't gain you any more points with God. The sheep are equal before God. The discourse on the sheep and goats refers to Gentiles. When the word nation is used by itself it usually isn't including the nation of Israel. As for the parables, Jesus is teaching Jews not Gentiles. Scripture is like Newton’s third law of motionfor every action there is an equal and opposite reaction. In other words, for every biblical directive that exists, there is another scriptural mandate challenging it. -- Carlene Cross in The Bible and Newton’s Third Law of Motion
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purpledawn Member (Idle past 3457 days) Posts: 4453 From: Indiana Joined: |
quote:This is why subtitles are good, especially in a thread like this where several parables are being discussed. Message 128 is where you started discussing the Parable of the Fair Employer. I came into that discussion at Message 160.
PurpleDawn writes: It didn't speak of repentance but it did speak of service.The kingdom of heaven is like.... A positive phrasing would be that no matter how long one serves "God" they are equal before God. No extra points for serving longer. Just like the fair employer, no matter how long one worked for him that day they were paid the same. So in the kingdom of heaven, no matter how long one serves God, they are equal before God. No extra points for longer service. Scripture is like Newton’s third law of motionfor every action there is an equal and opposite reaction. In other words, for every biblical directive that exists, there is another scriptural mandate challenging it. -- Carlene Cross in The Bible and Newton’s Third Law of Motion
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purpledawn Member (Idle past 3457 days) Posts: 4453 From: Indiana Joined: |
quote:Jesus was talking to a Jewish audience. The lesson was for his audience. That doesn't mean others can't learn from the parable. Do the most with what you have and help others when you can.
quote:This isn't a general discussion about the words of Jesus. This thread is about parables. So it does make a difference. quote:Not the point of the parable. quote:The parable were for first century Jews. So Jesus told a story they would understand. It wasn't written for us to understand. quote:Then you will likely get your own moral or lesson from the story, which may or may not be what Jesus was teaching his audience. So either you want to learn about the culture to understand what was being taught or you don't care and will just make up your own lesson. Scripture is like Newton’s third law of motionfor every action there is an equal and opposite reaction. In other words, for every biblical directive that exists, there is another scriptural mandate challenging it. -- Carlene Cross in The Bible and Newton’s Third Law of Motion
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purpledawn Member (Idle past 3457 days) Posts: 4453 From: Indiana Joined: |
quote:No. Everything that Jesus supposedly said was not a parable. quote:I read and try to understand what the original audience understood. No. Scripture is like Newton’s third law of motionfor every action there is an equal and opposite reaction. In other words, for every biblical directive that exists, there is another scriptural mandate challenging it. -- Carlene Cross in The Bible and Newton’s Third Law of Motion
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