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Author Topic:   A Guide to Creationist Tactics
Bolder-dash
Member (Idle past 2081 days)
Posts: 983
From: China
Joined: 11-14-2009


Message 91 of 136 (571687)
08-01-2010 11:56 PM
Reply to: Message 89 by crashfrog
08-01-2010 11:32 PM


Re: cognitive dissonance and belief
I agree with you to a point.

I think one either believes in something, or doesn't believe in something to a certain level of certainty; but I have to allow for a third mindset-one in which people basically just say "I have no idea."

Its hard to call that thinking a belief or rejection of either. I guess it is sort of like saying I just can't decide. I suspect there are a lot of people who think like that.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 89 by crashfrog, posted 08-01-2010 11:32 PM crashfrog has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 92 by Bikerman, posted 08-02-2010 12:16 AM Bolder-dash has responded
 Message 97 by crashfrog, posted 08-02-2010 12:53 AM Bolder-dash has not yet responded

  
Bolder-dash
Member (Idle past 2081 days)
Posts: 983
From: China
Joined: 11-14-2009


Message 93 of 136 (571692)
08-02-2010 12:40 AM
Reply to: Message 92 by Bikerman
08-02-2010 12:16 AM


Re: cognitive dissonance and belief
Of course. I don't think many would argue that belief in a faith is the same as belief in things you experience with your senses. Well, some may claim that, but I don't go along with that.

However, for many its more than just an illogical, half thought out whim. It is a combination of observing the world around them, and seeing evidence for a synchronicity that goes beyond what chaos could be imagined to create, as well as an evaluation of life's experiences. A thinking person can draw conclusions of what they experience in their daily life-of consequences for our actions beyond the naturalistic means, of coincidence, and karma and externally derived insight.

Heck, you know it yourself intuitively I think-even if you don't like to admit it. The laws of nature themselves, of QM and relativity and the machine that is the universe, defy a belief in chaotic and intervention-less matter.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 92 by Bikerman, posted 08-02-2010 12:16 AM Bikerman has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 95 by Bikerman, posted 08-02-2010 12:52 AM Bolder-dash has responded
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Bolder-dash
Member (Idle past 2081 days)
Posts: 983
From: China
Joined: 11-14-2009


Message 107 of 136 (571709)
08-02-2010 1:32 AM
Reply to: Message 95 by Bikerman
08-02-2010 12:52 AM


Re: cognitive dissonance and belief
Sorry, but this is just nonsense.

I do realize you are probably young, and I have no wish to play my normal full-out game against a much weaker opponent because it troubles my international sense of fair play.

In one small paragraph you have managed to say one of the the most illogical things one could almost imagine. "QM mechanics teaches us that the world is random, and I know this because I can test it scientifically and it is repeatable every time. "

You may be having psychotic, irrational hallucinations every time you believe someone can check your work, or that you have done any work at all.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 95 by Bikerman, posted 08-02-2010 12:52 AM Bikerman has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 108 by crashfrog, posted 08-02-2010 1:34 AM Bolder-dash has responded
 Message 111 by Dr Adequate, posted 08-02-2010 1:45 AM Bolder-dash has not yet responded
 Message 112 by Bikerman, posted 08-02-2010 1:48 AM Bolder-dash has not yet responded

  
Bolder-dash
Member (Idle past 2081 days)
Posts: 983
From: China
Joined: 11-14-2009


Message 110 of 136 (571713)
08-02-2010 1:40 AM
Reply to: Message 108 by crashfrog
08-02-2010 1:34 AM


Re: cognitive dissonance and belief
If QM mechanics taught us that the world is completely random, how could you repeat a test everytime to show that was so. That is what is illogical!

Of course you need logic to understand that.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 108 by crashfrog, posted 08-02-2010 1:34 AM crashfrog has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 113 by Bolder-dash, posted 08-02-2010 1:49 AM Bolder-dash has not yet responded
 Message 114 by crashfrog, posted 08-02-2010 1:49 AM Bolder-dash has not yet responded
 Message 115 by Dr Adequate, posted 08-02-2010 1:50 AM Bolder-dash has responded

  
Bolder-dash
Member (Idle past 2081 days)
Posts: 983
From: China
Joined: 11-14-2009


Message 113 of 136 (571716)
08-02-2010 1:49 AM
Reply to: Message 110 by Bolder-dash
08-02-2010 1:40 AM


Re: cognitive dissonance and belief
I think what he probably meant to say was that QM teaches us that the particles within an atom behave randomly, and yet the world behaves predictably.

He might have a hard time understanding the distinction, even despite "knowing his game, slaughtering his last opponents, and his pro-am level of debating proficiency."


This message is a reply to:
 Message 110 by Bolder-dash, posted 08-02-2010 1:40 AM Bolder-dash has not yet responded

  
Bolder-dash
Member (Idle past 2081 days)
Posts: 983
From: China
Joined: 11-14-2009


Message 116 of 136 (571722)
08-02-2010 1:59 AM
Reply to: Message 109 by Bikerman
08-02-2010 1:39 AM


Re: cognitive dissonance and belief
The opposite of order is chaos. You don't get to tell me what chaos means-it has a universal meaning, which you don't get to decide.

The world is not chaos, precisely because we can make predictions about it.

Order has to be derived from somewhere.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 109 by Bikerman, posted 08-02-2010 1:39 AM Bikerman has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 119 by Bikerman, posted 08-02-2010 2:05 AM Bolder-dash has not yet responded
 Message 120 by crashfrog, posted 08-02-2010 2:06 AM Bolder-dash has not yet responded
 Message 121 by Dr Adequate, posted 08-02-2010 2:07 AM Bolder-dash has not yet responded
 Message 125 by Dr Jack, posted 08-02-2010 7:34 AM Bolder-dash has not yet responded

  
Bolder-dash
Member (Idle past 2081 days)
Posts: 983
From: China
Joined: 11-14-2009


Message 118 of 136 (571724)
08-02-2010 2:03 AM
Reply to: Message 115 by Dr Adequate
08-02-2010 1:50 AM


Re: cognitive dissonance and belief
That's your argument, that I can't say the mechanics of Quantum mechanics?

Wow, powerful stuff A.

Do you also debate at the same pro-am level as biker?


This message is a reply to:
 Message 115 by Dr Adequate, posted 08-02-2010 1:50 AM Dr Adequate has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 122 by Dr Adequate, posted 08-02-2010 2:09 AM Bolder-dash has not yet responded
 Message 123 by Bikerman, posted 08-02-2010 2:12 AM Bolder-dash has not yet responded

  
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