Register | Sign In


Understanding through Discussion


EvC Forum active members: 65 (9164 total)
3 online now:
Newest Member: ChatGPT
Post Volume: Total: 916,422 Year: 3,679/9,624 Month: 550/974 Week: 163/276 Day: 3/34 Hour: 0/0


Thread  Details

Email This Thread
Newer Topic | Older Topic
  
Author Topic:   Obama supports Ground Zero mosque. Religious freedom or is he being too PC?
onifre
Member (Idle past 2972 days)
Posts: 4854
From: Dark Side of the Moon
Joined: 02-20-2008


Message 106 of 406 (576115)
08-22-2010 9:03 PM
Reply to: Message 104 by jar
08-22-2010 8:59 PM


What insensitivity?
They are not sensitive to those who feel it's offensive.
I agree that they shouldn't feel offended, but then again, I also feel Muslims shouldn't be offended by us airing and image of their prophet.
Honestly, all I have seen so far from those protesting the construction is utter ignorance of the facts.
Agreed.
- Oni

This message is a reply to:
 Message 104 by jar, posted 08-22-2010 8:59 PM jar has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 107 by jar, posted 08-22-2010 9:07 PM onifre has replied
 Message 114 by crashfrog, posted 08-22-2010 9:20 PM onifre has replied

jar
Member (Idle past 415 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 107 of 406 (576116)
08-22-2010 9:07 PM
Reply to: Message 106 by onifre
08-22-2010 9:03 PM


They are not sensitive to those who feel it's offensive.
I see no indication that those building the place are insensitive. I don't see them saying that the folks that are upset should not speak out or that they don't understand that folk are upset.

Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 106 by onifre, posted 08-22-2010 9:03 PM onifre has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 108 by Coyote, posted 08-22-2010 9:10 PM jar has replied
 Message 109 by onifre, posted 08-22-2010 9:12 PM jar has replied

Coyote
Member (Idle past 2127 days)
Posts: 6117
Joined: 01-12-2008


Message 108 of 406 (576118)
08-22-2010 9:10 PM
Reply to: Message 107 by jar
08-22-2010 9:07 PM


I see no indication that those building the place are insensitive. I don't see them saying that the folks that are upset should not speak out or that they don't understand that folk are upset.
Perhaps not insensitive, just arrogant.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 107 by jar, posted 08-22-2010 9:07 PM jar has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 110 by onifre, posted 08-22-2010 9:13 PM Coyote has not replied
 Message 111 by jar, posted 08-22-2010 9:14 PM Coyote has not replied

onifre
Member (Idle past 2972 days)
Posts: 4854
From: Dark Side of the Moon
Joined: 02-20-2008


Message 109 of 406 (576120)
08-22-2010 9:12 PM
Reply to: Message 107 by jar
08-22-2010 9:07 PM


I see no indication that those building the place are insensitive. I don't see them saying that the folks that are upset should not speak out or that they don't understand that folk are upset.
But that fact that they are building regardless of how others feel is them being insensitive.
- Oni

This message is a reply to:
 Message 107 by jar, posted 08-22-2010 9:07 PM jar has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 112 by jar, posted 08-22-2010 9:15 PM onifre has replied

onifre
Member (Idle past 2972 days)
Posts: 4854
From: Dark Side of the Moon
Joined: 02-20-2008


Message 110 of 406 (576121)
08-22-2010 9:13 PM
Reply to: Message 108 by Coyote
08-22-2010 9:10 PM


Perhaps not insensitive, just arrogant.
Ok, arrogant works too.
- Oni

This message is a reply to:
 Message 108 by Coyote, posted 08-22-2010 9:10 PM Coyote has not replied

jar
Member (Idle past 415 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 111 of 406 (576122)
08-22-2010 9:14 PM
Reply to: Message 108 by Coyote
08-22-2010 9:10 PM


How is it arrogant?

Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 108 by Coyote, posted 08-22-2010 9:10 PM Coyote has not replied

jar
Member (Idle past 415 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 112 of 406 (576123)
08-22-2010 9:15 PM
Reply to: Message 109 by onifre
08-22-2010 9:12 PM


How is it insensitive?
How is it any different then all the other building that get built despite there being some opposition?

Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 109 by onifre, posted 08-22-2010 9:12 PM onifre has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 113 by onifre, posted 08-22-2010 9:19 PM jar has replied
 Message 116 by Coyote, posted 08-22-2010 9:26 PM jar has replied

onifre
Member (Idle past 2972 days)
Posts: 4854
From: Dark Side of the Moon
Joined: 02-20-2008


Message 113 of 406 (576125)
08-22-2010 9:19 PM
Reply to: Message 112 by jar
08-22-2010 9:15 PM


Because many people feel it is.
Wether or not I agree with it doesn't matter. I don't agree with Muslims that the prophet shouldn't be shown in an image. But I would be, to some extent, sensitive to their feelings and can understand not showing the image under those conditions - not for fear though.
Shouldn't they too, since the US, at least it's media, hasn't ever shown the image, extend the same courtesy?
- Oni
Edited by onifre, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 112 by jar, posted 08-22-2010 9:15 PM jar has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 115 by jar, posted 08-22-2010 9:25 PM onifre has replied
 Message 160 by Rrhain, posted 08-23-2010 5:37 PM onifre has replied

crashfrog
Member (Idle past 1488 days)
Posts: 19762
From: Silver Spring, MD
Joined: 03-20-2003


Message 114 of 406 (576126)
08-22-2010 9:20 PM
Reply to: Message 106 by onifre
08-22-2010 9:03 PM


They are not sensitive to those who feel it's offensive.
But those people are racist bigots who feel that a mosque in Temecula, California is "too close to Ground Zero." And who says they're not very sensitively saying "we understand your regrettable bigotry, but we're not going to allow it to cost us the millions of dollars it would cost to move the site?"
Why does "sensitivity" have to only mean full capitulation to bigots? I guess we can put the First Amendment along with the Second as another American right you're not such an enormous supporter of.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 106 by onifre, posted 08-22-2010 9:03 PM onifre has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 118 by onifre, posted 08-22-2010 9:31 PM crashfrog has replied

jar
Member (Idle past 415 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 115 of 406 (576128)
08-22-2010 9:25 PM
Reply to: Message 113 by onifre
08-22-2010 9:19 PM


Perhaps they should ... should what?

Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 113 by onifre, posted 08-22-2010 9:19 PM onifre has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 119 by onifre, posted 08-22-2010 9:33 PM jar has replied

Coyote
Member (Idle past 2127 days)
Posts: 6117
Joined: 01-12-2008


Message 116 of 406 (576129)
08-22-2010 9:26 PM
Reply to: Message 112 by jar
08-22-2010 9:15 PM


How is it insensitive?
How is it any different then all the other building that get built despite there being some opposition?
It's all about symbolism.
There was the symbolism of Arabs dancing in the streets when the towers were destroyed.
Now there is the symbolism of building a mosque on the same location.
Are you aware that Muslims built a mosque on the site of a Catholic church in Cordoba to celebrate the Muslim conquest of Spain? That was the same type of symbolism.
How is it that you can't see this? And are so insensitive toward those who can?

Religious belief does not constitute scientific evidence, nor does it convey scientific knowledge.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 112 by jar, posted 08-22-2010 9:15 PM jar has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 117 by jar, posted 08-22-2010 9:31 PM Coyote has not replied
 Message 162 by Rrhain, posted 08-23-2010 5:51 PM Coyote has not replied

jar
Member (Idle past 415 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 117 of 406 (576132)
08-22-2010 9:31 PM
Reply to: Message 116 by Coyote
08-22-2010 9:26 PM


Are you aware that Muslims built a mosque on the site of a Catholic church in Cordoba to celebrate the Muslim conquest of Spain?
And it is a glorious improvement.
There was the symbolism of Arabs dancing in the streets when the towers were destroyed.
And? There were also Muslims condemning the action.
How is it that you can't see this? And are so insensitive toward those who can?
I certainly can see that, but also see the absolute idiocy of conflating the people dancing in the streets with the people trying to build a civic center.

Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 116 by Coyote, posted 08-22-2010 9:26 PM Coyote has not replied

onifre
Member (Idle past 2972 days)
Posts: 4854
From: Dark Side of the Moon
Joined: 02-20-2008


Message 118 of 406 (576133)
08-22-2010 9:31 PM
Reply to: Message 114 by crashfrog
08-22-2010 9:20 PM


But those people are racist bigots
That's your opinion, and no one cares. These are their feelings, they should be respected, right? We respect the feelings of Muslims who don't want their prophet shown, they can't seem to extend the same courtesy to those who feel offended.
Those Muslims who get offended by the prophet being shown are stupid. But who cares what I think, that's how they feel and it seems (at least in the media) that we as a society play favorites.
I guess we can put the First Amendment along with the Second as another American right you're not such an enormous supporter of.
I have said that I support their right to build it and they are protected by the Constitution. I started this thread saying that I didn't care if the build a mosque on Ground Zero. Follow the debate and don't make assumptions about my position. But I am also for freedom of speech, which is something the American media has shit on when it comes to showing the prophet.
- Oni

This message is a reply to:
 Message 114 by crashfrog, posted 08-22-2010 9:20 PM crashfrog has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 121 by crashfrog, posted 08-22-2010 10:10 PM onifre has replied
 Message 163 by Rrhain, posted 08-23-2010 5:59 PM onifre has not replied

onifre
Member (Idle past 2972 days)
Posts: 4854
From: Dark Side of the Moon
Joined: 02-20-2008


Message 119 of 406 (576134)
08-22-2010 9:33 PM
Reply to: Message 115 by jar
08-22-2010 9:25 PM


Perhaps they should ... should what?
Not build the mosque, showing their sensitivity to those who are offended.
- Oni

This message is a reply to:
 Message 115 by jar, posted 08-22-2010 9:25 PM jar has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 120 by jar, posted 08-22-2010 9:36 PM onifre has not replied
 Message 122 by crashfrog, posted 08-22-2010 10:13 PM onifre has not replied

jar
Member (Idle past 415 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 120 of 406 (576137)
08-22-2010 9:36 PM
Reply to: Message 119 by onifre
08-22-2010 9:33 PM


That is something I am sure they consider. But just like all other such projects, the decision will most likely be resolved based on a financial basis.
The issue though is that under our laws they do have a right to build the civic center and those upset also have the right to protest.
It is NOT the things we like that we must protect.

Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 119 by onifre, posted 08-22-2010 9:33 PM onifre has not replied

Newer Topic | Older Topic
Jump to:


Copyright 2001-2023 by EvC Forum, All Rights Reserved

™ Version 4.2
Innovative software from Qwixotic © 2024