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Author Topic:   Landmark gay marriage trial starts today in California
Taz
Member (Idle past 3292 days)
Posts: 5069
From: Zerus
Joined: 07-18-2006


Message 136 of 759 (576997)
08-26-2010 7:25 PM
Reply to: Message 131 by nwr
08-26-2010 9:42 AM


Re: I lost respect for latino and black communities
nwr writes:
To a large extent, what you are seeing has to do with ignorance.
I'm ignorant, too, therefore I have an excuse to defy common sense and discriminate.
With all the drug and human smugling, home invasions, should begin agressively seek out people who look like illegal immigrants and check for their papers. If they are indeed illegal immigrants, they should be immediately stripped of their rights and be sent back to Mexico. And we need to expell those anchor babies, too.
If this issue ever comes up in a referandum in my state, I will vote to have those illegals captured, branded, and kicked out.
If they want to use ignorance as an excuse to discriminate, then I'll play this same game as well.
I am not sure why you find that a surprise, nor why you find that a problem.
I'd be lying if I say I find it surprising, since I've known for a long time that those browns and blacks have double standards. On the one hand, they demand equality, but on the other they demand to be able to discriminate against others. They need to learn respect for other people, because they just lost me as their ally.
Edited by Taz, : No reason given.
Edited by Taz, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 131 by nwr, posted 08-26-2010 9:42 AM nwr has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 138 by nwr, posted 08-26-2010 8:55 PM Taz has replied
 Message 178 by Hyroglyphx, posted 08-31-2010 9:23 AM Taz has not replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 412 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 137 of 759 (577004)
08-26-2010 8:04 PM
Reply to: Message 135 by Taz
08-26-2010 7:18 PM


Re: I lost respect for latino and black communities
Taz writes:
You people have spent the last year trying to convince me there's no such thing as race.
Exactly. People who have been discriminated against are not immune to discriminating against other people.
Taz writes:
I said latino and black communities. In other words, if 70-80% of their members support something, I think it's safe to say their community supports it.
I'm not disputing that. I'm disputing your claim that those communities have "no excuse" for discriminating against gays. They have the same excuse as anybody else, even if you don't like it.

Life is like a Hot Wheels car. Sometimes it goes behind the couch and you can't find it.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 135 by Taz, posted 08-26-2010 7:18 PM Taz has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 140 by Taz, posted 08-26-2010 10:30 PM ringo has replied

  
nwr
Member
Posts: 6408
From: Geneva, Illinois
Joined: 08-08-2005
Member Rating: 5.1


Message 138 of 759 (577012)
08-26-2010 8:55 PM
Reply to: Message 136 by Taz
08-26-2010 7:25 PM


Re: I lost respect for latino and black communities
Taz writes:
If they want to use ignorance as an excuse to discriminate, then I'll play this same game as well.
The problem with that argument, is that this is not the kind of simple discrimination issue that you make it out to be. Rather, there are underlying conceptual issues.
The gay community has run a pretty effective grass roots campaign to persuade people to change how they look at the issue. Clearly that campaign has not been as effective in the black and latino communities. Perhaps the gay activists themselves have failed to adequately engage the black and latino communities.
I can understand your being disappointed by the reaction of those communities. But I think you over reacting.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 136 by Taz, posted 08-26-2010 7:25 PM Taz has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 139 by Taz, posted 08-26-2010 10:24 PM nwr has seen this message but not replied

  
Taz
Member (Idle past 3292 days)
Posts: 5069
From: Zerus
Joined: 07-18-2006


Message 139 of 759 (577026)
08-26-2010 10:24 PM
Reply to: Message 138 by nwr
08-26-2010 8:55 PM


Re: I lost respect for latino and black communities
nwr writes:
But I think you over reacting.
I gave up political correctness a long time ago. I say we give them a taste of their own medicine. If they want to discriminate, we'll simply discriminate against them.
I say the same thing should apply to christians as well. If they don't want muslims to build mosques, we should burn down their churches as well.
Nothing is more effective in dealing with discrimination than to give them a taste of their own medicine.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 138 by nwr, posted 08-26-2010 8:55 PM nwr has seen this message but not replied

  
Taz
Member (Idle past 3292 days)
Posts: 5069
From: Zerus
Joined: 07-18-2006


Message 140 of 759 (577028)
08-26-2010 10:30 PM
Reply to: Message 137 by ringo
08-26-2010 8:04 PM


Re: I lost respect for latino and black communities
ringo writes:
I'm not disputing that. I'm disputing your claim that those communities have "no excuse" for discriminating against gays. They have the same excuse as anybody else, even if you don't like it.
No, they don't have any excuse at all since they themselves have been the subject of discrimination for a long long time now. At least it's been generations since the whities (especially the protestant males) have had to deal with discrimination bullshit. But we're talking about communities that have been outright discriminated against for generations.
Just the other day, I was listening to NPR and I heard the most outrageous thing. They were interviewing a Polish man who was protesting against the judge's deicision. He said that he suffered under the communist regime and now when he came to America he couldn't find any freedom either. Um... the freedom to discriminate against other people? What a load of bollocks.
I've had enough of this political correctness bullshit. I say we kick all those immigrants out and let us natural borns deal with our own problems. They escaped from authoritarian regimes to come here just so they could persecute others? What kind of bullshit logic is that?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 137 by ringo, posted 08-26-2010 8:04 PM ringo has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 141 by ringo, posted 08-27-2010 12:17 AM Taz has replied
 Message 143 by lfen, posted 08-27-2010 1:09 AM Taz has replied
 Message 156 by Dr Adequate, posted 08-27-2010 10:30 AM Taz has not replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 412 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 141 of 759 (577042)
08-27-2010 12:17 AM
Reply to: Message 140 by Taz
08-26-2010 10:30 PM


Re: I lost respect for latino and black communities
Taz writes:
They escaped from authoritarian regimes to come here just so they could persecute others?
Blacks, latinos and Poles all have the same right to be human as anybody else. If you lost respect, it wasn't for the people but for some unrealistic ideal. If you expect them to be holier than thou because of their past history, they can probably do without your respect.

Life is like a Hot Wheels car. Sometimes it goes behind the couch and you can't find it.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 140 by Taz, posted 08-26-2010 10:30 PM Taz has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 142 by Taz, posted 08-27-2010 1:08 AM ringo has replied

  
Taz
Member (Idle past 3292 days)
Posts: 5069
From: Zerus
Joined: 07-18-2006


Message 142 of 759 (577049)
08-27-2010 1:08 AM
Reply to: Message 141 by ringo
08-27-2010 12:17 AM


Re: I lost respect for latino and black communities
ringo writes:
If you expect them to be holier than thou because of their past history, they can probably do without your respect.
Fine. I'm totally voting against them if the issue ever comes up in my state. If they don't come out holier than thou after what they've been through, then that tells me they're not worth the effort to communicate.
I've said several times that I have my own demons to fight. I do have racist tendencies. It's written quite deeply into my subconscious. All I have to do is let go of the logical part of me that controls my racist tendencies and voila they've got another hick going against them. And since they don't seem to try too hard to overcome their prejudices, I don't see any reason why I should be better than them.
I hope you realize I'm not just talking about gay rights. This is beyond that. And frankly, 70-80% of them have proven they've learned nothing from all the discrimination they've suffered. So, they can go ahead and eat their tacos and fried chicken all they want.
As if the ultra-conservative hicks weren't enough. Now, we got 70-80% of the minorities to worry about as well.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 141 by ringo, posted 08-27-2010 12:17 AM ringo has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 146 by ringo, posted 08-27-2010 2:27 AM Taz has replied

  
lfen
Member (Idle past 4678 days)
Posts: 2189
From: Oregon
Joined: 06-24-2004


(1)
Message 143 of 759 (577051)
08-27-2010 1:09 AM
Reply to: Message 140 by Taz
08-26-2010 10:30 PM


Re: I lost respect for latino and black communities
Taz writes:
I've had enough of this political correctness bullshit. I say we kick all those immigrants out and let us natural borns deal with our own problems. They escaped from authoritarian regimes to come here just so they could persecute others? What kind of bullshit logic is that?
I agree with you. You are native American? I support your efforts to drive all the European thieves and murders back to England and the other the Imperialist countries that have made such a polluted shambles of this once pristine continent and committed genocide against the rightful inhabitants. I'm sick of all the evil white Europeans desecrating the earth. Let them despoil Europe and fight among themselves but leave the rest of the world alone.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 140 by Taz, posted 08-26-2010 10:30 PM Taz has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 144 by Taz, posted 08-27-2010 1:18 AM lfen has replied
 Message 150 by Hyroglyphx, posted 08-27-2010 9:57 AM lfen has replied

  
Taz
Member (Idle past 3292 days)
Posts: 5069
From: Zerus
Joined: 07-18-2006


Message 144 of 759 (577053)
08-27-2010 1:18 AM
Reply to: Message 143 by lfen
08-27-2010 1:09 AM


Re: I lost respect for latino and black communities
I said natural born, I didn't say the original migrants. Beside, if you want to go that far back, then sure we'll go back to Europe and those "native" Americans could go back to Asia.
Go ahead and defend those persecuted-turned-persecutor minorities all you want. I realize in a couple days my ratings will probably go down to 1. That's what happens in a world of political correctness when no matter how much bullshit you see you always have to talk nice to them. Hell, they could be voting by the masses to turn this country into their catholic theocratic haven and it would still be politically incorrect to call it bullshit.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 143 by lfen, posted 08-27-2010 1:09 AM lfen has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 145 by lfen, posted 08-27-2010 1:34 AM Taz has replied
 Message 151 by Hyroglyphx, posted 08-27-2010 10:02 AM Taz has not replied

  
lfen
Member (Idle past 4678 days)
Posts: 2189
From: Oregon
Joined: 06-24-2004


Message 145 of 759 (577058)
08-27-2010 1:34 AM
Reply to: Message 144 by Taz
08-27-2010 1:18 AM


Re: I lost respect for latino and black communities
You believe you are being persecuted? You are a victim of what? Please be specific.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 144 by Taz, posted 08-27-2010 1:18 AM Taz has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 147 by Taz, posted 08-27-2010 9:18 AM lfen has not replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 412 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 146 of 759 (577067)
08-27-2010 2:27 AM
Reply to: Message 142 by Taz
08-27-2010 1:08 AM


Re: I lost respect for latino and black communities
Taz writes:
And since they don't seem to try too hard to overcome their prejudices, I don't see any reason why I should be better than them.
*shrug* Self-respect?

Life is like a Hot Wheels car. Sometimes it goes behind the couch and you can't find it.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 142 by Taz, posted 08-27-2010 1:08 AM Taz has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 148 by Taz, posted 08-27-2010 9:25 AM ringo has replied

  
Taz
Member (Idle past 3292 days)
Posts: 5069
From: Zerus
Joined: 07-18-2006


Message 147 of 759 (577124)
08-27-2010 9:18 AM
Reply to: Message 145 by lfen
08-27-2010 1:34 AM


Re: I lost respect for latino and black communities
lfen writes:
You believe you are being persecuted? You are a victim of what? Please be specific.
Oh, don't get me wrong. I'm doing just fine. But since I have a brain, I can tell when people's logic are bullshit.
"I came from the old soviet union where people had no freedom. Now, I came to the US and I still have no freedom." This came from a polish man protesting against the judge's decision on the unconstitutionality of prop 8.
Again, I have a brain. I don't need to be within the group that is discriminated against to see the bullshitness in that guy's words.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 145 by lfen, posted 08-27-2010 1:34 AM lfen has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 153 by Hyroglyphx, posted 08-27-2010 10:07 AM Taz has replied

  
Taz
Member (Idle past 3292 days)
Posts: 5069
From: Zerus
Joined: 07-18-2006


Message 148 of 759 (577130)
08-27-2010 9:25 AM
Reply to: Message 146 by ringo
08-27-2010 2:27 AM


Re: I lost respect for latino and black communities
ringo writes:
*shrug* Self-respect?
*shrug*
Well, deep down in my subconscious I have racist tendencies. I am not and don't pretend to be some enlightened individual. And about the self-respect, I guess I don't have any. I'll give you a hint. I would have been much happier back in school to have learned that after the nazis surrendered every person who had ever had a nazi uniform on was put in concentration camps and gassed to death... or at least be fed to their own dogs.
Because of our politically correct world, that son of a bitch pol pot never faced any real trial or consequence. And because of our politically correct world, genocidal campaigns are allowed to be rampant for months before anyone lifted a finger to stop them. And even then, most of those who participated in the mass rape, torture, and murder never faced any real consequence. Nowadays, it seems like it's better to be the bad guys because the good guys are too busy trying to be politically correct to get anything done against the bad guys.
But more to the point. I've no respect for those that think they can discriminate against people and then expect the rest of us not to discriminate them. It's bullshit, and you know it. They want to discriminate against the gheys? Well, we'll just ship them back to mexico and they can discriminate their own gheys.
Edited by Taz, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 146 by ringo, posted 08-27-2010 2:27 AM ringo has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 149 by Artemis Entreri, posted 08-27-2010 9:55 AM Taz has not replied
 Message 157 by ringo, posted 08-27-2010 11:15 AM Taz has not replied
 Message 158 by Theodoric, posted 08-27-2010 12:20 PM Taz has replied

  
Artemis Entreri 
Suspended Member (Idle past 4229 days)
Posts: 1194
From: Northern Virginia
Joined: 07-08-2008


Message 149 of 759 (577136)
08-27-2010 9:55 AM
Reply to: Message 148 by Taz
08-27-2010 9:25 AM


Re: I lost respect for latino and black communities
are you equating people who are against the judge's desicion on prop 8 to genocidial dictators? I hope not, cause that would be funny logic on your part.
Well, we'll just ship them back to mexico and they can discriminate their own gheys.
The Mexicans and Mexican Americans have been in California since California WAS part of Mexico. Now if you want to give California back to Mexico, then I may agree with you, but shipping people who have lived in the area for hundreds of years, to a land to the south because the current land was stolen from the nation to the south seems a bit odd, especially after all these years.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 148 by Taz, posted 08-27-2010 9:25 AM Taz has not replied

  
Hyroglyphx
Inactive Member


Message 150 of 759 (577137)
08-27-2010 9:57 AM
Reply to: Message 143 by lfen
08-27-2010 1:09 AM


Re: I lost respect for latino and black communities
I agree with you. You are native American? I support your efforts to drive all the European thieves and murders back to England and the other the Imperialist countries that have made such a polluted shambles of this once pristine continent and committed genocide against the rightful inhabitants. I'm sick of all the evil white Europeans desecrating the earth. Let them despoil Europe and fight among themselves but leave the rest of the world alone.
Taz writes:
I've had enough of this political correctness bullshit. I say we kick all those immigrants out and let us natural borns deal with our own problems. They escaped from authoritarian regimes to come here just so they could persecute others? What kind of bullshit logic is that?
I agree with you. You are native American? I support your efforts to drive all the European thieves and murders back to England and the other the Imperialist countries that have made such a polluted shambles of this once pristine continent and committed genocide against the rightful inhabitants. I'm sick of all the evil white Europeans desecrating the earth. Let them despoil Europe and fight among themselves but leave the rest of the world alone.
So you want to combat racism and bigotry by adding more racism and bigotry?

"Reason obeys itself; and ignorance submits to whatever is dictated to it" -- Thomas Paine

This message is a reply to:
 Message 143 by lfen, posted 08-27-2010 1:09 AM lfen has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 155 by Dr Adequate, posted 08-27-2010 10:15 AM Hyroglyphx has not replied
 Message 165 by lfen, posted 08-27-2010 8:44 PM Hyroglyphx has not replied

  
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