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Author Topic:   Creationism in Schools
quicksink
Inactive Member


Message 1 of 116 (4540)
02-15-2002 4:22 AM


Creaitonism is schools is a direct violation of the constitution.
need i say more?
let's start a discussion. I'd like to hear from someone who DOES NOT believe that it is not a violation...
thank you

Replies to this message:
 Message 50 by bkwusa, posted 02-18-2002 10:10 PM quicksink has not replied

  
quicksink
Inactive Member


Message 2 of 116 (4541)
02-15-2002 4:25 AM


correction:
i'd like to hear from someone who DOES NOT believe that it IS a violation of the constitution
basically- someone who thinks it is right to put it in schools
Creationism is religious. it is based on the bible, which is religious. it is belived in by ONLY CHRISTIANS. no non-christians believe in creationism. Actually, by believing in creationism, you ARE christian. A non-christian creationist is an oxymoron (right?)

Replies to this message:
 Message 3 by Peter, posted 02-15-2002 6:16 AM quicksink has not replied
 Message 7 by TrueCreation, posted 02-16-2002 2:23 PM quicksink has not replied

  
quicksink
Inactive Member


Message 4 of 116 (4554)
02-15-2002 6:55 AM


In the Us, it is illegal to teach religion scripture has scripture. If creationism was a better theory than evo, then it would be taught in schools, as it would not be only religious, but also highly credible and therefore the closest to the truth about our origins.
if this happened, which never will, we would see mass conversions to christianity.
Not yet.

Replies to this message:
 Message 5 by toff, posted 02-15-2002 7:41 AM quicksink has not replied
 Message 8 by KingPenguin, posted 02-16-2002 3:32 PM quicksink has not replied
 Message 9 by TrueCreation, posted 02-16-2002 3:34 PM quicksink has not replied

  
quicksink
Inactive Member


Message 6 of 116 (4559)
02-15-2002 8:01 AM


oN SECOND THOUGHT- i concur. It's true that if creationism had been proved more correct than any other theory, it would be used.
The problem with teaching it now is that there isn't a reason to. It violates the constitution and is not a credible and respected theory.

  
quicksink
Inactive Member


Message 23 of 116 (4788)
02-16-2002 8:51 PM


TC- I would like to remind that you have admitted or even endorsed evolution when you said that fish could have evolved to tolerate fresh or salt water.
From here on out, I think you now have to argue that evolution is possible, but didn't happen because the Bible doesn't say so, or something like that.
I's also like to remind you that you distinctly told me that you do not take the bible literally (all of it literally). So may I ask you who determines what should be taken literally and what not.
Things with evidence?
Maybe you recall that in the Bible it says the doors in the sky opened and the rain came through.
Should this be taken literally?

Replies to this message:
 Message 24 by TrueCreation, posted 02-16-2002 9:02 PM quicksink has not replied

  
quicksink
Inactive Member


Message 80 of 116 (5795)
02-28-2002 10:18 AM


The issue is cut and dry. Creationism depends on the existence of god, and His existence is untestable. therefore, one must have faith in his existence.
If creationism is a faith-held belief, it is religious, and furthermore unscientific.
this is important because
a) it is unconstitutional to teach religious faiths and beliefs in a literal sensein public institutions
and
b) because creationism is based on faith and not science, it cannot be taught as such.
What do you tell the Muslim who claims the Qu'ran is historically accurate and the Bible is false? Do you tell him that America is Christian, and if you don't like that, tough?
no
if this Muclim is a law-abiding, tax-paying citizen, he is entitled to the same rights as any white historian. He is also considered a legal American, a Muslim American I might add.
To teach creationism as fact in public institutions would define America/americans as Christian... what do you say to that Muslim American now? And the Jew... And the Chinese, Korean, Atheist, African, etc, etc, etc.
The US and its citizens are not defined by the religion they practice. That is layed down in the constitution. Any American is entitled to his right to freeely practice his or her relgion. ANY AMERICAN...
It is quite simple, or at least to the rational person...

  
quicksink
Inactive Member


Message 81 of 116 (5797)
02-28-2002 10:19 AM


I simply don't see how someone could argue that a religion should be taught in a public school as fact... it is really beyond me...

  
quicksink
Inactive Member


Message 82 of 116 (5799)
02-28-2002 10:26 AM


quote:
hmmm i am a chritian... i do not belive in evolution... therefore if you teach one but not the other you have disfranchised my belive which is protected by the constitution...
teach bothe or noe!
LOL!!! You are not entitled to the right to practice your religious beliefs in public institutions. you can do so in a church or private school, but not in a public school...
evolution is not taught because people believe in it... it is taught because anyone of any faith can believe in it... if you choose not to... tough... but don't make children (like me) have to learn your stiffling and faith-held beliefs in sdience... keep religion where it belongs- chruch...

  
quicksink
Inactive Member


Message 83 of 116 (5801)
02-28-2002 10:39 AM


quote:
ummm first amendment of the constitution: "Congress shall make no laws respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or....."
it all depends on how you interpert these few words...
evolution is a scientific theory... so was neptunism at it's time... so was cathastrophianism...
i know i know the last two were proven wrong beyond a doubth... but how do we know evolution won't be proven worng?
if evolution is disproved, then science will find a new theory... until then, we're gonna teach evolution...
as for interpreting the constitution, well, there is no room for interpreting the first amendment, per se.
"or prohibiting the free exercise thereof;"
I suppose you were refering to this statement... this is not open to interpretation... it means quite plainly that the government may not restrict the PRIVATE practice of religion, but may restrict religious groups from teaching religious faiths in PUBLIC institutions. put simply, religious groups are NOT free to practice their religions in publicly funded institutions.
sing and pray your heart away, but do so in a proper and private institution.

  
quicksink
Inactive Member


Message 104 of 116 (6283)
03-08-2002 3:39 AM
Reply to: Message 103 by Theo
03-08-2002 3:30 AM


theo- do you believe that creationism should be taught in schools?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 103 by Theo, posted 03-08-2002 3:30 AM Theo has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 105 by Theo, posted 03-08-2002 3:54 AM quicksink has not replied

  
quicksink
Inactive Member


Message 115 of 116 (6308)
03-08-2002 8:44 AM


ok theo
you have stated that creationism is a science. now go into the following threads
"questions"
"animals on the ark"
answer each and every question.
please so not give the predicatable excuse- "i don't know, i haven't studied that" or "i don't know enough about that to give you an answer"
if you don't have an answer find one...
i'll keep pushing this until you give an answer.

Replies to this message:
 Message 116 by TrueCreation, posted 03-09-2002 1:20 AM quicksink has not replied

  
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