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Author Topic:   Eternal Life (thanks, but no thanks)
Coyote
Member (Idle past 2127 days)
Posts: 6117
Joined: 01-12-2008


Message 163 of 296 (586974)
10-15-2010 11:05 PM
Reply to: Message 162 by Buzsaw
10-15-2010 10:51 PM


Eternal Life...
The promise of an afterlife is the biggest blank check ever written, and it is written by shamans of all stripes.
They sell what people desperately want for a promise to be kept later.
And because people desperately want what they are selling they can get away with anything.
And to seal the deal, shamans have made up the "or else" of hell.
Too bad the truth in lending and consumer protection laws don't apply. There would be a lot fewer shamans running the streets looking for their next victims.

Religious belief does not constitute scientific evidence, nor does it convey scientific knowledge.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 162 by Buzsaw, posted 10-15-2010 10:51 PM Buzsaw has not replied

  
Coyote
Member (Idle past 2127 days)
Posts: 6117
Joined: 01-12-2008


(1)
Message 183 of 296 (587037)
10-16-2010 1:28 PM
Reply to: Message 182 by ringo
10-16-2010 12:49 PM


Re: Questions regarding eternity
Lo, the poor Indian! whose untutor'd mind
Sees God in clouds, or hears him in the wind;
His soul proud Science never taught to stray
Far as the solar walk or milky way;
Yet simple nature to his hope has giv'n,
Behind the cloud-topt hill, an humbler Heav'n,
Some safer world in depth of woods embraced,
Some happier island in the wat'ry waste,
Where slaves once more their native land behold,
No fiends torment, no Christians thirst for gold.
To be, contents his natural desire;
He asks no Angel's wing, no Seraph's fire;
But thinks, admitted to that equal sky,
His faithful dog shall bear him company.
From Alexander Pope's Essay on Man

This message is a reply to:
 Message 182 by ringo, posted 10-16-2010 12:49 PM ringo has seen this message but not replied

  
Coyote
Member (Idle past 2127 days)
Posts: 6117
Joined: 01-12-2008


Message 272 of 296 (596622)
12-15-2010 10:42 PM
Reply to: Message 270 by Just being real
12-15-2010 10:23 PM


Eternal life and other fantasies
Likewise now it is not revealed to us what we shall be like, but we know that when He appears we shall be like Him. And it has not even entered into the most wildest imaginations of man, what it shall be like when we are there. We know it shall be glorious beyond all comprehension.
Now there's the problem. That's the type of promise that a snake oil or used car salesman would be embarrassed to utter, yet shamans of all stripes proclaim it without the least hesitation -- or evidence.
"Pay me now, and you'll get your reward in heaven!"
Why should anyone believe a word of it?
If they weren't selling a commodity that people desperately want to have (or think they are getting), those shamans would have been run out of town on a rail hundreds of thousands of years ago when they first started claiming to be able to intercede with the "gods" -- for a price.
Maybe it is time for those shamans to "put up or shut up," eh?

Religious belief does not constitute scientific evidence, nor does it convey scientific knowledge.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 270 by Just being real, posted 12-15-2010 10:23 PM Just being real has not replied

  
Coyote
Member (Idle past 2127 days)
Posts: 6117
Joined: 01-12-2008


Message 274 of 296 (596628)
12-15-2010 11:55 PM
Reply to: Message 273 by Omnivorous
12-15-2010 11:21 PM


Re: What is 'science of the gaps'?
A rational man starting without preconceived notions would soon believe in the natural world he inhabits. Whether or not he concludes there is an unseen world, he can see that the natural world's existence is indisputable; he can see that the natural world operates by laws that have applied for time out of mind without exception; he can see that claims about exceptions to those natural laws, religious or otherwise, evaporate under the light of close scrutiny. He can see no ready evidence for any other, unseen world. He considers the above, and posits that there is no world but the natural one, and science is its handmaiden. He has observed clearly and reasoned well to determine that "it's only natural" is a strong, evidence-based theory.
You, however, in the same world and with the same evidence, conclude there is also an unseen world. You have not seen it; you have no evidence for its existence. Indeed, you insist on the importance of maintaining this belief (faith) in the absence of evidence.
Following up on my previous post:
There are those who will offer to sell folks "eternal life" with no evidence whatsoever that they can provide it, and -- given the alternative -- there are a lot of folks willing to buy into that notion.
It is certainly the oldest con game in history.
But that con has provided a living for shamans for a couple of hundred thousand years, and shows no sign of yielding to rationalism no matter how many advances science makes.

Religious belief does not constitute scientific evidence, nor does it convey scientific knowledge.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 273 by Omnivorous, posted 12-15-2010 11:21 PM Omnivorous has seen this message but not replied

  
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