The Flood, fossils, & the geologic evidence

Chuck, from a creationist POV, two things:

The credibility of the Biblical record depends heavily on how researchers interpret what is observed.So Chuck, what I'm saying is, don't get snowed under by flood skeptics without consideration of the above. I suggest you go to some of the archived flood threads where some of these things have been debated, bearing in mind that creationists may have been limited some in science forums, creationism not being accepted as valid science for science forum airing. ABE: To answer your question as to where the flood layer is, it's rather random, due to the sudden catastrophic breakup of it due to erosion, uplift, volcanic action, tsunamis, etc. Much of the tectonic and other activity would have continued after the rains stopped and even after they receeded. The activity would have tapered off rather gradually, post flood, due to the unstable condition of the newly formed earth crust.

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For what it's worth, regarding the Great Flood, Psalms 104:8 ASV:

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quote:

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The mountains rose, the valleys sank down) Unto the place which thou hadst founded for them.

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Edited by Buzsaw, : No reason given.Edited by Buzsaw, : Add color so as to draw attention to the edit

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BUZSAW B 4 U 2 C Y BUZ SAW.
The Immeasurable Present Eternally Extends the Infinite Past And Infinitely Consumes The Eternal Future.

I'd like to point out that Buz has Never substantiated this claim.

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It's not enough to bash in heads, you've got to bash in minds
soon I discovered that this rock thing was true
Jerry Lee Lewis was the devil
Jesus was an architect previous to his career as a prophet
All of a sudden i found myself in love with the world
And so there was only one thing I could do
Was ding a ding dang my dang along ling long - Jesus Built my Hotrod Ministry
Live every week like it's Shark Week! - Tracey Jordan
Just a monkey in a long line of kings. - Matthew Good
If "elitist" just means "not the dumbest motherfucker in the room", I'll be an elitist! - Get Your War On
*not an actual doctor

What is even funnier, we actually have samples of the atmosphere from long before the imagined Biblical Flood that show there is almost no differences, samples from amber, from ice cores, from inside rock, from chemical reactions.Buz has been told all this many times but simply continues to post total falsehoods.

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Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!

Assuming your conventional criteria and discounting the criteria alluded to above, that is.

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BUZSAW B 4 U 2 C Y BUZ SAW.
The Immeasurable Present Eternally Extends the Infinite Past And Infinitely Consumes The Eternal Future.

No Buz, once again what you post is simply another falsehood.It is NOT assuming anything.The Biblical Flood has been totally refuted as you have been shown repeatedly.The air bubbles caught in ice have been sampled and found to be not much different than today.Specimens like Oetzi who would have been contemporary with Adam show that nothing was much different.Your claims are simply repeated falsehoods.

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Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!

Buz, have you any comments on my post above, or are you just going to ignore the inconvenient evidence I posted?Or will you just deny it?What would probably be most appropriate would be for you to present evidence that my post is incorrect.Posting that your belief contradicts it is not sufficient for inquiring minds. We like to see evidence, not dogma.Have any evidence?

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Religious belief does not constitute scientific evidence, nor does it convey scientific knowledge.

This is what people are asking about, Buz. You have never provided any explanation of how rain and flooding can somehow alter the atomic structure of matter. Never mind providing evidence that such an alteration of reality ever happened. I'd like to just see the explanation, even if there's no evidence to support it.Whether or not you realize it, what you're really saying, when you say that we can't make any assumptions about the pre-Flood world because the Flood somehow altered the atmosphere, is that rainwater has the magical power to alter the nature of matter itself. The only real "assumption" that the dating methods you don't believe in are making is that the carbon, oxygen, hydrogen, etc. that we see today is the same thing as carbon, oxygen, hydrogen of 10,000 years ago, or 2 million years ago, or even 10 billion years ago.I for one think that that's a pretty safe assumption to make.

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Your beliefs do not effect reality and evidently reality does not effect your beliefs.
-Theodoric

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Reality has a well-known liberal bias.
-Steven Colbert

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I never meant to say that the Conservatives are generally stupid. I meant to say that stupid people are generally Conservative. I believe that is so obviously and universally admitted a principle that I hardly think any gentleman will deny it.
- John Stuart Mill

I think the following is probably their "standard geologic column": SourceA way more detailed version can be found here:
Geologic time scale - WikipediaThese are not rock columns (stratigraphic sections) . There are no rock types or thicknesses mentioned. It is a timeline.Moose

But how do would these hypothetical events effect dating of moon rocks and meteorites, which have ages which correlate very well with the oldest terrestrial samples?

Arguably they're not a good example of what creationists should be looking for, since they were caused by a natural dam breaking and a sheet of water sweeping laterally across the landscape.The question is, what results would Noah's flood have had if it had happened? I think not very much (in geological terms, biogeography is a whole other question).

Hi Boof. Welcome to EvC town. Most know my unique position on the age of the sun and moon. It is that the Biblical record does not give a time line for the age of the celestial bodies or the earth. The only time line indicated is for things created after day four.--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

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BUZSAW B 4 U 2 C Y BUZ SAW.
The Immeasurable Present Eternally Extends the Infinite Past And Infinitely Consumes The Eternal Future.

Zen, my position has never been that the rain or flood skewed the dating. It has always been that the implications of the make-up of the pre-flood planet and atmosphere would be the reason for skewing the conclusions reached via research methodology of conventional science.

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BUZSAW B 4 U 2 C Y BUZ SAW.
The Immeasurable Present Eternally Extends the Infinite Past And Infinitely Consumes The Eternal Future.

Which is another claim you have never substantiated. You have provided no evidence that the "pre-flood" world was any different from the current. Nor have you ever been able to explain what would cause all the dating methodologies to be incorrect and yet still agree wit heach other.

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It's not enough to bash in heads, you've got to bash in minds
soon I discovered that this rock thing was true
Jerry Lee Lewis was the devil
Jesus was an architect previous to his career as a prophet
All of a sudden i found myself in love with the world
And so there was only one thing I could do
Was ding a ding dang my dang along ling long - Jesus Built my Hotrod Ministry
Live every week like it's Shark Week! - Tracey Jordan
Just a monkey in a long line of kings. - Matthew Good
If "elitist" just means "not the dumbest motherfucker in the room", I'll be an elitist! - Get Your War On
*not an actual doctor

So your thesis is that the moon and the asteroids (and presumably most of the other bodies of our sloar system) were created significantly before earth (billions of years?), and that the atmospheric conditions of a much younger earth somehow modified the dates from all known dating methods to coincidentally match those from the moon etc?God must be ROFLing!Edited by Boof, : Changed 'the flood' to 'atmospheric conditions' as per Buzsaw model

I got a "Great Debate" with Buz, vaguely plodding along at What variety of creationist is Buzsaw? (Minnemooseus and Buzsaw only).I could there use a reply from Buz.Moose

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Professor, geology, Whatsamatta U
Evolution - Changes in the environment, caused by the interactions of the components of the environment.

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"Do not meddle in the affairs of cats, for they are subtle and will piss on your computer." - Bruce Graham

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"The modern conservative is engaged in one of man's oldest exercises in moral philosophy; that is, the search for a superior moral justification for selfishness." - John Kenneth Galbraith

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"I know a little about a lot of things, and a lot about a few things, but I'm highly ignorant about everything." - Moose