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Author Topic:   Who designed the ID designer(s)?
Theodoric
Member
Posts: 6500
From: Northwest, WI, USA
Joined: 08-15-2005
Member Rating: 3.4


Message 123 of 396 (499688)
02-19-2009 7:30 PM
Reply to: Message 122 by onifre
02-19-2009 5:47 PM


Re: Just a bump
I doubt Bertot will even show up to debate here.

Well maybe just to spite me.


Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts.
This message is a reply to:
 Message 122 by onifre, posted 02-19-2009 5:47 PM onifre has not yet responded

    
Theodoric
Member
Posts: 6500
From: Northwest, WI, USA
Joined: 08-15-2005
Member Rating: 3.4


Message 186 of 396 (616683)
05-23-2011 11:24 PM
Reply to: Message 185 by intellen
05-23-2011 11:06 PM


Re: A form of faith
I do not watch crap on youtube. Either present your case here or acknowledge you have nothing. We do not debate links here.

You might want to acquaint yourself with the forum rules

Look at rule 5

quote:
Bare links with no supporting discussion should be avoided. Make the argument in your own words and use links as supporting references.

In other words if you can't make the argument in your own words it ain't shit and doesn't belong here.

Oh yeah
Welcome to EVC


Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts
This message is a reply to:
 Message 185 by intellen, posted 05-23-2011 11:06 PM intellen has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 187 by intellen, posted 05-23-2011 11:52 PM Theodoric has responded

    
Theodoric
Member
Posts: 6500
From: Northwest, WI, USA
Joined: 08-15-2005
Member Rating: 3.4


Message 194 of 396 (616733)
05-24-2011 9:50 AM
Reply to: Message 187 by intellen
05-23-2011 11:52 PM


Re: A form of faith
If you have time, see them in private.

As I said I don't watch youtube crap.

So far this is what we have found out about you. You can give links to youtube and you can cut and paste. How about giving us the source for this cut and paste so we can see it in all its context. This little snippet is extremely incoherent and is nothing but unevidenced assertions.


Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts
This message is a reply to:
 Message 187 by intellen, posted 05-23-2011 11:52 PM intellen has not yet responded

    
Theodoric
Member
Posts: 6500
From: Northwest, WI, USA
Joined: 08-15-2005
Member Rating: 3.4


Message 325 of 396 (621890)
06-29-2011 12:50 PM
Reply to: Message 324 by New Cat's Eye
06-29-2011 11:33 AM


Re: Still a form of faith & restatement of topic
Do you accept that it is possible for someone to arrive at ID without faith?

That would mean they have evidence. Which as of yet no one has provided.

So no they can not arrive at ID without faith.


Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts
This message is a reply to:
 Message 324 by New Cat's Eye, posted 06-29-2011 11:33 AM New Cat's Eye has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 326 by New Cat's Eye, posted 06-29-2011 1:02 PM Theodoric has responded

    
Theodoric
Member
Posts: 6500
From: Northwest, WI, USA
Joined: 08-15-2005
Member Rating: 3.4


Message 327 of 396 (621933)
06-29-2011 4:37 PM
Reply to: Message 326 by New Cat's Eye
06-29-2011 1:02 PM


Re: Still a form of faith & restatement of topic
First of all .

Go screw yourself. If you do not want to have an honest debate with me, ignore me.

Your whole premise is ridiculous. You might as well ask if it is possible for someone to come to an irrational belief without it being irrational if there is any chance there might be some sort of evidence in the future.

How the hell can you qualify your first statement with the second and still expect the first to have any meaning?

Can you try some honest debate instead of making personal attacks against people that do not agree with you?

They have provided the evidence. We've seen it here where people have expressed that when they see all the beauty in the world they are convinced that it must have been designed. That is their evidence and they are comming to a conclusion. That is not a position of faith.

Bullshit. It is a statement of faith.

You are equivocating the word evidence. Give the definition you are using. Because it certainly isn't a scientific definition of the word evidence. Their evidence is faith.

That you don't consider that to be good evidnce doesn't undermine the fact that they are not reaching their position through faith.

More bullshit and equivocating.


Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts
This message is a reply to:
 Message 326 by New Cat's Eye, posted 06-29-2011 1:02 PM New Cat's Eye has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 328 by New Cat's Eye, posted 06-29-2011 4:50 PM Theodoric has responded

    
Theodoric
Member
Posts: 6500
From: Northwest, WI, USA
Joined: 08-15-2005
Member Rating: 3.4


Message 329 of 396 (621944)
06-29-2011 5:06 PM
Reply to: Message 328 by New Cat's Eye
06-29-2011 4:50 PM


Catholic Scientist again resorts to personal attacks
Not when they're idiots like you.

Evidently personal attacks makes you feel like a man or something. You might want to quit acting like a middle schooler.

Evidence is something that can be used to form a conclusion that is not based on faith. Faith is accepting a position without evidence.

If the IDist reached a conclusion from some evidence, then they are not accepting the position without evidence and they are not using faith.

This isn't a difficult concept to grasp.

Well it seems you will take any personal attestation as evidence. Your whole argument shows why ID is not scientific and is taken by faith alone. Your claims of there being evidence are in fact just redefinitions of the word evidence in order to say it is not a faith proposition. I grasp the concept. It is just that the concept id ridiculous.

Mods - Are their no penalties for personal attacks? What happens if I respond in kind? As you can see, again, I have done nothing to provoke such venomous attacks. Can someone please request that CS respond to the arguments only instead of making an attack in every response to me.


Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts
This message is a reply to:
 Message 328 by New Cat's Eye, posted 06-29-2011 4:50 PM New Cat's Eye has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 330 by New Cat's Eye, posted 06-29-2011 5:24 PM Theodoric has responded

    
Theodoric
Member
Posts: 6500
From: Northwest, WI, USA
Joined: 08-15-2005
Member Rating: 3.4


Message 332 of 396 (622041)
06-30-2011 9:44 AM
Reply to: Message 330 by New Cat's Eye
06-29-2011 5:24 PM


CS writes:

Theodoric writes:

Well it seems you will take any personal attestation as evidence.

That doesn't follow at all, stupid.

Classic. No response to the point just a personal attack.

The definition of faith is not "accepting something without scientific evidence" so it is you who is misusing the terms.

You may have noticed if you had actually read my posts that I am not arguing the definition of Faith, I am claiming you are not adequately defining Evidence. Without knowing how you define the word Evidence your argument is meaningless.

Now who's acting like a middle schooler...

Boo-fucking-hoo. Cry me a river. You gonna go home and eat some baby food, crybaby?

The schoolyard bully returns. You will notice most of us try to keep this a civil forum. When a bully like you shows up the only recourse is to go to the admins. I will not be abused, physically or verbally, by anyone, without taking the necessary recourse's available to me in order to end it.


Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts
This message is a reply to:
 Message 330 by New Cat's Eye, posted 06-29-2011 5:24 PM New Cat's Eye has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 333 by New Cat's Eye, posted 06-30-2011 10:26 AM Theodoric has responded

    
Theodoric
Member
Posts: 6500
From: Northwest, WI, USA
Joined: 08-15-2005
Member Rating: 3.4


(1)
Message 335 of 396 (622057)
06-30-2011 11:35 AM
Reply to: Message 333 by New Cat's Eye
06-30-2011 10:26 AM


Speakers of english can use the word "evidence" in its colloquial sense and get an understanding of my position.

Exactly my point. Funny how you still refuse to define how you use the word evidence.

Just because you are using the word in this manner does not mean iit is not a statement of faith.

According to you all these are valid uses of evidence.

The bible is evidence for a great flood.
Unexplainable lights are evidence of extraterrestrial visitations by Aliens.
Visions are evidence of ghosts and the afterlife.

These are similar uses of evidence as your argument that belief in ID might not be based solely on faith.

Finally, I knew I could count on you to lower the bar even further.


Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts
This message is a reply to:
 Message 333 by New Cat's Eye, posted 06-30-2011 10:26 AM New Cat's Eye has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 336 by New Cat's Eye, posted 06-30-2011 12:08 PM Theodoric has responded

    
Theodoric
Member
Posts: 6500
From: Northwest, WI, USA
Joined: 08-15-2005
Member Rating: 3.4


Message 337 of 396 (622075)
06-30-2011 1:43 PM
Reply to: Message 336 by New Cat's Eye
06-30-2011 12:08 PM


The evidence does not lead to the conclusion
If some dude sees some lights in the sky and thinks they're aliens and comes to the conclusion that aliens exist, then it would be wrong to say that he has faith that aliens exist.

Not at all. His belief is based upon a false interpretation of evidence. It is the fallacy of non-sequitur. The evidence does not support the belief. The evidence does not in any way support the conclusion. In most cases the evidence has nothing to do with the conclusion. Therefore, if the evidence does not support the conclusion, then the conclusion is based upon faith not evidence.


Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts
This message is a reply to:
 Message 336 by New Cat's Eye, posted 06-30-2011 12:08 PM New Cat's Eye has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 338 by New Cat's Eye, posted 06-30-2011 2:22 PM Theodoric has responded

    
Theodoric
Member
Posts: 6500
From: Northwest, WI, USA
Joined: 08-15-2005
Member Rating: 3.4


Message 339 of 396 (622079)
06-30-2011 2:26 PM
Reply to: Message 338 by New Cat's Eye
06-30-2011 2:22 PM


Re: The evidence does not lead to the conclusion
a position he did not use faith to arrive at, a position he concluded from bad evidence.

In ID faith is what makes them willing to accept the bad evidence. Also with the other examples it is a faith based conclusion.

Gee a response without any attacks, bullying and general all around assholishness. I knew you could do it.


Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts
This message is a reply to:
 Message 338 by New Cat's Eye, posted 06-30-2011 2:22 PM New Cat's Eye has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 340 by New Cat's Eye, posted 06-30-2011 2:31 PM Theodoric has responded

    
Theodoric
Member
Posts: 6500
From: Northwest, WI, USA
Joined: 08-15-2005
Member Rating: 3.4


Message 343 of 396 (622085)
06-30-2011 3:13 PM
Reply to: Message 340 by New Cat's Eye
06-30-2011 2:31 PM


The personal attacks continue
I already explained to you that its your stupid idiocy

And it continues.

Let everyone be aware that if you do not agree with CS you are a stupid idiot.

Edited by Theodoric, : new subtitle


Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts
This message is a reply to:
 Message 340 by New Cat's Eye, posted 06-30-2011 2:31 PM New Cat's Eye has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 344 by New Cat's Eye, posted 06-30-2011 3:16 PM Theodoric has not yet responded

    
Theodoric
Member
Posts: 6500
From: Northwest, WI, USA
Joined: 08-15-2005
Member Rating: 3.4


Message 372 of 396 (623719)
07-12-2011 9:23 PM
Reply to: Message 363 by Straggler
07-12-2011 4:38 PM


Re: Faith
"Fair enough. My previous belief was based on poor evidence. I realise this now"

Can you conceive of an IDist that would do this and change their mind if they were shown their evidence was false?


Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts
This message is a reply to:
 Message 363 by Straggler, posted 07-12-2011 4:38 PM Straggler has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 375 by Straggler, posted 07-13-2011 1:35 PM Theodoric has not yet responded

    
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