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Author Topic:   United States Debt Default
jar
Member (Idle past 394 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 3 of 211 (624061)
07-15-2011 4:15 PM
Reply to: Message 1 by Straggler
07-15-2011 3:38 PM


Possible
Realistic possibilities.
The current revenue inflow is sufficient to cover interest payments on the debt so even if the Debt Limit is not raised, default in the short term is not likely.
If the Debt Limit doesn't get raised, the short term impact would be on the poor, the ill, the unemployed and those on Social Security. The rich, those working and those with streams of income not related to Social Security would likely see little short term effects. It's likely that US Postal services would stop and the payments to military, Social Security retirees, those on Federal Welfare and Federal unemployment extensions would suffer almost immediately.
The Postal services will get picked up by alternative carriers and so they would benefit.
State economies would take a hit since the funds paid to the unemployed, those people on Social Security retirement benefits and those receiving Medicare benefits almost all gets spent locally.

Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1 by Straggler, posted 07-15-2011 3:38 PM Straggler has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 25 by Straggler, posted 07-16-2011 1:46 PM jar has replied
 Message 210 by Phat, posted 06-24-2020 4:48 AM jar has replied

  
jar
Member (Idle past 394 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 8 of 211 (624075)
07-15-2011 6:08 PM


A first step.
As a first step to solving the problems we should totally change all the tax brackets from dollar amounts to multiples of the US poverty rate.

Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!

Replies to this message:
 Message 11 by Jon, posted 07-15-2011 6:46 PM jar has replied

  
jar
Member (Idle past 394 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 10 of 211 (624078)
07-15-2011 6:45 PM
Reply to: Message 9 by Phat
07-15-2011 6:41 PM


Re: Core Differences
Of course I imagine that your source did not provide either evidence or support for that absurd assertion.

Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 9 by Phat, posted 07-15-2011 6:41 PM Phat has seen this message but not replied

  
jar
Member (Idle past 394 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 14 of 211 (624084)
07-15-2011 7:05 PM
Reply to: Message 11 by Jon
07-15-2011 6:46 PM


Re: A first step.
It would not change that at all.
The point is to make it harder for the politicians to avoid a progressive tax system by playing games with terms like "middle class" or "rich".
Taxes would be based on multiples of the poverty line. At or near the poverty line you would pay no income taxes, but as income rises you would move into named brackets like "10 X Poverty level" and "100 X Poverty level" and "1000 X Poverty level".
The goal is to make the relationships clear and transparent.

Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 11 by Jon, posted 07-15-2011 6:46 PM Jon has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 19 by Jon, posted 07-15-2011 11:42 PM jar has replied

  
jar
Member (Idle past 394 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 21 of 211 (624150)
07-16-2011 8:24 AM
Reply to: Message 19 by Jon
07-15-2011 11:42 PM


Re: A first step.
No one can eliminate buzz words, but it changes the perspective when $110,000 is expressed as 10 times the individual poverty level.

Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 19 by Jon, posted 07-15-2011 11:42 PM Jon has seen this message but not replied

  
jar
Member (Idle past 394 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 26 of 211 (624192)
07-16-2011 2:00 PM
Reply to: Message 25 by Straggler
07-16-2011 1:46 PM


Re: Possible
IMHO that is very, very unlikely to happen unless Congress decides to really be *** (that is not impossible of course). There are members of the Tea Party (and they all do seem to be that ***) that simply say default is no big deal, screw the bond holders, but I really don't think they have enough votes to do that.
As I pointed out in Message 3, the current revenue is more than sufficient to pay any interest and payments due on debt. That should be okay. The US credit rating should remain sound.
The issue is the monies needed for government to actually do anything. If the debt ceiling does not get raised then a lot of the current non debt related commitments, Social Security retirement benefits, military salaries, government workers salaries, the Federal parts of unemployment insurance, the US postal service might not go out after August 3rd.

Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 25 by Straggler, posted 07-16-2011 1:46 PM Straggler has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 27 by Straggler, posted 07-16-2011 2:17 PM jar has replied
 Message 36 by Malvern, posted 07-18-2011 2:06 PM jar has replied

  
jar
Member (Idle past 394 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 28 of 211 (624195)
07-16-2011 2:21 PM
Reply to: Message 27 by Straggler
07-16-2011 2:17 PM


Re: Possible
I don't see much of an issue there. Credit rating is simply looking at the past behavior of either a nation, corporation, individual. It looks and asks, "Do they have a history of paying their debts?", and "Do they have the revenue or assets needed to pay current debt commitments?"

Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 27 by Straggler, posted 07-16-2011 2:17 PM Straggler has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 29 by Straggler, posted 07-16-2011 2:27 PM jar has replied

  
jar
Member (Idle past 394 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 30 of 211 (624206)
07-16-2011 2:56 PM
Reply to: Message 29 by Straggler
07-16-2011 2:27 PM


Re: Credit Ratings Agencies
Remember, in 2007, 2008, 2009 S&P and Moody also said that they might lower Great Britain's credit rating from AAA, and this rhetoric has been repeated in 2010 as well.
The problem is that no politicians want to address the issue.
The solutions are really pretty simple, but it requires a long term commitment that neither government is set up to make.

Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 29 by Straggler, posted 07-16-2011 2:27 PM Straggler has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 31 by Straggler, posted 07-16-2011 3:33 PM jar has replied
 Message 34 by Nuggin, posted 07-17-2011 2:17 AM jar has seen this message but not replied

  
jar
Member (Idle past 394 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 32 of 211 (624234)
07-16-2011 4:33 PM
Reply to: Message 31 by Straggler
07-16-2011 3:33 PM


Re: Credit Ratings Agencies
I think they have always been real.
I think in the end the credit rating companies like S&P and Moody's and Fitch are as afraid to drop the rating as well, and that is too bad.
It may well take dropping the credit rating to actually get anyone to present a long term plan.

Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 31 by Straggler, posted 07-16-2011 3:33 PM Straggler has not replied

  
jar
Member (Idle past 394 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 37 of 211 (624524)
07-18-2011 2:09 PM
Reply to: Message 36 by Malvern
07-18-2011 2:06 PM


Re: Possible
I see no reason to pay the military. In fact, that should certainly be a great place to stop payments.

Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 36 by Malvern, posted 07-18-2011 2:06 PM Malvern has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 38 by hooah212002, posted 07-18-2011 2:18 PM jar has replied
 Message 109 by Phat, posted 07-25-2011 4:40 PM jar has seen this message but not replied

  
jar
Member (Idle past 394 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 39 of 211 (624528)
07-18-2011 2:21 PM
Reply to: Message 38 by hooah212002
07-18-2011 2:18 PM


Re: Possible
No, I did not say that I "think a deployed soldiers wife and children should not receive a paycheck", I said that not paying the Military is likely a good idea.
It certainly is one possible way though to actually bring the issue to a head and for the first time maybe get anyone to address the issue.
Right now all the discussion seems to be nothing more than political masturbation.

Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 38 by hooah212002, posted 07-18-2011 2:18 PM hooah212002 has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 40 by hooah212002, posted 07-18-2011 2:26 PM jar has replied
 Message 41 by Malvern, posted 07-18-2011 3:16 PM jar has replied

  
jar
Member (Idle past 394 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 45 of 211 (624555)
07-18-2011 4:42 PM
Reply to: Message 40 by hooah212002
07-18-2011 2:26 PM


Re: Possible
Of course the women and children will suffer, and there will be NO support left for them.
And all the people on Social Security Retirement will suffer and all those on Medicare and in Vet Hospitals and all the unemployed.
Literally Millions will suffer and many likely die.
But the rich should do jess fine.

Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 40 by hooah212002, posted 07-18-2011 2:26 PM hooah212002 has seen this message but not replied

  
jar
Member (Idle past 394 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 46 of 211 (624556)
07-18-2011 4:42 PM
Reply to: Message 41 by Malvern
07-18-2011 3:16 PM


Re: Possible
Of course, and they were pretty ineffective.

Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 41 by Malvern, posted 07-18-2011 3:16 PM Malvern has not replied

  
jar
Member (Idle past 394 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 52 of 211 (624672)
07-19-2011 10:23 AM
Reply to: Message 51 by Malvern
07-19-2011 10:14 AM


Re: Possible
Certainly they can. It may well be unconstitutional but until that is determined by the SCOTUS they can do most anything.

Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 51 by Malvern, posted 07-19-2011 10:14 AM Malvern has not replied

  
jar
Member (Idle past 394 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 211 of 211 (877973)
06-24-2020 7:34 AM
Reply to: Message 210 by Phat
06-24-2020 4:48 AM


Re: Possible
Phat writes:
I saw a good video on this topic which I trusted.
Why did you trust such utter nonsense?
While it is certainly better than many so far it is based on the people in the US thinking beyond the next quarter.
Is there any evidence that the general US population has an attention span that long or is in any way connected to reality?
Edited by jar, : Hit wrong key.

My Sister's Website: Rose Hill StudiosMy Website: My Website

This message is a reply to:
 Message 210 by Phat, posted 06-24-2020 4:48 AM Phat has not replied

  
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