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Author Topic:   Subjective Evidence of Gods
Chuck77
Inactive Member


Message 244 of 468 (630397)
08-25-2011 12:12 AM
Reply to: Message 220 by GDR
08-22-2011 2:10 PM


Who's your God GDR?
GDR writes:
Ultimately everyone chooses between selfish love and unselfish love whether they be Christian, Muslim, Jewish, agnostic or atheist. I'd suggest that an atheist who sends anonymously $100 to the third world is much closer to the heart of God than the Christian who sends the $100 with the idea that it has put God on His side.
First it's all about Jesus and NOW it's all about US? Which is it man?
Are we saved by works, which you imply above or what Jesus did on the Cross?
Frankly I’m not going to worry about who winds up where. The next life will look after itself, and whatever happens happens.
So, fate then? We play no part in where we end up? That not what the subjective Bible teaches
I just thought I'd add this. My God is a good God and a just God. In the end, not that I have much a choice , I have faith that true justice will be served.
Cool.
Edited by Chuck77, : No reason given.
Edited by Chuck77, : No reason given.
Edited by Chuck77, : No reason given.
Edited by Chuck77, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 220 by GDR, posted 08-22-2011 2:10 PM GDR has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 246 by GDR, posted 08-25-2011 2:43 AM Chuck77 has not replied

Chuck77
Inactive Member


Message 245 of 468 (630398)
08-25-2011 12:22 AM
Reply to: Message 237 by Panda
08-24-2011 2:37 PM


Re: Detecting Intelligent Agency Where There Is None
Panda writes:
RAZD writes:
Note that there seems to be an implicit need to reach a decision here on all these concepts, that you somehow MUST choose existence or non-existence.
Note that you are wrong.
Where are you on the Dawkins scale Panda? and why?
Im a #1. It's unreasonable but that's what I am. Do you think there is more or less evidence for gods?
Edited by Chuck77, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 237 by Panda, posted 08-24-2011 2:37 PM Panda has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 247 by Panda, posted 08-25-2011 8:24 AM Chuck77 has replied

Chuck77
Inactive Member


Message 251 of 468 (630548)
08-26-2011 6:58 AM
Reply to: Message 247 by Panda
08-25-2011 8:24 AM


Re: Detecting Intelligent Agency Where There Is None
Panda writes:
But you aren't #1 in regard to other gods - just your chosen version of the christian god, yes?
Yes.
I expect you to be a #7 in relation to other gods. To paraphrase: You know there is no other God.
Unreasonable, indeed.
How so? Is it unreasonable to assume that im not going to get a ticket for driving in the opposite direction on a one way street EVEN if I assume it doesnt' matter? Truth is not relative. All way don't lead to the truth. One truth, One God.
Why? Because I have seen no evidence for any gods - but I realise that it is theoretically possible for some evidence to be found, sometime in the future.
Wonderful. You can start by picking up a Bible (some subjective evidence for god(s) and test it out.
Also there are many books written by wonderful christians that know this truth. Pick a few up. Prayer is good too. Some books will help you pray in a way that is like you were talking to your parents. It's easy. Church too, that's a good place for subjective evidence. Lot's of people to validate this truth.
You have your hands full for the weekend. SONday find a good morning service and let me know what the Pastor talked about.
Chuck writes:
Do you think there is more or less evidence for gods?
Compared to?
Umm, compared to no god(s)?
You can't see that im asking if you think there is more/less evidence for god(s)? Subjective evidence, do you feel there is a good amount of subjective evidence for god(s) that you could invest time in that would someday lead you to a realization that a god exists?
Do you even care to? Are you here to shoot down all ideas and evidence or are you willing to investigate claims people have actually made? Peoples testimony is evidence of God even if you don't agree with it.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 247 by Panda, posted 08-25-2011 8:24 AM Panda has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 252 by Huntard, posted 08-26-2011 8:50 AM Chuck77 has replied
 Message 280 by Panda, posted 08-29-2011 2:05 PM Chuck77 has not replied

Chuck77
Inactive Member


Message 411 of 468 (631427)
09-01-2011 12:14 AM
Reply to: Message 252 by Huntard
08-26-2011 8:50 AM


Subjective evidence apperantly not so subjective to some
Chuck writes:
Wonderful. You can start by picking up a Bible (some subjective evidence for god(s) and test it out.
Also there are many books written by wonderful christians that know this truth. Pick a few up. Prayer is good too. Some books will help you pray in a way that is like you were talking to your parents. It's easy. Church too, that's a good place for subjective evidence. Lot's of people to validate this truth.
You have your hands full for the weekend. SONday find a good morning service and let me know what the Pastor talked about.
Huntard writes:
Muslim down the street writes:
Wonderful. You can start by picking up a Qu'ran (some subjective evidence for god(s) and test it out.
Also there are many books written by wonderful Muslims that know this truth. Pick a few up. Prayer is good too. Some books will help you pray in a way that is like you were talking to your parents. It's easy. Mosque too, that's a good place for subjective evidence. Lot's of people to validate this truth.
You have your hands full for the weekend. SOMEday find a good morning service and let me know what the Imam talked about.
Huntard writes:
Now, which one to choose, and why?
Well, why not just ask these folk:
Islam, SVM News, 1 January, 2007: Millions of Muslim converts to Christianity celebrated Christmas throughout the world. According the reports of the various missionary organizations and news medias.
The Salem Voice Ministries evangelizing Muslims in India and many other Muslim nations. There are about 500 evangelists ministering among Muslims in different African, Middle East and Asian countries. A vast number of Muslims finding the truth and attaining Salvation of Jesus Christ day by day.
'More Muslims converted to faith in Jesus Christ over the past decade than at any other time in human history. A spiritual revolution is underway throughout North Africa, the Middle East, and Central Asia. As a result, a record number of ex-Muslims are celebrating Christmas this year, despite intense persecution, assassinations, and widespread church bombings'.
Islam Watch - "Millions of Muslims Converting to Christianity" by Salem Voice
Now, your project is to provide the same, only in reverse. For example, Christians converting to Islam.
Edited by Chuck77, : No reason given.
Edited by Chuck77, : Fixed quotes for clarification.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 252 by Huntard, posted 08-26-2011 8:50 AM Huntard has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 414 by Huntard, posted 09-01-2011 2:24 AM Chuck77 has replied

Chuck77
Inactive Member


Message 416 of 468 (631448)
09-01-2011 3:51 AM
Reply to: Message 414 by Huntard
09-01-2011 2:24 AM


Being dishonest
Chuck writes:
Now, your project is to provide the same, only in reverse. For example, Christians converting to Islam.
Huntard quotes writes:
CAIR chairman Nihad Awad told the Saudi paper 'Ukaz that "34,000 Americans have converted to Islam following the events of September 11, and this is the highest rate reached in the U.S. since Islam arrived there."
Sorry, that is NOT what we are talking about here, come on dude, if you're going to debate this atleast try and play by the rules?
I didn't say Americans and you know it. I said CHRISTIANS who converted to Islam. Jesus professing Christians who have converted to Islam.
What you provided is not even close to what we are talking about and i'll go ahead and assume you concede to my point. Nice try tho.
Edited by Chuck77, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 414 by Huntard, posted 09-01-2011 2:24 AM Huntard has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 419 by Straggler, posted 09-01-2011 11:13 AM Chuck77 has replied

Chuck77
Inactive Member


Message 425 of 468 (631628)
09-02-2011 4:26 AM
Reply to: Message 419 by Straggler
09-01-2011 11:13 AM


subjective evidence overload
Straggler writes:
Have you tried just doing the obvious thing of typing something like 'christian convert Islam' into Google?
I did this and got the following sort of thing: Islamic Converts
I know! Isn't it great. Talk about overload of subjective evidence. Although there are MANY more muslims converting to christianity than the other way around I think it says something regardless don't you?
Edited by Chuck77, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 419 by Straggler, posted 09-01-2011 11:13 AM Straggler has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 426 by Huntard, posted 09-02-2011 4:52 AM Chuck77 has replied
 Message 442 by Straggler, posted 09-06-2011 2:11 PM Chuck77 has replied

Chuck77
Inactive Member


Message 427 of 468 (631633)
09-02-2011 5:35 AM
Reply to: Message 426 by Huntard
09-02-2011 4:52 AM


Re: subjective evidence overload
Huntard writes:
those are just people being misled by satan,
Satan is a SN being is he not?
Really? Got any evidence to back up that statement?
Yes, I provided the links and so did a few other members. Did you look at them? Some of the people who converted are listed by name.
I realize subjective evidence is well, subjective or at best an opinion based on experience. I realize that saying " I sense it's going to snow today" is not subjective evidence BUT I can sense a drop in temp, clouds rolling in, that certain "smell" in the air before it snows etc etc....So yes, to me it's subjective and worth something.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 426 by Huntard, posted 09-02-2011 4:52 AM Huntard has not replied

Chuck77
Inactive Member


(1)
Message 444 of 468 (632775)
09-10-2011 3:22 AM
Reply to: Message 442 by Straggler
09-06-2011 2:11 PM


Straggler is always right every time eternity infinity
Straggler writes:
The question is why you think this matters?
Dude, the question isn't why ME thinks this matters it's why THEY think it matters. Not me Straggler, geez.
Is that actually true?
Yes, it is. If it wasn't you would be all over it with 900 links...not just one talking about some american's converting to Islam. It's very true that more Muslims are converting to Christianity than Believers of Jesus Christ (Christians) are converting to Islam.
It is just a case of the argumentum ad populum fallacy to claim that being the largest, fastest growing or most converted to religion has any logical consequences about the truth of that religion.
Whoa dude. Im not claiming at all that Christianity is the fastest growing anything NOR am I claiming that it is the most converted.
I said more muslims are converting to Christinaity than Christians are converting to Islam. How many times do you need this repeated? Apperantly many many times.
Can you ever admit anything is true????? You are frikking impossible dude, your like a dam woman you know that?
So I am not sure what your point is with this Islam/Christian stuff......?
Well then I can't help you. If you can't see that muslims converting over the Christianity much more than Christians converting to Islam means something surley I can't help you.
It would seem whatever subjective evidence they are coming across, favors Christianity.
Edited by Chuck77, : No reason given.
Edited by Chuck77, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 442 by Straggler, posted 09-06-2011 2:11 PM Straggler has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 445 by Huntard, posted 09-10-2011 3:30 AM Chuck77 has not replied
 Message 446 by Panda, posted 09-10-2011 6:24 AM Chuck77 has replied
 Message 449 by Theodoric, posted 09-10-2011 9:35 AM Chuck77 has not replied
 Message 450 by RAZD, posted 09-10-2011 9:37 AM Chuck77 has not replied
 Message 453 by Straggler, posted 09-10-2011 4:43 PM Chuck77 has replied

Chuck77
Inactive Member


Message 447 of 468 (632790)
09-10-2011 6:52 AM
Reply to: Message 446 by Panda
09-10-2011 6:24 AM


Re: Straggler is always right every time eternity infinity
Thanks again Panda, for adding to the conversation. Your one liners are as boring as you are.
Trying to derail the thread? Nothing to add to the discussion? Straggler is a big boy and would probably laugh at that but if you feel the need to stick up for Straggler im sure he is very thankful for you being here to defend him. Itching for that pat on the back huh?
He's like a big brother ehe? I understand. I have a little brother. I hope Straggler validates your feelings. I really do. It's ok little guy...it's..OK.
Edited by Chuck77, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 446 by Panda, posted 09-10-2011 6:24 AM Panda has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 448 by fearandloathing, posted 09-10-2011 7:01 AM Chuck77 has not replied
 Message 451 by Panda, posted 09-10-2011 1:58 PM Chuck77 has not replied
 Message 454 by Straggler, posted 09-10-2011 4:55 PM Chuck77 has not replied

Chuck77
Inactive Member


Message 457 of 468 (632896)
09-11-2011 2:46 AM
Reply to: Message 453 by Straggler
09-10-2011 4:43 PM


Re: Straggler is always right every time eternity infinity
Straggler writes:
So explain to me - Why does it matter? Do you think it is indicative of the truth of one religion over another?
Does it matter to you what I think? If it doesn't matter to you that more muslims are converting to christianity then why does it matter to you what I think?
Besides, i've told you this before. You don't like to move the conversation forward you simply keep it right where you're at and refuse to accept any points anyone makes contrary to yours.
Before I head off to do my hair and make-up can you tell us all where you are getting this information from?
Lots of information on this subject. Lots Straggler but for some reason I doubt you care even if you see that it's true.
Here is just ONE source from an Islamic website: Islam watch: Telling the truth about Islam, by Salem Voice:
Islam, SVM News, 1 January, 2007: Millions of Muslim converts to Christianity celebrated Christmas throughout the world. According the reports of the various missionary organizations and news medias.
The Salem Voice Ministries evangelizing Muslims in India and many other Muslim nations. There are about 500 evangelists ministering among Muslims in different African, Middle East and Asian countries. A vast number of Muslims finding the truth and attaining Salvation of Jesus Christ day by day.
'More Muslims converted to faith in Jesus Christ over the past decade than at any other time in human history. A spiritual revolution is underway throughout North Africa, the Middle East, and Central Asia. As a result, a record number of ex-Muslims are celebrating Christmas this year, despite intense persecution, assassinations, and widespread church bombings'. These are the words of Joel C. Rosenberg, the author of the New York Times best selling political thriller.
Reference:Islam Watch - "Millions of Muslims Converting to Christianity" by Salem Voice
There is tons of information on it, just search more for yourself if you're really interested.
I am sure Islamists all over the world are finding the face of Jesus in their toasted cheese sandwiches very compelling.......
Or does this not qualify as subjective evidence.......?
Lets see:
Call it a miracle! Or just call it the Jesus Toaster.
Retailing for $39.95, the revelatory toaster uses patented radiated heat technology to toast the face of Christ on any variety of daily bread, from plain white to whole grain.
Developed (some might say immaculately conceived) by Galen Dively III, 45, of Walden, Vt., the Jesus Toaster went on sale Wednesday at Dively's website.
Dively has deep faith in Jesus Toasters
Over the last few months, he's demonstrated the toaster for store managers and purchasing agents and won over numerous converts. So far, the only skeptic has been his wife, who set a cap on the initial purchase order (Dively wanted 5,000 toasters) and lately has been giving him "weird looks."
Well, I would say YES it does. Although the "converts" are buyers of the product, who is to say it's not a great witnessing tool and a good conversation starter about Jesus?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 453 by Straggler, posted 09-10-2011 4:43 PM Straggler has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 458 by Dr Adequate, posted 09-11-2011 3:13 AM Chuck77 has replied
 Message 467 by Straggler, posted 09-12-2011 6:52 PM Chuck77 has not replied

Chuck77
Inactive Member


Message 459 of 468 (632898)
09-11-2011 3:17 AM
Reply to: Message 458 by Dr Adequate
09-11-2011 3:13 AM


Re: Straggler is always right every time eternity infinity
Maybe I have been misinformed.
What you are informed about had no bearing on this subject one bit or this conversation other than to add more BS to the discussion that you seem to do a lot of.
If you are claiming that Salem Voice is lying supply the rebuttle to the article. Thanks Doc.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 458 by Dr Adequate, posted 09-11-2011 3:13 AM Dr Adequate has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 460 by Dr Adequate, posted 09-11-2011 3:18 AM Chuck77 has not replied

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