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Author Topic:   Crime and Punishment
Omnivorous
Member
Posts: 3985
From: Adirondackia
Joined: 07-21-2005
Member Rating: 7.2


(1)
Message 11 of 40 (639214)
10-28-2011 8:10 PM
Reply to: Message 2 by frako
10-28-2011 2:13 PM


frako writes:
Well if you make the prisoners work and i mean hard work like digging ditches they would not have the energy to rape each other after they are done.
Ditch diggers have no children?
Slaves who worked 16 hour days in the fields had no children?
Surely you can see this claim is nonsense.

"If you can keep your head while those around you are losing theirs, you can collect a lot of heads."

This message is a reply to:
 Message 2 by frako, posted 10-28-2011 2:13 PM frako has not replied

  
Omnivorous
Member
Posts: 3985
From: Adirondackia
Joined: 07-21-2005
Member Rating: 7.2


(2)
Message 15 of 40 (639219)
10-28-2011 9:18 PM
Reply to: Message 8 by Rahvin
10-28-2011 7:54 PM


"If you ain't got the do re mi, boys..."
Rahvin writes:
Harsher punishment does nothing to reduce crime rates or recidivism. We've tried. Doesn't work. Deterrence is a myth. The humane European prisons, which do things like allowing prisoners to go home for the weekend, like letting prisoners have privacy in the bathroom, like letting prisoners live in humane spaces that don't resemble dog kennels, they have far lower crime rates.
Rahvin, you've come full circle to the connection I see with OWS--economic injustice creates a criminal class, and that injustice follows that class throughout their prison experience. For many prison alumni, their first prison experience is a brutal radicalization--not a political radicalization, but one of deep, abiding rage against a world that first denied them opportunity, and then denied their very humanity.
Half or more of U.S. prison populations are incarcerated for drug offenses--offenses, I might add, that frako and others of us have casually discussed here. There are still states in the U.S. where you will serve more time for giving your nice neighbor lady a joint than for raping her, and those convicted and punished for such "soft" drug offenses are placed in the general prison population.
In 2009, more than half (50.7%) of all people incarcerated in federal prisons were there for drug offenses, 5.8% for property crimes, 35% for "public order" offenses (immigration, weapons, etc.), and only 7.9% for violent offenses.*
While the racial disparities seen in conviction rates and sentencing are well known, the true determinant of your fate in the hands of American Justice is class: a college student from an affluent family with sufficient funds and connections who is busted with cocaine is unlikely to serve any time at all; a high school drop-out without those resources is almost certain to face incarceration. If that drop-out is black, of course, the incarceration will be longer.
But the blighted prison landscape has some garden spots. There is one segment of the prison population that enjoys more enlightened treatment: white collar criminals.
Excerpted from the Corporate Crime Reporter:
quote:
Expert Names Top Five Prisons for White-Collar Criminals
Fear not, dear corporate CEO.
There is a guide for your post-conviction life.
It’s called the Federal Prison Handbook 2005.
And it’s co-author — Alan Ellis — wants you know — there is prison, and there is prison.
While the guidebook profiles each of the nation’s 178 federal prisons, only about a third of them are minimum security prisons — or federal prison camps — suitable for your average CEO.
And Ellis says — this is what you want — a federal prison camp.
While the fabled Club Fed is a thing of the past — you know, get up the in morning, play golf, steak and lobster for dinner — federal prison camps are a cut above your other currently available alternatives.
Ellis is a lawyer who specializes in federal sentencing and post-conviction remedies.
The federal system houses 180,000 prisoners.
Ellis estimates that about ten percent, or 18,000, are white collar criminals.
In an interview with Corporate Crime Reporter, we asked Ellis to name his top five prisons for white collar criminals.
Here’s his list:
Yankton, South Dakota. A stand alone federal prison camp, Ellis says. A vanishing breed. These are camps that are not satellites to larger more secure institutions. It happens to be a converted college that went defunct. It’s in the middle of the town, not on the outskirts. There is a lot of community programming. People leave during the day and come back at night.
Englewood, Colorado. That’s outside of Denver, Ellis says. It’s a satellite camp to the federal correction institution there. I’m told by my clients that it is a pretty laid back place.
Texarkana, Texas. The federal prison camp there has an drug and alcohol treatment program, he says. It has a pond stocked with fish. And one of my clients said he liked to spend his day fishing.
Sheridan, Oregon. A federal prison camp outside of a medium level security facility about 60 miles from Portland.
Pensacola Naval Base. You get out during the day, you work on the Naval base, you intermingle with Navy personnel, Ellis says. The food is better. You are outside. I’ve had people who were taking care of the grounds at the admiral’s house. The admiral’s wife would bring out lemonade, invite the inmate in for lunch. Things of that sort.
If you are Jewish, I would say the federal prison camp at Otisville, New York, about 70 miles from New York City, Ellis adds. It has programs for orthodox and religious Jews. It has religious furloughs where people leave the prison for religious holidays.
Ellis says that while most white-collar convicts are assigned to federal prison camps, getting into a federal prison camp is not slam dunk automatic. (See Interview with Alan Ellis, San Rafael, California, 19 Corporate Crime Reporter 30, pages 10 - 16, July 25, 2005, print edition only).
*Source: West, Heather C.; Sabol, William J.; and Greenman, Sarah J., "Prisoners in 2009," Bureau of Justice Statistics, (Washington, DC: US Department of Justice, December 2010), NCJ 231675, Appendix Table 18, p. 33. ===== http://bjs.ojp.usdoj.gov/content/pub/pdf/p09.pdf

"If you can keep your head while those around you are losing theirs, you can collect a lot of heads."

This message is a reply to:
 Message 8 by Rahvin, posted 10-28-2011 7:54 PM Rahvin has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 19 by Phat, posted 10-29-2011 12:32 PM Omnivorous has not replied

  
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