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Author Topic:   Why Do People Steal?
Dr Adequate
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Posts: 16094
Joined: 07-20-2006
Member Rating: 5.5


Message 35 of 270 (641313)
11-18-2011 3:02 PM
Reply to: Message 32 by Artemis Entreri
11-18-2011 2:37 PM


Re: Set your own prices.
My friend told me this is stealing. I maintain that it is bargaining.

It's stealing.


This message is a reply to:
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Dr Adequate
Member
Posts: 16094
Joined: 07-20-2006
Member Rating: 5.5


Message 40 of 270 (641324)
11-18-2011 3:35 PM
Reply to: Message 37 by Artemis Entreri
11-18-2011 3:13 PM


The label I present to the cashier says the price ($1.50), the price per pound of the tea ($9.00) (and its in a 1 pound bag). I feel as if they do not care, they scan the item and move on. All the information is on the bag. I basically hand them a 1 pound bag, that has a sticker on it that reads 0.15 pounds.
It is a hustle, but I am still paying for it, so I do not think it is stealing.

And yet it is, in fact, stealing.

You are not paying for what you got, you are paying for something else, because of your fraud. Yes, it's stealing. Stop it. If you were starving, I'd say OK, steal if you must, but you're not, you're stealing luxury goods because you've found out a way for you to get away with it. This is just wrong.


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Dr Adequate
Member
Posts: 16094
Joined: 07-20-2006
Member Rating: 5.5


Message 44 of 270 (641335)
11-18-2011 4:23 PM
Reply to: Message 41 by Artemis Entreri
11-18-2011 3:39 PM


Re: fraud
really minor fraud considering I buy hippy organic milk, and vegan mayonnaise, and a ton of other crap that costs twice as much as anywhere else. so I save $7.50 on the tea, $5 on coffee, and $10 on candy, I still get $60 worth of groceries when I go in there, and I do not think they give shit

[...]

You fill up your shopping cart top and bottom with goods, then you go to the self checkout, and only ring up and pay for the items on the top of the cart. There is a store employee standing 15ft (<5m) away from you watching you. The trick is they hire Droids to watch the customers, these droids get paid to stand around, they are doing their job, but they are also "allowing" you to only pay for half of the items in your cart. My good friend does this all the time, probably every-time he goes to the store.

Stealing.

Look, suppose you leave your house, and while you're out someone burgles it and robs you of all your possessions. Is that theft? I would say yes. But wait! You didn't hire security guards to watch your house when you were out. You "did not give shit". So has anyone really stolen from you?

What if you did hire security guards, but they were incompetent? Well then they did "not give shit". So apparently no theft has been committed.

I think it was theft, 'cos of them taking stuff that was yours but not theirs. If you really disagree with that on principle, then perhaps you could give me your address, 'cos apparently then I could take all your stuff and you wouldn't regard it as theft.


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 Message 41 by Artemis Entreri, posted 11-18-2011 3:39 PM Artemis Entreri has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 50 by Artemis Entreri, posted 11-18-2011 5:42 PM Dr Adequate has responded

  
Dr Adequate
Member
Posts: 16094
Joined: 07-20-2006
Member Rating: 5.5


Message 51 of 270 (641351)
11-18-2011 5:44 PM
Reply to: Message 50 by Artemis Entreri
11-18-2011 5:42 PM


Re: fraud
Of course I would, but I do pay them something. If you burgled me but left me $250 ...

Curiously enough, leaving $250 was not part of my plan.

Now, try again. If I burgle your house, and get away with it, is that theft?


This message is a reply to:
 Message 50 by Artemis Entreri, posted 11-18-2011 5:42 PM Artemis Entreri has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 57 by Artemis Entreri, posted 11-18-2011 6:04 PM Dr Adequate has responded

  
Dr Adequate
Member
Posts: 16094
Joined: 07-20-2006
Member Rating: 5.5


(1)
Message 58 of 270 (641358)
11-18-2011 6:06 PM
Reply to: Message 54 by Artemis Entreri
11-18-2011 5:54 PM


Re: fraud
I dont consider it shoplifting.

Interesting. Do you consider an animal shaped like a horse with black and white stripes to be a zebra?

Edited by Dr Adequate, : No reason given.


This message is a reply to:
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Dr Adequate
Member
Posts: 16094
Joined: 07-20-2006
Member Rating: 5.5


Message 59 of 270 (641359)
11-18-2011 6:08 PM
Reply to: Message 57 by Artemis Entreri
11-18-2011 6:04 PM


Re: fraud
I said yes already.

So how is that different from your justification for stealing, i.e. that you can get away with it?


This message is a reply to:
 Message 57 by Artemis Entreri, posted 11-18-2011 6:04 PM Artemis Entreri has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 62 by Artemis Entreri, posted 11-18-2011 6:18 PM Dr Adequate has responded

  
Dr Adequate
Member
Posts: 16094
Joined: 07-20-2006
Member Rating: 5.5


Message 61 of 270 (641361)
11-18-2011 6:14 PM
Reply to: Message 49 by Artemis Entreri
11-18-2011 5:38 PM


Re: fraud
Yeah but there is no God or any afterliferight? so fuck it! Ima get mine. Milq da game.
I love it when liberal atheists tell me about morality. Oh the irony.

Obviously theists need their moral superiors to lecture them on morality. This is not ironic, this is kinda bleedin' obvious. Perhaps you'd prefer one of your priests who'll tell you that theft is fine and so is raping children, but if you want instruction in any subject, you should look to the people who are better than you.

Edited by Dr Adequate, : No reason given.


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Dr Adequate
Member
Posts: 16094
Joined: 07-20-2006
Member Rating: 5.5


(1)
Message 67 of 270 (641368)
11-18-2011 6:40 PM
Reply to: Message 62 by Artemis Entreri
11-18-2011 6:18 PM


Re: fraud
Its Fraud, not stealing.

"It's an apple, it's not fruit."

you didn't answer my question now. let me rephrase it: If there is no God and no eternal punishment, why shouldn't I steal, fraud, rape, and do what ever i want?

'Cos it's wrong.

Really, can't you even conceive of a morality that doesn't revolve around the possibility that you might get caught and punished?

This is literally childish. It's stage 1 of level 1 of Piaget's account of the development of morality in children: "wrong" is what you get punished for, "right" is what you can get away with.

Edited by Dr Adequate, : No reason given.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 62 by Artemis Entreri, posted 11-18-2011 6:18 PM Artemis Entreri has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 72 by Artemis Entreri, posted 11-18-2011 6:50 PM Dr Adequate has responded

  
Dr Adequate
Member
Posts: 16094
Joined: 07-20-2006
Member Rating: 5.5


Message 71 of 270 (641372)
11-18-2011 6:48 PM
Reply to: Message 68 by Artemis Entreri
11-18-2011 6:45 PM


Re: are you one of those French Canadians?
its about attitude, some people here (left wingers IMO) love to demonize and call other people names. its just rude. and against the rules of the site.

and you are a fucking asshole.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 68 by Artemis Entreri, posted 11-18-2011 6:45 PM Artemis Entreri has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 74 by Artemis Entreri, posted 11-18-2011 6:56 PM Dr Adequate has responded

  
Dr Adequate
Member
Posts: 16094
Joined: 07-20-2006
Member Rating: 5.5


Message 75 of 270 (641376)
11-18-2011 6:58 PM
Reply to: Message 72 by Artemis Entreri
11-18-2011 6:50 PM


Re: fraud
Yeah theres some vernacular, Id love to keep is casual in the coffee house.

Interesting I should answer your questions, but you cannot give me the same respect.

What is wrong? Are you telling me there is a God, and there is an afterlife?

No. You can tell that I'm not telling you that there is a God and there is an afterlife by the way that I never in any way told you that there is a God nor that there is an afterlife.

Stop me if I'm going too fast for you.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 72 by Artemis Entreri, posted 11-18-2011 6:50 PM Artemis Entreri has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 79 by Artemis Entreri, posted 11-18-2011 7:29 PM Dr Adequate has responded

  
Dr Adequate
Member
Posts: 16094
Joined: 07-20-2006
Member Rating: 5.5


Message 77 of 270 (641378)
11-18-2011 7:01 PM
Reply to: Message 74 by Artemis Entreri
11-18-2011 6:56 PM


I'm guessing you are trying to saying I am guilty of the same thing, but I am not.

"He started it" and "I didn't do it" are actually two different propositions.


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 Message 74 by Artemis Entreri, posted 11-18-2011 6:56 PM Artemis Entreri has acknowledged this reply

  
Dr Adequate
Member
Posts: 16094
Joined: 07-20-2006
Member Rating: 5.5


Message 80 of 270 (641381)
11-18-2011 7:38 PM
Reply to: Message 79 by Artemis Entreri
11-18-2011 7:29 PM


Re: fraud
yeah I thought i said that in #74. I am not following you at all right now.

SLOW DOWN

Well you seem to be confusing two different ideas: the idea that something is wrong, and the idea that something's not in your best interest.

If you really can't see why rape is wrong independent of whether or not you'll be punished for it, then I don't think I can explain it to you.


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Dr Adequate
Member
Posts: 16094
Joined: 07-20-2006
Member Rating: 5.5


Message 91 of 270 (641397)
11-18-2011 9:28 PM
Reply to: Message 82 by ProtoTypical
11-18-2011 8:06 PM


Re: Who doesn't steal?
How many readers would engage in a cash transaction in order to avoid paying the tax? I know I would and I consider myself to be scrupulously honest.

I have declined to do so; I can't put my hand on my heart and say that I always would (I might behave differently if I was really strapped for cash).


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 Message 82 by ProtoTypical, posted 11-18-2011 8:06 PM ProtoTypical has acknowledged this reply

Replies to this message:
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Dr Adequate
Member
Posts: 16094
Joined: 07-20-2006
Member Rating: 5.5


Message 100 of 270 (641408)
11-18-2011 11:12 PM
Reply to: Message 96 by Buzsaw
11-18-2011 10:31 PM


Re: Creationist vs Evolutionist Inhibitions
Biblical fundamentalist Christian creationists have a fear of God who's book says things like "whom he loves he chastens; vengeance is mine says Jehovah; do to others what you would have them to do to you; and Be sure, your sins will find you out."

The trouble is that they also believe that God forgives them all their sins as a reward for believing that God forgives them all their sins as a reward for believing that God forgives them all their sins as a reward for ... wait, this sentence is becoming infinitely recursive.

Which at least some of them seem to regard as a moral carte blanche.


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 Message 96 by Buzsaw, posted 11-18-2011 10:31 PM Buzsaw has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 111 by Buzsaw, posted 11-19-2011 3:31 PM Dr Adequate has responded

  
Dr Adequate
Member
Posts: 16094
Joined: 07-20-2006
Member Rating: 5.5


Message 117 of 270 (641528)
11-20-2011 3:11 AM
Reply to: Message 111 by Buzsaw
11-19-2011 3:31 PM


Re: Cherry Picking Biblical Scripture
DA, it appears that you need to be apprised of the term, fundamentalist. Then you need to know and understand the corroborated fundamentals of the NT regarding forgiveness.

Ah, the No True Christian gambit.

Thus you don't cherry pick from Biblical truth so as to obfuscate it to someone's private interpretation ...

You're right, I don't --- I leave that up to Christian fundamentalists, who are so good at it after so many centuries of practice. All I do is observe that they exist.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 111 by Buzsaw, posted 11-19-2011 3:31 PM Buzsaw has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 128 by Buzsaw, posted 11-20-2011 7:14 PM Dr Adequate has responded

  
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