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Member (Idle past 4679 days) Posts: 415 From: Australia Joined: |
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Author | Topic: Moral high ground | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Butterflytyrant Member (Idle past 4679 days) Posts: 415 From: Australia Joined: |
I have noticed that many religious people seem to believe that they hold some sort of moral high ground. They seem to believe that because they follow the teachings of a particular faith, they automatically become superior to others when it comes to interpretation of scripture, moral and ethical judgements etc
One of the reasons for this claim often stems from the idea that their particular religion or religion in general has a lower kill rate than no religion. Portillo provided this claim in Message 87 Atheistic regimes have killed over 100 million people. Thats 10,000 times more than all religious atrocities put together since the beginning of time. I have heard this claim made many times. I have seen it brought up in debates and now it appears here. I would like to challenge those who believe this to be true to support it.I could agree with you, but then we would both be wrong Butterfly, AKA, mallethead - Dawn Bertot "Superstitions and nonsense from the past should not prevent us from making progress. If we hold ourselves back, we admit that our fears are more powerful than our abilities." Hunters of Dune Herbert & Anderson 2011 leading candidate for the EvC Forum Don Quixote award
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AdminPhat Inactive Member |
Thread copied here from the Moral high ground thread in the Proposed New Topics forum.
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AdminPhat Inactive Member |
Thread moved here per Butterfly Tyrants request.
Edited by AdminPhat, : No reason given.
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hooah212002 Member (Idle past 1058 days) Posts: 3193 Joined: |
Something else along these lines that I think follows from this or is a cause of this, is that of faith as a virtue. I have been meaning to create a thread about it but I haven't found a need for it.
Put the FSM back in Chrifsmas
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nwr Member Posts: 6484 From: Geneva, Illinois Joined: Member Rating: 8.7 |
This thread reminded me that it is time for me to change my forum signature.
Christianity claims the moral high ground it its rhetoric. It has long since abandoned the moral high ground in its practices
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jar Member (Idle past 96 days) Posts: 34140 From: Texas!! Joined:
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One of the problems with claiming some moral high ground for Christianity is that the evidence just flat refutes it.
No nation, no other religion or belief system does genocide on the scale of Christianity or with as much success as Christianity. From the very moment Christianity was adopted as a State Religion by Constantine it has been spread by force and by the simple step of totally destroying all remnants of any competing culture, belief, religion or philosophy or by adopting the cultural event and commandeering it to support Christianity. It has had one simply message; if you are not Christian convert or suffer the consequences both in this life and for eternity.Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!
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Dogmafood Member Posts: 1815 From: Ontario Canada Joined: |
One of the reasons for this claim often stems from the idea that their particular religion or religion in general has a lower kill rate than no religion. Could this be refuted by pointing out that something like 80% of people believe in some type of god? That this is probably an all time low and so throughout history at least 80% of the people actually doing the killing were probably theists. Stalin may have been an atheist but I doubt that all of his henchmen were.
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Tangle Member Posts: 9581 From: UK Joined: Member Rating: 6.5
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I've had it put to me that atheists must be amoral (because morals come from god), that believers must be more moral than me because they believe in God and one even said that there was nothing stopping him raping and murdering except for his belief in god and an afterlife.
The trouble with all these people is that they're universally stupid.Life, don't talk to me about life. |
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Coragyps Member (Idle past 991 days) Posts: 5553 From: Snyder, Texas, USA Joined:
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Atheistic regimes have killed over 100 million people. Thats 10,000 times more than all religious atrocities put together since the beginning of time. ROFL! 100,000,000 divided by 10,000 = 10,000, the last I looked. I Samuel 18:7 tells us, inerrantly, of course: As they danced, they sang: Saul has slain his thousands, and David his tens of thousands. Portillo, are you out there? Would you care to respond, before we start on the Crusades, "ethnic cleansing," the Hundred Years' War, the invasion of the New World, the spread of Islam,.........?"The Christian church, in its attitude toward science, shows the mind of a more or less enlightened man of the Thirteenth Century. It no longer believes that the earth is flat, but it is still convinced that prayer can cure after medicine fails." H L Mencken
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frako Member Posts: 2932 From: slovenija Joined:
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Atheistic regimes have killed over 100 million people. Thats 10,000 times more than all religious atrocities put together since the beginning of time. I have heard this claim made many times. I have seen it brought up in debates and now it appears here. Um can some one show me an atheistic regime? Hitlers reigime well no, his whole idea was based on doing gods work Stalin,
O great Stalin, O leader of the peoples, Thou who broughtest man to birth. Thou who fructifies the earth, Thou who restorest to centuries, Thou who makest bloom the spring, Thou who makest vibrate the musical chords... Thou, splendour of my spring, O thou, Sun reflected by millions of hearts. Yea sounds verry atheistic to me he dint alowe worhip of gods but hey that dosent mean he dint love worhip of him. north korea well i think their leader got 11 holes in one while playing golf for the first time, again a noter cult of personality. But one could count america as having an atheistic regime you know the whole seperation of curch and state buisnes. Ok i know its a bad example cause you torture andkill people today , but i dont see any corelation between atheism and killing people. I do se a corelation between religion and killing people but that could be because its easy to manipulate people with religion, and that is why it is used so often to make people do bad things. Christianity, One woman's lie about an affair that got seriously out of hand
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Butterflytyrant Member (Idle past 4679 days) Posts: 415 From: Australia Joined:
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Hey folks,
Sorry about the big cut and paste but here goes -
quote: Source: http://www.angelfire.com/ky/nogod/deathtoll.html and similar source: Biblical Deaths: How Many Did God Kill? How Many Did Satan Kill?, page 1 It would seem to be an odd position to attempt to position yourself just above people like Hitler or Stalin and claim the moral high ground. So far, from the above count we have a bare minimum of 2.5 million. I would welcome any estimates of the amount of people killed in the flood, the firstborn of Israel and other figures marked with a question mark. If we have a conservative estimate for this, we can ask the other team to begin their task by equalling the death toll in their holy book. I could agree with you, but then we would both be wrong Butterfly, AKA, mallethead - Dawn Bertot "Superstitions and nonsense from the past should not prevent us from making progress. If we hold ourselves back, we admit that our fears are more powerful than our abilities." Hunters of Dune Herbert & Anderson 2011 leading candidate for the EvC Forum Don Quixote award
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Phat Member Posts: 18651 From: Denver,Colorado USA Joined: Member Rating: 4.3
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I would like to see support for the idea that the US killed more people than Soviet Russia or Nazi Germany, although you will try and tell us that Hitler was a Christian...(Though we in the club know better)
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frako Member Posts: 2932 From: slovenija Joined:
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although you will try and tell us that Hitler was a Christian...(Though we in the club know better) EDITED per admins request from mein kampf
I believe that I am acting in accordance with the will of the Almighty Creator: by defending myself against the Jew, I am fighting for the work of the Lord.." As a boy, Hitler attended to the Catholic church and experienced the anti-Semitic attitude of his culture. In his book, Mein Kampf, Hitler reveals himself as a fanatical believer in God and country. This text presents selected quotes from the infamous anti-Semite himself. Stuf gotten from http://nobeliefs.com/Hitler1.htm There is more evidence on the fact that hitler was christian or claiming to be christian then there is for evolution and we all know evolution is true You can find the same information that i previusly posted in the wall of quotes on the above site. Edited by frako, : No reason given. Edited by frako, : No reason given. Edited by frako, : No reason given.Christianity, One woman's lie about an affair that got seriously out of hand
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Phat Member Posts: 18651 From: Denver,Colorado USA Joined: Member Rating: 4.3
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frako writes: yes, but he obviously was not a real Christian, seeing as a real one would have the Holy, rather than the unholy spirit.
Do you want more evidence the guy believed in your imaginary friend or does this suffice??
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Chuck77 Inactive Member
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Phat writes: yes, but he obviously was not a real Christian Phat, you gotta know at your long time here at the forum that this response doesn't work with non-Christians. "No true scottsman" will be the response. People know Hitler wasn't actually doing Gods work by killing the Jews, who incidently were Gods chosen people, duh. Edited by Chuck77, : No reason given. Edited by Chuck77, : No reason given.
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