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Author | Topic: Modern Civics | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Jon Inactive Member |
So the guy lied and tricked his way into office.
Isn't that why your state has the recall procedure? It's seems like your democracy is working just the way it was designed to work. If the people really hate the guy so much, he'll get ousted. JonLove your enemies!
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frako Member (Idle past 305 days) Posts: 2932 From: slovenija Joined: |
That's the way it currently is. Do you honestly think this is the best way to run things? Well you cant inform people that are unwilling to be informed. When we have a referendum the whole wording of the law being put on a referendum is mailed to every house and 90% of the time it wanders directly into the bin cause the people know what they are going to do because their candidate said they should vote in that way. I actually skim the stuff they send to find the actual reason for the law, last time they wanted to change some stuff in the state run national television law. Both sides argued pointless stuff in the law, the actual reason was found in a little sentence that stated that employees of the state run radio and television company will not be regarded as public employees. Basicly that gave the right to give whatever high wage they wanted to the CEO or any other family they had working there. The rest of it was basically a way to get more funds in to the company to pay for these new outrageous wages. The bill was slameed down though 10% of the voters voted with 70% of them saying no because no one watches the channels they provide and so does not care what happens to them. 7% of voters read the law the other 3% belonged to the party in power lol the rest dint care to read the thing. Christianity, One woman's lie about an affair that got seriously out of hand
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New Cat's Eye Inactive Member |
But in a free democracy, people have the right to vote for things they don't understand; even to cast random blind-chance votes in a language they cannot read or perhaps even speak. And that's stupid and undesireable. Nobody wants a free democracy. And even if they did, there'd still be limits on who is allowed to vote.
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Perdition Member (Idle past 3237 days) Posts: 1593 From: Wisconsin Joined: |
I and others have been saying this for a while now. Great, and this is one way we can do that, by making people more informed.
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Jon Inactive Member |
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Jon Inactive Member |
Great, and this is one way we can do that, by making people more informed. LOL. Except that that is not what you have proposed. JonLove your enemies!
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Perdition Member (Idle past 3237 days) Posts: 1593 From: Wisconsin Joined: |
So the guy lied and tricked his way into office. No. The whole point is that he didn't lie, people just had no way to know what he said he'd do. Had they known, they may have voted differently.
Isn't that why your state has the recall procedure? The recall procedure exists to remove an office holder from office for whatever reason we want. If someone were willing to petition and could get enough signatures to oust someone because they wore white after Labor Day, they could do that.
It's seems like your democracy is working just the way it was designed to work. If the people really hate the guy so much, he'll get ousted. But after spending thousands of dollars of taxpayer money in order to fund an election. And after the cows have already left the barn, so to speak. The thing people are upset about, the collective bargaining, labor busting, has already passed, and it will take a long time for it to ever be fixed. Had the people who are upset about this turn of events known that he wanted to do so, as he said he did, they may have voted differently and we wouldn't have to be going through this.
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Perdition Member (Idle past 3237 days) Posts: 1593 From: Wisconsin Joined: |
Well you cant inform people that are unwilling to be informed. Very true. We can never get rid of stupid voters. But we can make the highest possible number of informed voters that we can.
When we have a referendum the whole wording of the law being put on a referendum is mailed to every house and 90% of the time it wanders directly into the bin cause the people know what they are going to do because their candidate said they should vote in that way. They don't do that around here. I think it would be a good first step, cuz it would at least help people like you, who are willing to read through it.
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Perdition Member (Idle past 3237 days) Posts: 1593 From: Wisconsin Joined: |
And that's stupid and undesireable. Nobody wants a free democracy. Not even ther founding fathers wanted one. That's why the dumb Electoral College exists. It's to protect the process from the stupid, uninformed masses...
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Perdition Member (Idle past 3237 days) Posts: 1593 From: Wisconsin Joined: |
LOL. Except that that is not what you have proposed. That is exactly what I have proposed. If you have a way to make that goal more likely, I'd love to hear it.
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New Cat's Eye Inactive Member
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So what the fuck is Jon even talking about!?
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Perdition Member (Idle past 3237 days) Posts: 1593 From: Wisconsin Joined: |
So what the fuck is Jon even talking about!? I think he's hung up on the possibility of my quiz idea being used to bar people from voting, and doesn't like any system that reduces that chance of someone being able to vote. I understand the criticism, and I have tried to make it as improbable as I can...and if anyone has a way to make it better, I would love to hear it. But he needs to realize that the goals of the writers of the constitution were not to have everyone vote. They only wanted those people they considered would be informed and would make intelligent, if opposing, choices. The history of this country has expanded that group to now include anyone over 18. With the exception of the Electoral College still existing. I'm certainly not advocating the removal of anyone from voting rolls, but making the voters more informed, perhaps even despite their wishes contrariwise, is, to me, a good goal.
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Jon Inactive Member |
Nobody wants a free democracy. I do.
And that's stupid and undesireable. Why? JonLove your enemies!
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New Cat's Eye Inactive Member |
I think he's hung up on the possibility of my quiz idea being used to bar people from voting, and doesn't like any system that reduces that chance of someone being able to vote. But why is he talking about a free democracy? I guess this is just another case of Jon being Jon. You're probably better off ignoring his nonsense.
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Jon Inactive Member |
But he needs to realize that the goals of the writers of the constitution were not to have everyone vote. They only wanted those people they considered would be informed and would make intelligent, if opposing, choices. The 'goals of the writers of the constitution' are 100% irrelevant.
but making the voters more informed, perhaps even despite their wishes contrariwise, is, to me, a good goal. I agree. And that's what this is for. JonLove your enemies!
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