"If I descended from an ape, how come apes are still here?"

That's a good one, I'll use it. Thanks.

I much prefer "If people are descended from grandparents, why are there still grandparents?". It shows the absurdity of the question.

I used to like that one better, too. It feels more direct and personal and should therefore be more effective, but when I've seen it used, including by myself, I've found that it has two problems:

1. Creationists don't accept that their own personal ancestry has anything to do with evolution.
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2. Grandparents are the same race of people as grand kids. Wolves are a different race from dogs, and since creationists acknowledge this it helps it work better.

--Percy

My thoughts too. But I'll use both.

Given the complete lack of scientific research coming from creationists it would seem that they have waved the white flag where the science is concerned. They know that they can not win the scientific argument. They lost a long time ago. The only argument they are trying to win now is a political one where they use lies and misrepresentation to try and convince an audience that does not understand the science. Evolution is both a theory and a fact. The theory of evolution explains the facts of evolution. Using the examples above, it is a fact that modern wolves, chihuahuas, and great danes all share a common ancestor that most resembled modern wolves. This is a fact of evolution. The theory of evolution explains why all three modern canid groups are different from each other which is through the proposed mechanisms of evolution (i.e. descent with modification through mutation and selection).

you did not descend from an ape ,man was created by gods, apes were made different,but they learned just enough to stay alive, that's why they are still here

Do you have any evidence to support that belief?

Once again, humans -are- apes.

Did you read the last version of the explanation at Message 95?Edited by Tangle, : Learning message linking......

The tale is told that when The Biggest Donkey Of All made the universe, he wept.And then he spoke as follows: "The clay of the earth is truth, for who will say otherwise?""But the water of my tears is falsehood, and in falsehood it will abide.""For the evolutionists will tell the truth, but the creationists will speak falsehood.""And behold, the number of the creationists shall be very many, because my tears shall be very many, and they shall be nourished by the water of my tears.""And fuck them, for they are idiots."

She's not uneducated. She has a B.A. degree.
I didn't say she was completely convinced - only that she seemed to find that my description of common descent was stated in a clear and somewhat entertaining way. I wasn't arguing anything. I was describing a method for describing common descent that I found very useful. How is finding a satisfactory way to describe something technical bragging? My impression was that it very much removed some of her confusion. She didn't seem to think our discussion had any bearing of God's love for her, or her love for Him. When I described her as "very religious", I didn't mean to imply she was a fundamentlist nutcase. She loves God and Jesus a lot, and worships them day and night. No. The topic was common descent.BTW amp, your sig kinda cracks me up... Common sense says that the earth is flat and the sun goes around it. Do you subscribe to these beliefs?

Hi jrchamblee, and welcome to the fray. Correct in the same way that a dog has not descended from dogs, because they already are dogs. but weren't apes also created by gods, and monkeys were made different?weren't monkeys created by gods, and lemurs made different? Bizarre.Do you realize that some chimpanzees are smarter than some humans? Perhaps humans "learned just enough to stay alive, that's why they are still here" as well?Of course when you apply this "theory" of how some things still exist to their capacity for cognition (does a tree think\learn?) it kind of breaks down. Badly. The theory of evolution, however, appears to provide cogent answers for the whole diversity of life as we know it.Do you know what evolution is? Do you understand the vast amount of evidence for evolution occurring all around us? Do you know what the theory of evolution is?Enjoy.

Here's one:If we descended from a common ancestor...how come we don't know who they were?While your all trying to answer that...i'll give a little history lesson to the lurkers everyone is always talking about.Once upon a time there was no common ancestor. We evolved from apes. Then, a big bright light went off in one or more, scientists head..."wait a second, this isn't going to work!"Sooooooo, the common ancestor was born...That ends story night for tonight boys and girls...

I presume that these are intended as examples of stupid things a creationist might say ?

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If we descended from a common ancestor...how come we don't know who they were?

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Obviously the fact that none of us can trace their ancestry that far back is the reason.

quote:

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While your all trying to answer that...i'll give a little history lesson to the lurkers everyone is always talking about.

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Once upon a time there was no common ancestor. We evolved from apes. Then, a big bright light went off in one or more, scientists head..."wait a second, this isn't going to work!"

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Sooooooo, the common ancestor was born...

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Pure fiction of course, and you'd have to be hopelesssly ignorant to believe it.

Hi PaulKAre you saying that within the TOE common ancestory has always been taught?PaulK, is this what you're saying?