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Author Topic:   An Alternate Creation Theory: Genic Energy
Admin
Director
Posts: 12646
From: EvC Forum
Joined: 06-14-2002
Member Rating: 2.5


Message 61 of 181 (672600)
09-09-2012 8:29 PM
Reply to: Message 60 by TheRestOfUs
09-09-2012 8:16 PM


Re: Moderator Warning
TheRestOfUs writes:

Will do to the best of my ability not being a scientist.

Yeah, they teach a lot of classes in how to use a discussion board at scientist school.

More helpfully, when you're typing in a reply, look to the left of the textbox you're typing into. There you'll help links for HTML code and dBCodes. The latter are formatting codes - they're the most useful and the ones I would recommend using.

You can also click on the "peek" button that appears at the bottom right of every post to see the actual text that was entered to create the post. Try it now on this message and you'll see how I created the quote at the top of this message.


--Percy
EvC Forum Director

This message is a reply to:
 Message 60 by TheRestOfUs, posted 09-09-2012 8:16 PM TheRestOfUs has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 62 by TheRestOfUs, posted 09-09-2012 8:32 PM Admin has responded

  
TheRestOfUs
Member (Idle past 2528 days)
Posts: 56
Joined: 09-08-2012


Message 62 of 181 (672601)
09-09-2012 8:32 PM
Reply to: Message 61 by Admin
09-09-2012 8:29 PM


Re: Moderator Warning
OK. I see the message box showing your post but how do I post including it in my answer?

Trou.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 61 by Admin, posted 09-09-2012 8:29 PM Admin has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 63 by Admin, posted 09-09-2012 9:03 PM TheRestOfUs has responded

  
Admin
Director
Posts: 12646
From: EvC Forum
Joined: 06-14-2002
Member Rating: 2.5


Message 63 of 181 (672605)
09-09-2012 9:03 PM
Reply to: Message 62 by TheRestOfUs
09-09-2012 8:32 PM


Re: Moderator Warning
TheRestOfUs writes:

OK. I see the message box showing your post but how do I post including it in my answer?

Just use copy-n-paste on text in another message, or on any text in any window on your computer.

Also useful when replying to a message is "Peek Mode". After clicking on the "reply" button you'll see a radio button for "Peek Mode" at the top of the message you're replying to (it's displayed in an area beneath the text box you type into). If you select "Peek Mode" then you again see the mark-up that produced the message. This is useful for copy-n-pasting text that has markup codes. For example, in if you select this word, italicized, and copy it all you'll get is the text. But if you first click on "Peek Mode" when replying to this message you'll be able to also copy the [i] and [/i] codes that encompass it.

I also notice that you sometimes edit a message many times. There's a preview button you can use before posting to see what a post will look like before you submit it.


--Percy
EvC Forum Director

This message is a reply to:
 Message 62 by TheRestOfUs, posted 09-09-2012 8:32 PM TheRestOfUs has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 64 by TheRestOfUs, posted 09-09-2012 9:10 PM Admin has responded

  
TheRestOfUs
Member (Idle past 2528 days)
Posts: 56
Joined: 09-08-2012


Message 64 of 181 (672606)
09-09-2012 9:10 PM
Reply to: Message 63 by Admin
09-09-2012 9:03 PM


Re: Moderator Warning
Just use copy-n-paste on text in another message, or on any text in any window on your computer.

Also useful when replying to a message is "Peek Mode". After clicking on the "reply" button you'll see a radio button for "Peek Mode" at the top of the message you're replying to (it's displayed in an area beneath the text box you type into). If you select "Peek Mode" then you again see the mark-up that produced the message. This is useful for copy-n-pasting text that has markup codes. For example, in if you select this word, italicized, and copy it all you'll get is the text. But if you first click on "Peek Mode" when replying to this message you'll be able to also copy the [i] and [/i] codes that encompass it.

I also notice that you sometimes edit a message many times. There's a preview button you can use before posting to see what a post will look like before you submit it.

Ok. Thanks for the tips. I'll get it eventually.

Trou


This message is a reply to:
 Message 63 by Admin, posted 09-09-2012 9:03 PM Admin has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 73 by Admin, posted 09-10-2012 8:43 AM TheRestOfUs has not yet responded

  
TheRestOfUs
Member (Idle past 2528 days)
Posts: 56
Joined: 09-08-2012


Message 65 of 181 (672611)
09-09-2012 9:54 PM


One of the most interesting predictions I think LaViolette made was due to subquantum kinetics unconventional view on the entomology of stars. He predicted that blue supergiant stars are much more likely to go supernova where the conventional view was that only red supergiants did so.

In 1987 Supernova 1987A was observed in the Large Magellenic Cloud. I believe this was the closest supernova in history. Astronomers located its precursor star on old photographic plates and were surprised to find that the precursor was a blue super giant!

His view is that contrary to conventional belief blue super giants are often among the oldest of stars and have a huge genic energy component included in their total energy output. He believes that this energy production can become runaway due to the solar wind's sub-luminary speed becoming in effect a cloud that reflects the radiant energy back onto the star, heating it up and increasing the genic energy buildup in the interior of the star which then further increases the genic energy production rate, which then builds to critical proportions resulting sometimes in a supernova, and at other times in a throwing off of a large proportion of the outer gaseous atmosphere. He also believes this process when it is less than critical is what explains why some stars are seen to pulsate. Once they've thrown off a significant amount of mass the genic energy production rate, (which is tied largely to gravity field potential), subsides and begins to slowly build again producing the pulsations.

I find this all quite fascinating.

Trou.

Edited by TheRestOfUs, : No reason given.

Edited by TheRestOfUs, : No reason given.

Edited by TheRestOfUs, : No reason given.

Edited by TheRestOfUs, : No reason given.


Replies to this message:
 Message 67 by Coragyps, posted 09-09-2012 10:07 PM TheRestOfUs has responded
 Message 69 by NoNukes, posted 09-09-2012 11:09 PM TheRestOfUs has responded
 Message 75 by JonF, posted 09-10-2012 9:18 AM TheRestOfUs has responded

  
TheRestOfUs
Member (Idle past 2528 days)
Posts: 56
Joined: 09-08-2012


Message 66 of 181 (672612)
09-09-2012 9:58 PM


Time to go get something to eat.

Later,

Trou


  
Coragyps
Member
Posts: 5407
From: Snyder, Texas, USA
Joined: 11-12-2002


Message 67 of 181 (672613)
09-09-2012 10:07 PM
Reply to: Message 65 by TheRestOfUs
09-09-2012 9:54 PM


unconventional view on the entomology of stars.

Stars got bugs??


This message is a reply to:
 Message 65 by TheRestOfUs, posted 09-09-2012 9:54 PM TheRestOfUs has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 68 by TheRestOfUs, posted 09-09-2012 10:12 PM Coragyps has not yet responded

  
TheRestOfUs
Member (Idle past 2528 days)
Posts: 56
Joined: 09-08-2012


Message 68 of 181 (672614)
09-09-2012 10:12 PM
Reply to: Message 67 by Coragyps
09-09-2012 10:07 PM


They'd be really HOT bugs for sure eh? No I meant the "life stages" of stars. Thanks for reminding me not to use words I'm not sure the precise meaning of.

Trou

Edited by TheRestOfUs, : No reason given.


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NoNukes
Inactive Member


Message 69 of 181 (672615)
09-09-2012 11:09 PM
Reply to: Message 65 by TheRestOfUs
09-09-2012 9:54 PM


He predicted that blue supergiant stars are much more likely to go supernova where the conventional view was that only red supergiants did so.

The conventional view is that a star may transition between being a red or blue super giant and that they spend more time being blue than red. I don't see how a single example of an exploding blue super giant overturns that theory.

His view is that contrary to conventional belief blue super giants are often among the oldest of stars

The conventional view is that blue super giants and red super giants are formed from large stars that have very short life spans compared to Sol. The oldest, and most numerous stars in the universe would be little bitty red stars and brown dwarfs that will never form super novas.

Edited by NoNukes, : No reason given.


Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)

The apathy of the people is enough to make every statue leap from its pedestal and hasten the resurrection of the dead. William Lloyd Garrison.

“Choose silence of all virtues, for by it you hear other men's imperfections, and conceal your own.” George Bernard Shaw


This message is a reply to:
 Message 65 by TheRestOfUs, posted 09-09-2012 9:54 PM TheRestOfUs has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 71 by TheRestOfUs, posted 09-10-2012 12:35 AM NoNukes has responded

  
NoNukes
Inactive Member


Message 70 of 181 (672616)
09-10-2012 12:29 AM
Reply to: Message 68 by TheRestOfUs
09-09-2012 10:12 PM


Encouragement...
I don't think every one of your posts is a gem, but I do think you are at least citing some experts, and I am reluctant to simply dismiss those citations as the work of cranks without giving a scientific explanation.

I also note that you aren't doing what a number of others have insisted on, namely simply insulting and dismissing the resident physicists out of hand as do some others. (Not going to name any names.) I hope you'll stick around.


Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)

The apathy of the people is enough to make every statue leap from its pedestal and hasten the resurrection of the dead. William Lloyd Garrison.

“Choose silence of all virtues, for by it you hear other men's imperfections, and conceal your own.” George Bernard Shaw


This message is a reply to:
 Message 68 by TheRestOfUs, posted 09-09-2012 10:12 PM TheRestOfUs has not yet responded

  
TheRestOfUs
Member (Idle past 2528 days)
Posts: 56
Joined: 09-08-2012


Message 71 of 181 (672617)
09-10-2012 12:35 AM
Reply to: Message 69 by NoNukes
09-09-2012 11:09 PM


Quotes from NoNukes,

"The conventional view is that a star may transition between being a red or blue super giant and that they spend more time being blue than red. I don't see how a single example of an exploding blue super giant overturns that theory."

"The conventional view is that blue super giants and red super giants are formed from large stars that have very short life spans compared to Sol. The oldest, and most numerous stars in the universe would be little bitty red stars and brown dwarfs that will never form super novas."

The conventional view you just stated about itty bitty red dwarfs being the oldest is the reverse of what LaViolette postulates. He believes that those small red dwarfs are often among the youngest of stars and are far more numerous than stars like our Sol and larger red and blue super giants which are often older.

When a star reaches a critical mass of about approx 0.45 solar mass nuclear fusion ignites and begins to suppliment its genic energy output. Subquantum kinetics predicts that red dwarfs often evolve from brown dwarfs generating this genic energy as well as Hydrogen gas in the interior. As Jupiter sized planets given enough time evolve into brown dwarfs due to both accretion and continous matter and energy creation in the interiors of these bodies.

When the genic energy component gets high enough in the super giant phase they may indeed become unstable and if massive enough go supernova. Or form planetary nebulae and then start a slow growth in a white dwarf or neutron star phase and exceed the Chandra Limit and become a new "Mother Star" powered almost exclusively by genic energy rather than nuclear fusion.

Indeed Laviolette believes that red and blue super giants transition from blue to red and back again due to a number of factors. (outer cooler atmosphere being shed to reveal a hotter inner atmosphere.). However they aren't always soley accreted from large nebular gas clouds but may have grown from as I mentioned brown, red, yellow and larger star phases and so may be among the oldest of stars. The genic energy hypothesis makes the difference since it is contributing not only energy but additional hydrogen gas fuel. Actually he predicts that white dwarfs left over from stars like our sun or planetary nebula (or even supernova that don't smash everything to smithereens) may be the oldest stars and far from being just dead cooling off remains, be just begining to grow, (as I mentioned), into a primarily genic energy powered "Mother Star".

Just some thoughts.

Trou

Edited by TheRestOfUs, : No reason given.

Edited by TheRestOfUs, : No reason given.

Edited by TheRestOfUs, : No reason given.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 69 by NoNukes, posted 09-09-2012 11:09 PM NoNukes has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 97 by NoNukes, posted 09-10-2012 3:06 PM TheRestOfUs has responded

  
PaulK
Member
Posts: 15562
Joined: 01-10-2003
Member Rating: 3.0


Message 72 of 181 (672618)
09-10-2012 2:40 AM
Reply to: Message 56 by TheRestOfUs
09-09-2012 6:57 PM


Re: Not enough.
I find that claimed predictions re not always as good as they appear.

So I did a little research, choosing this one:

quote:

"Prediction No. 2 (1985): Subquantum kinetics predicted that gravity should have two polarities correlated with charge and that the electron should produce a matter-repelling gravity field. Furthermore it predicted that monopolar electric discharges should produce longitudinal electric potential waves accompanied by a gravity potential component. Published in: 1985 (IJGS), and 1994 (Subquantum Kinetics)."

"Verification (2001): Podkletnov and Modanese discover that an axial high-voltage electron discharge produces a matter-repelling gravity wave that travels in the direction of the discharge exerting a longitudinal repulsive gravatational force on a distant test mass."


It turns out that Podkletnov's work sounds very dubious, and hasn't been replicated. Eugene Podkletnov

It's not a good sign that this should be mentioned high up the list, without mentioning the questionable nature of the alleged verification.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 56 by TheRestOfUs, posted 09-09-2012 6:57 PM TheRestOfUs has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 78 by TheRestOfUs, posted 09-10-2012 12:12 PM PaulK has responded

  
Admin
Director
Posts: 12646
From: EvC Forum
Joined: 06-14-2002
Member Rating: 2.5


Message 73 of 181 (672634)
09-10-2012 8:43 AM
Reply to: Message 64 by TheRestOfUs
09-09-2012 9:10 PM


Quoting Text
All that remains to do is to place a [qs] at the beginning of the copied text, and a [/qs] at the end. For example, if this is the text you want to quote:

Red stars are actually young, not old.

Then you would copy-and-paste it into your textbox and put a [qs] at the front and a [/qs] at the back:

[qs]Red stars are actually young, not old.[/qs]

When you preview or post the message it will look like this:

Red stars are actually young, not old.

If you add an author like this:

[qs=TheRestOfUs]Red stars are actually young, not old.[/qs]

Then it would end up looking like this:

TheRestOfUs writes:

Red stars are actually young, not old.


--Percy
EvC Forum Director

This message is a reply to:
 Message 64 by TheRestOfUs, posted 09-09-2012 9:10 PM TheRestOfUs has not yet responded

  
JonF
Member
Posts: 5534
Joined: 06-23-2003
Member Rating: 3.2


(1)
Message 74 of 181 (672637)
09-10-2012 9:14 AM
Reply to: Message 43 by TheRestOfUs
09-09-2012 12:52 PM


You're going to have to come up with much more that 80-odd year old quotes from very smart people who turned out to be wrong. I see you're in love with ancient history on the Pioneer anomaly (which is now off topic) too. I sense a pttern here.

You claim you have new physics. Can the appeals to ancient authority and let's see the math.

Ooh, oooh, wait, wait, don't tell me. Your "new physics" is based solely on your common sense, doesn't explain any evidence, makes no testable predictions to differentiate it from mainstream science, and involves absolutely no mathematical analysis. Sound about right?

Hubble's paper and Tesla's claim have some historical interest. And, of course, by comparing what you claimed about Hubble's paper to what's contained in Hubble's paper we've learned quite a bit about you. But as far as science is concerned, there may have been some there once but there's nothing now. We've moved literally billions of light-years beyond those days.

If you want to refere to an authority, stick to those published in this century.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 43 by TheRestOfUs, posted 09-09-2012 12:52 PM TheRestOfUs has not yet responded

  
JonF
Member
Posts: 5534
Joined: 06-23-2003
Member Rating: 3.2


(1)
Message 75 of 181 (672638)
09-10-2012 9:18 AM
Reply to: Message 65 by TheRestOfUs
09-09-2012 9:54 PM


He predicted that blue supergiant stars are much more likely to go supernova where the conventional view was that only red supergiants did so.

Really? Reference for that claim about red supergiants please.

Hint: tain't so.

In 1987 Supernova 1987A was observed in the Large Magellenic Cloud.

Yup.

I believe this was the closest supernova in history.

Nope. Out of date again. Pattern continues.

Astronomers located its precursor star on old photographic plates and were surprised to find that the precursor was a blue super giant!

Yup (except perhaps for the surprise part, I find no trace of that). So what?

Edited by JonF, : No reason given.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 65 by TheRestOfUs, posted 09-09-2012 9:54 PM TheRestOfUs has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 77 by TheRestOfUs, posted 09-10-2012 11:32 AM JonF has responded
 Message 81 by NoNukes, posted 09-10-2012 12:26 PM JonF has not yet responded

  
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