Summations Only

The US government is the biggest "business" there is

No, this is exactly wrong. The US government, particularly at the Presidental level, isn't a business and it isn't run like a business. For instance, Congress doesn't report to the President and they don't take orders from him. In fact, they don't have to do anything.

That requires a very different kind of leadership. Romney has only ever led in situations where his authority comes with an obligation of his subordinates to obey. But Congress is subordinate to no one; leading the United States from the office of the President is a process of consensus-building, not a process where you simply hand down marching orders.

Contrast Obama's incredibly effective term as President with Romney's essential non-activity as governor, and you can see that Obama's experience has served him much better than Romney's. For that matter, look at their campaigns - Obama has yet to make a mistake, but Romney is dealing with defections, gaffes, mixed messages, and other symptoms of failing leadership at the top.

I think this has been proven over the last nearly four years.

Look, you're entitled to your own opinion but not your own facts. The fact is, Obama is the most successful Democratic president of my lifetime, and yours. Maybe you don't like his agenda but he's been undeniably effective in getting it passed. The notion that Obama suffers from a "lack of leadership" is just another one of those contradictory things that conservatives keep trying to pin on him - he's the Chicago insider who's foreign birth estranges him from the idea of America, he's the messianic leader who no one will follow, he's the empty suit with the gift of gab who can't speak clearly without a teleprompter. None of it sticks because none of it makes any sense, unless you're trapped inside the "epistemic closure" of the conservative bubble.

Nice try. Our current president does not compare in any way to MLK. Nor to Jesus.

Not trying to compare him to either on a personal level.

You are the one that brought up commuter organizer as a disqualifier. I was saying that there have been many examples of community organizers who are resounding successes and that being a community organizer can be great expirience for leadership in political offices.

He was undistinguished in all of those. But he was not a true failure until he reached the presidency.

In what ways?

He has failed on jobs, the economy, debt levels, and illegal immigration, to name a few. OK, one more--foreign policy.

How? Who do you consider successful in these areas? And if so why? Than we can compare.

Right now you are just speaking in Republican talking points with no real substance. Produce the facts and then we can get down to buisness and see what the truth is.

You seem to speak in the same terms that YEC do when debating a scientist about evolution. Throwing meaningless jargon, quips and talking points with no facts to back them up, hoping they will stick will not help you.

Are you better off than you were 6 trillion dollars ago?

Actually yes. I have a net increase in pay and my house has gone up in value. Wall street has rebounded and my thrift savings program (equivalent to an IRA) after the initial dip in 2009 has increased by about 20k dollars over the last two years.

Edited by DevilsAdvocate, : No reason given.

The notion that Obama suffers from a "lack of leadership" is just another one of those contradictory things that conservatives keep trying to pin on him - he's the Chicago insider who's foreign birth estranges him from the idea of America, he's the messianic leader who no one will follow, he's the empty suit with the gift of gab who can't speak clearly without a teleprompter.

And he's been completely ineffectual in advancing his agenda and has turned America into a Communist country.

But one is proud of being a "community organizer" and a redistributionalist, while the other at least has some genuine accomplishments to his credit.

Yeah, let's list them.

(1) Romneycare.
(2) Er ...
(3) ... that's it?

He has failed on jobs, the economy, debt levels, and illegal immigration, to name a few. OK, one more--foreign policy.

He was handed a sinking ship.

Are you better off than you were 6 trillion dollars ago?

I sure am. Much much better in fact.

- Oni

Oo, that's a good one, too. Oh, and also - he's the guy who never stops working to undermine America but takes too many vacations.

Edited by crashfrog, : No reason given.

He'd never have been elected if he weren't black, but he isn't really black.

(3) ... that's it?

Don't forget that he saved the Olympics...

... with a government bailout.

When it comes to releasing the tax returns, .. I will note that in 2011, he was campaigning for Presidency, so of COURSE he wouldn't do anything that would trigger alarms.

According to the bible, Pharaoh was a rich job creator.. God sided with a community organizer.

If anything, god has always sided with the community organizer and the poor sympathizer. Remember the story about Jesus observing 2 people giving money to the rich? One was a rich man who gave a whole shitload of gold coins and the other was a poor widow who gave a single coin. Which one of the 2 gave more, Jesus ask?

Of course today's republicans would say the rich man gave more. Jesus, on the other hand, said it was the poor widow that gave more.

Somehow along the way the republican party has been taken over by a whole bunch of hypocrites who don't even know their own goddamn fairy tale.

You forgot:

5)Exceptionally good at not being named Barack Obama
6)Being white

He was undistinguished in all of those. But he was not a true failure until he reached the presidency. He has failed on jobs, the economy, debt levels, and illegal immigration, to name a few. OK, one more--foreign policy.

Ok.. so you argument against Obama is 'Obama didn't clean up the mess he was left fast enough, so vote republican so they can institute the polices that caused the problems to begin with?'??

Well, if the fireman with the firehose still hasn't put the fire out, obviously the guy to turn to is the arsonist with his can of gasoline. That's just common sense.