Summations Only

Faith writes:First, how can you justify the basic craziness of getting a bunch of clearly average believers together with professional scientists and think anything about the creation-evolution debate could be revealed this way? The "creationists" on the bus trip hardly know anything about creationism or the Bible either for all I can tell, or science of any sort.

Faith writes:Evolution is not science, it's all smoke and mirrors. Science is something else.

Faith writes:This is pernicious nonsense, Tangle. Every time somebody says this it's painfully clear how little any of you understand.

Faith writes:It doesn't invalidate the field of geology at all, the age of the earth is entirely an interpretive scheme. The only actual science it contradicts is radiometric dating, which someday will be proved to be false but meanwhile that's the only science that takes a hit. Everything else is interpretation or theory. Everything in geology is quite easily accommodated in 6000 years. You only THINK the billions of years has been scientifically established. It's all smoke and mirrors.

Faith writes:Sorry, Tangle, there's really nothing in Geology as such that contradicts a young earth.

25 million years ago
Long before man appeared on the planet, the south east of England was a low-lying landscape covered by a large shallow freshwater lake with several rivers flowing into it. These rivers carried vast amounts of clay or mud, which started to build up in layers on the bed of the lake. Eventually the clays reached a thickness of nearly 200 metres, forming the first layer known as the Weald Clay.
110 million years ago — the sea breaks through?
The land continued to sink until eventually the ocean broke in laying down massive layers of sand known as Lower Greensand. The sea gradually deepened and the waters became still. Under these conditions, a thick dark mud collected known as Gault Clay. After this period, there were strong underwater currents in the sea and the sandier sediments of the Upper Greensand were deposited. 97 million years ago — chalk and flint
It was during this time that the sea began to lay down the chalk of the South Downs as we know it today. Chalk is a white soft limestone, which has been formed from the skeletons of marine creatures deposited, squeezed and eventually fossilised on the sea-bed. This process continued for 20 million years and to a thickness of more than 300 metres . The white, pure limestone of the Chalk is superbly exposed at the great chalk cliffs of the Seven Sisters between the River Cuckmere and Beachy Head near Eastbourne.The chalk contains flint which is the only hard rock to be found on the Downs. If you look at the great chalk cliffs of the Seven Sisters near Eastbourne you will be able to see narrow, dark grey bands of flint at regular intervals of a metre or so, up the cliff face. Flint was formed from the skeletons of minute animals, such as radiolarians, that floated around in those ancient seas.After a field has been freshly ploughed, it looks like a stony wasteland as you can see how the flints have been unearthed and risen to the surface. Early people on the Downs found that they could use the razor-sharp edges of flaked flint as a cutting tool. Some of the best preserved flint mines can be found on the South Downs, especially at Cissbury, above Worthing. You can also see displays on flint working at Worthing Museum. 65 million years ago
It was at the beginning of this period that the ocean floor began to rise, the sea became shallower and the formation of chalk stopped. Deposits of clays, pebbles and sands were laid down. 20 million years — The Alpine Storm
Did you know?
Chalk contains visible fossils of creatures that lived in the sea 90 million years ago, including ammonites, sea urchins and fish sponges.
During this time the South Downs were raised from the seabed, through the movement of the earth’s crust. The land masses or ‘tectonic plates’ of Africa and Europe moved towards each other and collided. The rocks were pushed up and created mountain ranges, including the Himalayas and the Alps. The south east of England was caught up in this ‘Alpine Storm’ and the ripples pushed the layers of rock upwards forming a vast extended dome of chalk (See Figure 3). The neat layers of sands, clays and chalk, laid down over millions of years in fresh and salt water gradually hardened into rock.Over millions of years, the landscape has gradually changed shape to form the South Downs as we know it today. The centre of the dome has been eroded. The soft chalk at the top of the dome gradually cracked and crumbled and the falling rain carried off these shattered pieces of chalk. This left an outer upstanding rim of chalk surrounding a lowland plain formed from older layers of clay and sandstone. The outer rim of chalk forms the uplands of the North and South Downs and the central plain is known as the Weald. 2 Million years ago - The Ice ages
Although the South East of England was not covered in ice, an intensely cold climate dominated this area. This meant that the rock and soil was frozen for most of the year. Summer rain and melt-water could not soak into the frozen chalk. So this water formed streams which carved out valleys on the Downs. The rapidly melting snow during the last ice age also carried rock and soil from the hillsides on to the floors of the valleys.The dry valley at Devil's Dyke near Brighton When the climate became warmer, the frozen ground eventually thawed and the water soaked into the little holes in the chalk, leaving the valleys dry. These dry valleys, known in Sussex as coombes, are V-shaped with steep sides. The Devil’s Dyke, to the north of Brighton, is the most famous of all the chalk dry valleys. Patches of Clay-with-flints can be found in places on top of the Downs. This is the remains of some clay that was once on top of the chalk that got mixed up with flints from the chalk.

Faith writes:I'd already heard everything you said, Coyote, it isn't new to me, it's you who need to find out more about these things. And I haven't claimed I don't make errors, I've only given generalizations that I'm sure are true in the main and I know you are wrong. I'm sorry I can't just produce the evidence for you, I do have some but the rest isn't all that available, and it's an overwhelming task to try to come up with all the proof that would be needed not just on this subject but the dozen others this thread has already covered. I'm not writing papers for a journal, here.

Faith writes: Sorry, the Bible is the foundation. The facts do have to conform to it, and ultimately we'll see that to be the case. Meanwhile anything that contradicts the Bible has to go.

Faith writes: It's known for DISSOLVING stuff. Soaking, saturating, dissolving.

Faith writes: Oh come on Tangle that's REALLY ridiculous. The earth isn't made of marble, and the earth would have been pummeled by rain for 40 days already., Whatever could dissolve would dissolve. If it rains for even three days off and on where I am I get a six inch deep muddy stream outside my door. Don't tell me it's all that different where the rest of you live.

Faith writes:What's very odd here is that I haven't said one word about dissolving ROCKS, you guys are making that up. Tangle and now you. I've said many times that the Flood would have dissolved WHATEVER COULD BE DISSOLVED.

..........so yeah, some rock would most likely dissolve.

I have no idea what rock existed before the Flood

Granite didn't because that's a product of volcanism and volcanoes didn't occur until the Flood. Etc. etc.

Faith writes:It's the layering itself that I consider to be major evidence for the Flood, and the old earth explanation of the layers is inconsistent with the mechanics of how layering could occur and imposes fantastic scenario-building nonsense on what is nothing but a mechanically produced slab of rock.