Understanding through Discussion


Welcome! You are not logged in. [ Login ]
EvC Forum active members: 67 (9078 total)
104 online now:
kjsimons, nwr, PaulK, Phat, Sarah Bellum, Tangle, vimesey, xongsmith (8 members, 96 visitors)
Newest Member: harveyspecter
Post Volume: Total: 895,050 Year: 6,162/6,534 Month: 355/650 Week: 125/278 Day: 23/24 Hour: 0/3


Thread  Details

Email This Thread
Newer Topic | Older Topic
  
Author Topic:   The SEVEN "DAYS" WERE GEOLOGICAL ERAS
Eli
Member (Idle past 2805 days)
Posts: 274
Joined: 08-24-2012


Message 61 of 310 (682491)
12-03-2012 3:07 AM
Reply to: Message 60 by kofh2u
12-03-2012 12:20 AM


Re: Genesis 1 is falsified at the first verse.
Academicaly and scientifically correct, how?

Transitory things = piss.

So, on the whole, you have claimed that during the big bang specifically in the inflation era 14 billion years ago, the earth was formed... out of piss.

What peer reviewed source is that again that you claim confirms this?


This message is a reply to:
 Message 60 by kofh2u, posted 12-03-2012 12:20 AM kofh2u has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 65 by kofh2u, posted 12-03-2012 10:21 AM Eli has replied

  
Pressie
Member
Posts: 2102
From: Pretoria, SA
Joined: 06-18-2010


Message 62 of 310 (682492)
12-03-2012 3:15 AM
Reply to: Message 60 by kofh2u
12-03-2012 12:20 AM


Re: Genesis 1 is falsified at the first verse.
What a lot of wishful thinking.

You even have to change the meaning of words to try to pretend that your beliefs are based on reality.

For example, the word "void" certainly does not mean "not valid as a sphere yet- i.e.; an accretion disk" at all.

The word 'void' means empty space.

Changing language to fit your ridiculous beliefs?


This message is a reply to:
 Message 60 by kofh2u, posted 12-03-2012 12:20 AM kofh2u has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 76 by kofh2u, posted 12-03-2012 12:01 PM Pressie has not replied

  
NoNukes
Inactive Member


Message 63 of 310 (682494)
12-03-2012 6:29 AM
Reply to: Message 58 by kofh2u
12-03-2012 12:05 AM


Re: Genesis 1 is falsified at the first verse.
You are completely skipping the 'Let there be' portions of day four. But you don't do that for other days. That suggests to me that you are chosing the wrong meaning for set. Put seems to be the proper meaning. Let there be seems to create the stars.

Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)

The apathy of the people is enough to make every statue leap from its pedestal and hasten the resurrection of the dead. William Lloyd Garrison.

If there is no struggle, there is no progress. Those who profess to favor freedom, and deprecate agitation, are men who want crops without plowing up the ground, they want rain without thunder and lightning. Frederick Douglass


This message is a reply to:
 Message 58 by kofh2u, posted 12-03-2012 12:05 AM kofh2u has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 79 by kofh2u, posted 12-03-2012 12:18 PM NoNukes has replied

  
Panda
Member (Idle past 3026 days)
Posts: 2688
From: UK
Joined: 10-04-2010


Message 64 of 310 (682496)
12-03-2012 8:05 AM
Reply to: Message 59 by kofh2u
12-03-2012 12:16 AM


Re: Selective learning
kofh2u writes:

These the seven Eras up until now which I see mentioned in the Link:


I know that you only see 7.
But there are 9 in the link you provided.

kofh2u writes:

NOW, The Hadean Era = Matter Era


That is just plain wrong.
They overlap, but they are not the same.
It is as wrong-headed as saying "Today = this year = this century - therefore they are all the same period of time!"

quote:
Separation of the Electroweak force
Close to the end of the quark era, the Electroweak force separated and the weak interaction, from then on, the forces of nature and physical laws were as they are now experienced. This era was about 1.1 microseconds and temperatures reached 1000 trillion degrees.
(I emphasised a part of the quote in case you decide to claim it is not an era.)

You also excluded the Matter era, even though it began before the earth was formed (which puts it firmly within the scope of the Genesis account).
In fact, most of the Genesis account occurs after the Matter Era began.

quote:
Matter Era
At the start of our present era, photons were free to travel through the Universe. Most electrons were bound to atoms until the first stars formed, reheating matter. The diameter of the Universe is currently 100 million light years and rising. (1 light year = 9.6 trillion kilometres)

And why are you excluding the other eras I listed?
(bolded due to your reluctance to answer.)

There are more than 7 cosmological eras - your own link says so.

Edited by Panda, : No reason given.

Edited by Panda, : No reason given.

Edited by Panda, : No reason given.


"There is no great invention, from fire to flying, which has not been hailed as an insult to some god." J. B. S. Haldane

This message is a reply to:
 Message 59 by kofh2u, posted 12-03-2012 12:16 AM kofh2u has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 67 by kofh2u, posted 12-03-2012 10:41 AM Panda has replied

  
kofh2u
Member (Idle past 3133 days)
Posts: 1162
From: phila., PA
Joined: 04-05-2004


Message 65 of 310 (682498)
12-03-2012 10:21 AM
Reply to: Message 61 by Eli
12-03-2012 3:07 AM


Re: Genesis 1 is falsified at the first verse.

Academicaly and scientifically correct, how?
Transitory things = piss.

Gen 1:2 tells us, first, that t earth is void of its spherical shape, hence we can reason that it is described as in the form of the accretion disk of rotating rocks which are like murky "waters" of hot magma.

This interpretation seems fair and supported by the facts.

Theistic Evolution Bible believers prefer to choose this way of understanding Gen 1:2 because it conforms with the truth.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 61 by Eli, posted 12-03-2012 3:07 AM Eli has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 66 by jar, posted 12-03-2012 10:31 AM kofh2u has replied
 Message 72 by Eli, posted 12-03-2012 11:39 AM kofh2u has not replied

  
jar
Member
Posts: 33957
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004
Member Rating: 2.2


Message 66 of 310 (682499)
12-03-2012 10:31 AM
Reply to: Message 65 by kofh2u
12-03-2012 10:21 AM


Re: Genesis 1 is falsified at the first verse.
Gen 1:2 tells us, first, that t earth is void of its spherical shape, hence we can reason that it is described as in the form of the accretion disk of rotating rocks which are like murky "waters" of hot magma.

Sorry but a disk is still a form. You even say that "hence we can reason that it is described as in the form of the accretion disk of rotating rocks which are like murky "waters" of hot magma."

Once again you are simply making shit up and misrepresenting what the Bible says. Genesis 1:2 does not say that the earth was in the form of an accretion disk of rotating rocks which are like murky "waters" of hot magma and in fact it precludes any such interpretation.

Since it's clear you have never read Genesis 1, here is Genesis 1:2 for you.

quote:
2 And the earth was without form, and void; and darkness was upon the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters.

Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 65 by kofh2u, posted 12-03-2012 10:21 AM kofh2u has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 68 by kofh2u, posted 12-03-2012 10:45 AM jar has replied

  
kofh2u
Member (Idle past 3133 days)
Posts: 1162
From: phila., PA
Joined: 04-05-2004


Message 67 of 310 (682501)
12-03-2012 10:41 AM
Reply to: Message 64 by Panda
12-03-2012 8:05 AM


Re: Selective learning

There are nine eras:

quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Separation of the Electroweak force
Close to the end of the quark era, the Electroweak force separated and the weak interaction, from then on, the forces of nature and physical laws were as they are now experienced. This era was about 1.1 microseconds and temperatures reached 1000 trillion degrees.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

(I emphasised a part of the quote in case you decide to claim it is not an era.)

1) BBLE, QUIBBLE, QUIBBLE...

2) Here is the exact quote from the link:

The Quark Era

This period saw vast number of quark and anti quark pairs forming from energy and then annihilating back to energy. Gluons and other particles also appeared. This eras lifespan was about 100 millionth of a yocto second and was approximately 10 billion billion degrees centigrade.

Separation of the Electroweak force
Close to the end of the quark era, the Electroweak force separated and the weak interaction, from then on, the forces of nature and physical laws were as they are now experienced. This era was about 1.1 microseconds and temperatures reached 1000 trillion degrees.

Read more: http://scienceray.com/...uide-to-the-big-bang/#ixzz2E0FreieE

The link specifically says that the "Separation of the Electroweak force" takes place "near the end of the Quark Era."
It is in part of that Era, therefore.

The Matter Era is an eighth Era which this science writer counts, as did the other some graphic examples I posted. He describes this eighth somewhat idiosyncratically and differently from the others, but illustrates the science discipline's propensity to favor seven very much as does the bible.

... and eight is't bad anyway:

Ecclesiastes 11:2
Give a portion to seven, and also to eight; for thou knowest not what evil shall be upon the earth.

Edited by kofh2u, : No reason given.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 64 by Panda, posted 12-03-2012 8:05 AM Panda has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 73 by Eli, posted 12-03-2012 11:43 AM kofh2u has not replied
 Message 74 by Panda, posted 12-03-2012 11:44 AM kofh2u has replied

  
kofh2u
Member (Idle past 3133 days)
Posts: 1162
From: phila., PA
Joined: 04-05-2004


Message 68 of 310 (682502)
12-03-2012 10:45 AM
Reply to: Message 66 by jar
12-03-2012 10:31 AM


Re: Genesis 1 is falsified at the first verse.

Sorry but a disk is still a form.

This quibbling over every minute point is like the sieve that the Pharisees used to examine what Jesus was saying, while they swallowed their own interpretations of the scriptures which were anti-science and even irrational.

Look at the diagram I posted above.
Can you NOT see that the form of what was to become a spherical global Earth started formless, as hot gases and as if a vague cloud of matter that was void of a geometric shape???


This message is a reply to:
 Message 66 by jar, posted 12-03-2012 10:31 AM jar has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 69 by jar, posted 12-03-2012 10:48 AM kofh2u has replied
 Message 70 by NoNukes, posted 12-03-2012 10:57 AM kofh2u has not replied

  
jar
Member
Posts: 33957
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004
Member Rating: 2.2


Message 69 of 310 (682503)
12-03-2012 10:48 AM
Reply to: Message 68 by kofh2u
12-03-2012 10:45 AM


Re: Genesis 1 is falsified at the first verse.
A cloud has form. That why we can point to one and say "That is a cloud." A cloud is also not void.

You are just making shit up and moving the goal posts at will.


Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 68 by kofh2u, posted 12-03-2012 10:45 AM kofh2u has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 78 by kofh2u, posted 12-03-2012 12:11 PM jar has replied
 Message 85 by kofh2u, posted 12-03-2012 1:34 PM jar has replied

  
NoNukes
Inactive Member


Message 70 of 310 (682505)
12-03-2012 10:57 AM
Reply to: Message 68 by kofh2u
12-03-2012 10:45 AM


Re: Genesis 1 is falsified at the first verse.
You want us to believe that the dust cloud was void, formless, and also to constitute 'the waters' for God to move across. Then later on, you want the waters to be the ocean. I find that quite a bit of a stretch.

Edited by NoNukes, : No reason given.


Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)

The apathy of the people is enough to make every statue leap from its pedestal and hasten the resurrection of the dead. William Lloyd Garrison.

If there is no struggle, there is no progress. Those who profess to favor freedom, and deprecate agitation, are men who want crops without plowing up the ground, they want rain without thunder and lightning. Frederick Douglass


This message is a reply to:
 Message 68 by kofh2u, posted 12-03-2012 10:45 AM kofh2u has not replied

  
Taq
Member
Posts: 8524
Joined: 03-06-2009


(1)
Message 71 of 310 (682506)
12-03-2012 11:37 AM


Completely Arbitrary
This is nothing more than mental self loving. If the Bible said that there were 9 days you would claim that there were 9 eras. If the Bible said that there were 4 days you would claim that there are 4 eras. You are arbitrarily dividing up time to fit your preconceived conclusions.

What is stopping me from claiming that there are 20 eras?


  
Eli
Member (Idle past 2805 days)
Posts: 274
Joined: 08-24-2012


Message 72 of 310 (682508)
12-03-2012 11:39 AM
Reply to: Message 65 by kofh2u
12-03-2012 10:21 AM


Re: Genesis 1 is falsified at the first verse.
kofh2u writes:

Gen 1:2 tells us, first, that t earth is void of its spherical shape, hence we can reason that it is described as in the form of the accretion disk of rotating rocks which are like murky "waters" of hot magma. This interpretation seems fair and supported by the facts.

Theistic Evolution Bible believers prefer to choose this way of understanding Gen 1:2 because it conforms with the truth.

No, it doesn't tell us what attributes the earth is void of. You cannot say that it tells us it is void of it's spherical shape anymore than I can pinpoint that it may be saying it is void of life, light, void of its moon, void of anything in particular.

You might be able to make a case for "without form" but, as it has already been pointed out, an accretion disk is a particular form. So, no, your interpretation is not fair or supported by the facts.

waters does not mean "magma." That is not an interpretation. It is an interjection.

The facts are that there is enough ambiguity in the language, that on the merits of a single verse alone, your private interpretation may be acceptible to you, but there really is no substance to the interpretation and no valid reason for the interjections.

And I don't know what you mean by "theistic evolution bible believers prefer this interpretation."

Theistic evolutionists do not try to make the bible conform to science. Such confirmation biases are not preferable to theistic evolutionists.

They prefer to claim that these passages are figurative, not literal, and they refuse the idea that the bible is meant to be a science book.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 65 by kofh2u, posted 12-03-2012 10:21 AM kofh2u has not replied

  
Eli
Member (Idle past 2805 days)
Posts: 274
Joined: 08-24-2012


Message 73 of 310 (682509)
12-03-2012 11:43 AM
Reply to: Message 67 by kofh2u
12-03-2012 10:41 AM


Re: Selective learning
kofh2u writes:

The link specifically says that the "Separation of the Electroweak force" takes place "near the end of the Quark Era."
It is in part of that Era, therefore.

That doesn't mean that the electroweak era is not its own.

This is more numerological bullshit and cognitive bias.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 67 by kofh2u, posted 12-03-2012 10:41 AM kofh2u has not replied

  
Panda
Member (Idle past 3026 days)
Posts: 2688
From: UK
Joined: 10-04-2010


Message 74 of 310 (682510)
12-03-2012 11:44 AM
Reply to: Message 67 by kofh2u
12-03-2012 10:41 AM


Re: Selective learning
kofh2u writes:

1) BBLE, QUIBBLE, QUIBBLE...


If the number of eras is just quibbling, then why do you keep saying it is 7?
It is clearly more than 7 - but you keep quibbling over it.

kofh2u writes:

The Matter Era is an eighth Era which this science writer counts, as did the other some graphic examples I posted. He describes this eighth somewhat idiosyncratically and differently from the others, but illustrates the science discipline's propensity to favor seven very much as does the bible.


The article's inclusion of an 8th era is indicative of its fondness for the number 7?
hahah!

kofh2u writes:

... and eight is't bad anyway:


How about '9'?

So far you have provided:
1) The Inflation Era
2) The Quark Era
3) Hadron Era
4) Lepton Era
5) Nucleosynthesis Era
6) Opaque Era
7) Matter Era
And from your own link:
8) The Planck Era
9) Separation of the Electroweak force

Then there are other eras you are conveniently ignoring:
10) Grand unification Era
11) Recombination Era

Is '11' a good number as well?


"There is no great invention, from fire to flying, which has not been hailed as an insult to some god." J. B. S. Haldane

This message is a reply to:
 Message 67 by kofh2u, posted 12-03-2012 10:41 AM kofh2u has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 77 by kofh2u, posted 12-03-2012 12:07 PM Panda has replied

  
Eli
Member (Idle past 2805 days)
Posts: 274
Joined: 08-24-2012


(1)
Message 75 of 310 (682514)
12-03-2012 11:51 AM


Bottom line:

Cognitive bias is the antithesis to scientific inquiry and academic honesty.

If we begin with an agenda that we need to break things up into sevens, we are no longer talking about science.


  
Newer Topic | Older Topic
Jump to:


Copyright 2001-2018 by EvC Forum, All Rights Reserved

™ Version 4.1
Innovative software from Qwixotic © 2022