Understanding through Discussion


Welcome! You are not logged in. [ Login ]
EvC Forum active members: 63 (9072 total)
58 online now:
PaulK, Stile (2 members, 56 visitors)
Newest Member: FossilDiscovery
Post Volume: Total: 893,231 Year: 4,343/6,534 Month: 557/900 Week: 81/182 Day: 15/38 Hour: 0/3

Announcements: Security Update Released


Thread  Details

Email This Thread
Newer Topic | Older Topic
  
Author Topic:   Is ID properly pursued?
RAZD
Member (Idle past 641 days)
Posts: 20714
From: the other end of the sidewalk
Joined: 03-14-2004


Message 73 of 94 (623236)
07-08-2011 7:38 PM
Reply to: Message 71 by Chuck77
07-08-2011 2:05 AM


yes, ID needs to start over
Hi Chuck77, thanks.

Like I said, ID needs to start over. Pos

That's basically what I am arguing, that it needs to start over on a stand-alone basis, rather than rely on (carry the baggage of) "creation science" -- and take the concept to the logical conclusion. To embrace ID fully, one needs to discard all preconceptions of who\what the designer is, and pursue it as an hypothesis: if god/s created the universe, then what should we see that shows this creation process?

To pursue this question properly, imho, all sciences would be brought to bear on the question, we can't pick and choose which sciences we like and which we don't like, as science is tested by reality (or what we perceive as reality).

Science is a tool for pursuing the philosophical question, and it is a philosophical (hypothetical) question until there is some objective empirical evidence that god/s {do\do-not} exist.

The problem is that we only have one universe to use as evidence -- is this what a designed universe should look like or is this what a non-designed universe should look like?

... but having an already established faith(for some) can lead one to be a proponent of ID. Maybe it should be classified differently. Faith can "take" you there atleast, ...

If you rely on faith, or on assuming that the premise "god/s exist" is true, then it cannot be science, though science can be used to pursue the questions raised. To do this, though, one needs to be prepared to discard preconceptions based on faith and belief, or the science does not work.

Maybe ID will be able to develop itself in the future more so, according to the process Science demands. ...

My personal opinion, is that an open-minded skeptical approach to science used to investigate questions raised by the ID hypothesis (above) will lead people of faith to a better understanding and appreciation of what science does.

Science is a tool to help us understand reality (or what we perceive as reality) and it allows us to test our beliefs\hypothesis against the objective empirical evidence of that reality so that false ideas\concepts can be identified and discarded.

Each falsified concept brings us to a closer approximation of reality by eliminating false beliefs.

Enjoy.


we are limited in our ability to understand
by our ability to understand
Rebel American Zen Deist
... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ...
to share.


• • • Join the effort to solve medical problems, AIDS/HIV, Cancer and more with Team EvC! (click) • • •

This message is a reply to:
 Message 71 by Chuck77, posted 07-08-2011 2:05 AM Chuck77 has taken no action

  
RAZD
Member (Idle past 641 days)
Posts: 20714
From: the other end of the sidewalk
Joined: 03-14-2004


Message 78 of 94 (689053)
01-27-2013 8:44 PM


bump for Spiritual Anarchist
Welcome to the fray Spiritual Anarchist

Message 1 of Is Intelligent Design An Open Movement?

Are other viewpoints besides the Christian and the Atheist welcome or given consideration? Or is the debate of ID just a battle of Christian values versus Nihilism/Materialism?

Curiously, I don't think anyone has a copyright on ID.

Is the Intelligent Design Movement open to Pantheism or other view points beside Christianity?

I'm a Deist, and I care little whether the "Design Movement" is open to my views or not. Deism was around long before the Neo-Paley Christian version.

See Silly Design Institute: Let's discuss BOTH sides of the Design Controversy... as well as this thread for my opinion of ID

Enjoy


we are limited in our ability to understand
by our ability to understand
Rebel American Zen Deist
... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ...
to share.


• • • Join the effort to solve medical problems, AIDS/HIV, Cancer and more with Team EvC! (click) • • •

  
RAZD
Member (Idle past 641 days)
Posts: 20714
From: the other end of the sidewalk
Joined: 03-14-2004


Message 80 of 94 (689143)
01-28-2013 1:39 PM
Reply to: Message 79 by Spiritual Anarchist
01-27-2013 10:59 PM


Re: Is Intelligent Design An Open Movement?
Sorry I didn't know how else to do this. This will probably be posted as message 79 and be overlooked anyway. But I think Pantheism opens up a whole new can of worms. And being a Pantheist I can see myself being questioned on both sides of the debate.

We can discuss what we think ID should be like here and address the tolerance of others to an open ID philosophy on your thread.

You'll likely find less tolerance from those that want to attack it as creationism.

Is the Intelligent Design Movement open to Pantheism or other view points beside Christianity?

I feel like I must choose a false Dichotomy in this debate between a meaningless Universe with no room for souls,freewill etc
or belief in some Tribal Deity of the Canaanites.

Are other viewpoints besides the Christian and the Atheist welcome or given consideration? Or is the debate of ID just a battle of Christian values versus Nihilism/Materialism?

Based on what is claimed they should be open to anyone, because they claim it is not about any particular religion or god/s.

Enjoy


we are limited in our ability to understand
by our ability to understand
Rebel American Zen Deist
... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ...
to share.


• • • Join the effort to solve medical problems, AIDS/HIV, Cancer and more with Team EvC! (click) • • •

This message is a reply to:
 Message 79 by Spiritual Anarchist, posted 01-27-2013 10:59 PM Spiritual Anarchist has taken no action

  
RAZD
Member (Idle past 641 days)
Posts: 20714
From: the other end of the sidewalk
Joined: 03-14-2004


Message 82 of 94 (737102)
09-17-2014 8:51 AM
Reply to: Message 81 by taiji2
09-17-2014 12:49 AM


Re: well done
Certainly. Thanks


we are limited in our ability to understand
by our ability to understand
RebelAmerican☆Zen☯Deist
... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ...
to share.


• • • Join the effort to solve medical problems, AIDS/HIV, Cancer and more with Team EvC! (click) • • •

This message is a reply to:
 Message 81 by taiji2, posted 09-17-2014 12:49 AM taiji2 has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 83 by taiji2, posted 09-26-2014 12:11 AM RAZD has seen this message

  
Newer Topic | Older Topic
Jump to:


Copyright 2001-2018 by EvC Forum, All Rights Reserved

™ Version 4.1
Innovative software from Qwixotic © 2022