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Author Topic:   Microsoft outdoes themselves again, in a bad way
dwise1
Member
Posts: 5930
Joined: 05-02-2006
Member Rating: 5.8


Message 16 of 45 (691311)
02-21-2013 11:41 PM
Reply to: Message 9 by Theodoric
02-21-2013 9:05 PM


Was that this outlook.com that Microsoft is promoting the s*** out of to take all the email business away from Google? If so, then your mother-in-law's experience shows us exactly what to expect if we switch.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 9 by Theodoric, posted 02-21-2013 9:05 PM Theodoric has not replied

Replies to this message:
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xongsmith
Member
Posts: 2578
From: massachusetts US
Joined: 01-01-2009
Member Rating: 6.8


Message 17 of 45 (691361)
02-22-2013 8:53 AM


While these various email accounts appear to be free, the owners are most probably building profiles of each person and selling them to marketing firms, even if they promise not to be doing that.
And soon the U.S. government will also have unfettered permission to examine these emails....

- xongsmith, 5.7d

Replies to this message:
 Message 19 by Rahvin, posted 02-22-2013 9:44 AM xongsmith has seen this message but not replied

  
Stile
Member
Posts: 4295
From: Ontario, Canada
Joined: 12-02-2004


Message 18 of 45 (691363)
02-22-2013 9:11 AM
Reply to: Message 16 by dwise1
02-21-2013 11:41 PM


Maybe
dwise1 writes:
Was that this outlook.com that Microsoft is promoting the s*** out of to take all the email business away from Google? If so, then your mother-in-law's experience shows us exactly what to expect if we switch.
I doubt it. That's pretty new.
But I wouldn't expect that to be any better, really.
Oh, wait... maybe it is? There is a plan to transfer all Hotmail accounts over to the new outlook.com stuff eventually. Not sure when that's being implented (or if it's already been done).
So... yeah, I have nothing to say.
I wasted all your times! Your time is mine now!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 16 by dwise1, posted 02-21-2013 11:41 PM dwise1 has not replied

  
Rahvin
Member
Posts: 4032
Joined: 07-01-2005
Member Rating: 9.2


Message 19 of 45 (691370)
02-22-2013 9:44 AM
Reply to: Message 17 by xongsmith
02-22-2013 8:53 AM


And soon the U.S. government will also have unfettered permission to examine these emails....
They already do. It's a major issue with cloud storage of any type, including email - currently no warrant is required to access information stored by a third party. They need a warrant to look at your computer, but they don't need a warrant to look at a third-party email or storage server that houses your data.

The human understanding when it has once adopted an opinion (either as being the received opinion or as being agreeable to itself) draws all things else to support and agree with it. - Francis Bacon
"There are two novels that can change a bookish fourteen-year old's life: The Lord of the Rings and Atlas Shrugged. One is a childish fantasy that often engenders a lifelong obsession with its unbelievable heroes, leading to an emotionally stunted, socially crippled adulthood, unable to deal with the real world. The other, of course, involves orcs." - John Rogers
A world that can be explained even with bad reasons is a familiar world. But, on the other hand, in a universe suddenly divested of illusions and lights, man feels an alien, a stranger. His exile is without remedy since he is deprived of the memory of a lost home or the hope of a promised land. This divorce between man and his life, the actor and his setting, is properly the feeling of absurdity. — Albert Camus
"...the pious hope that by combining numerous little turds of variously tainted data, one can obtain a valuable result; but in fact, the outcome is merely a larger than average pile of shit." - Barash, David 1995.

This message is a reply to:
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Jon
Inactive Member


Message 20 of 45 (691527)
02-22-2013 6:47 PM
Reply to: Message 15 by Omnivorous
02-21-2013 11:03 PM


I couldn't identify in Theodoric's account the specific ignorance about computers on his m-i-l's part to which you refer.
You are absolutely right. It was stated nowhere; I assumed it based on the following comment:
quote:
Theodoric in Message 5:
The thing is very few people like her are savvy about this.
I see now that the statement could be interpreted in other ways; so I may have made a faulty assumption.
In either case, the mother-in-law is clearly in the wrong expecting the giver of free things to continue giving free things. As they say, don't feed the bears. And don't take candy from strangers.
Jon
Edited by Jon, : add quote
Edited by Jon, : No reason given.

Love your enemies!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 15 by Omnivorous, posted 02-21-2013 11:03 PM Omnivorous has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 21 by Dr Adequate, posted 02-22-2013 7:11 PM Jon has replied

  
Dr Adequate
Member (Idle past 285 days)
Posts: 16113
Joined: 07-20-2006


(1)
Message 21 of 45 (691531)
02-22-2013 7:11 PM
Reply to: Message 20 by Jon
02-22-2013 6:47 PM


In either case, the mother-in-law is clearly in the wrong ...
Well, I would say that she clearly isn't. So how shall we get past here beside mere assertion?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 20 by Jon, posted 02-22-2013 6:47 PM Jon has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 22 by Theodoric, posted 02-22-2013 7:36 PM Dr Adequate has not replied
 Message 25 by Jon, posted 02-22-2013 7:52 PM Dr Adequate has replied

  
Theodoric
Member
Posts: 9076
From: Northwest, WI, USA
Joined: 08-15-2005
Member Rating: 3.7


Message 22 of 45 (691533)
02-22-2013 7:36 PM
Reply to: Message 21 by Dr Adequate
02-22-2013 7:11 PM


I have decide not to respond to the idiots that have nothing constructive to say.
Seems some people think that getting fucked over by corporations is ok. Wonder what it is that they bitch about.
Edited by Theodoric, : No reason given.

Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts
"God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 21 by Dr Adequate, posted 02-22-2013 7:11 PM Dr Adequate has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 23 by Jon, posted 02-22-2013 7:41 PM Theodoric has replied
 Message 38 by ringo, posted 02-23-2013 11:55 AM Theodoric has replied

  
Jon
Inactive Member


Message 23 of 45 (691534)
02-22-2013 7:41 PM
Reply to: Message 22 by Theodoric
02-22-2013 7:36 PM


Seems some people think that getting fucked over by corporations is ok. Wonder what it is that they bitch about.
She got fucked over?
Because she got to enjoy free email service for a certain amount of time and never paid a dime for it?
She got fucked over by the corporation because they gave her something for free from which she benefited?
Seriously, Theo, get off the horse.

Love your enemies!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 22 by Theodoric, posted 02-22-2013 7:36 PM Theodoric has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 24 by Theodoric, posted 02-22-2013 7:44 PM Jon has replied

  
Theodoric
Member
Posts: 9076
From: Northwest, WI, USA
Joined: 08-15-2005
Member Rating: 3.7


Message 24 of 45 (691535)
02-22-2013 7:44 PM
Reply to: Message 23 by Jon
02-22-2013 7:41 PM


If a company offers a service, whether free or not, they should be willing to support the service.
How about you just quit posting to this thread since you OBVIOUSLY, have nothing constructive or even relevant to add.
Good day, Sir,

Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts
"God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 23 by Jon, posted 02-22-2013 7:41 PM Jon has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 26 by Jon, posted 02-22-2013 7:56 PM Theodoric has replied

  
Jon
Inactive Member


Message 25 of 45 (691536)
02-22-2013 7:52 PM
Reply to: Message 21 by Dr Adequate
02-22-2013 7:11 PM


No one is 'in the wrong', per se. But the mother-in-law's expectation that the company providing her a free service do anything at all for her (including providing the free service) is ridiculous and childish.
Who the fuck expects for free something completely unnecessary and trivial from one single entity that and can be easily obtained for the same costnothingfrom any other entity?
When I'm at the fare and the Sheriff's booth stops handing out free plastic cups, I go get one from the EMTs; I don't throw a fit because the fucking cops stopped offering free drinkware.
I am appalled at the sense of childish, emotionally-stunted entitlement running through this thread from people who should be otherwise reasonable and rational.

Love your enemies!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 21 by Dr Adequate, posted 02-22-2013 7:11 PM Dr Adequate has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 28 by Dr Adequate, posted 02-22-2013 9:15 PM Jon has seen this message but not replied
 Message 29 by NoNukes, posted 02-22-2013 11:15 PM Jon has replied

  
Jon
Inactive Member


Message 26 of 45 (691537)
02-22-2013 7:56 PM
Reply to: Message 24 by Theodoric
02-22-2013 7:44 PM


Here you are, sir; here's $20.
What? That's not enough to buy that new guitar you wanted?
You're pissed off at me because I didn't give you even more free money?
No way!
I know that you and the rest of the folks in the entitlement bubble can't fathom even considering what I am saying; but to the rest of us out here in the real world your stuck-up, self-centered, cry-baby attitude is just disgusting and sick.
Grow up. Use Google.

Love your enemies!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 24 by Theodoric, posted 02-22-2013 7:44 PM Theodoric has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 27 by Theodoric, posted 02-22-2013 8:23 PM Jon has replied

  
Theodoric
Member
Posts: 9076
From: Northwest, WI, USA
Joined: 08-15-2005
Member Rating: 3.7


Message 27 of 45 (691540)
02-22-2013 8:23 PM
Reply to: Message 26 by Jon
02-22-2013 7:56 PM


Grow up. Use Google.
Gee, gmail is free and they have a great customer service. Pretty much destroys your argument.
Here you are, sir; here's $20.
What? That's not enough to buy that new guitar you wanted?
You're pissed off at me because I didn't give you even more free money?
No way!
Why are you so pissed off?
I said Good Day; Sir.

Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts
"God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 26 by Jon, posted 02-22-2013 7:56 PM Jon has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 30 by Jon, posted 02-23-2013 1:13 AM Theodoric has not replied

  
Dr Adequate
Member (Idle past 285 days)
Posts: 16113
Joined: 07-20-2006


(1)
Message 28 of 45 (691542)
02-22-2013 9:15 PM
Reply to: Message 25 by Jon
02-22-2013 7:52 PM


A: I'll look after your all your stuff for you, for free.
B: Thank you very much, here's all my stuff. You're my hero!
A: Now I will keep all your stuff and never give it back to you.
B: Well, now I am pissed.
Jon: You have no right to complain, person A clearly said that this was a free service.

This message is a reply to:
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Replies to this message:
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NoNukes
Inactive Member


(1)
Message 29 of 45 (691554)
02-22-2013 11:15 PM
Reply to: Message 25 by Jon
02-22-2013 7:52 PM


Estoppel
When I'm at the fare and the Sheriff's booth stops handing out free plastic cups, I go get one from the EMTs; I don't throw a fit because the fucking cops stopped offering free drinkware.
Not going to comment specifically on the email situation, but the idea that gift givers incur no liability simply because they don't charge is not correct. I would suggest looking at the legal doctrines of reliance estoppel and promissory estoppel. I'm not convinced that any type of estoppel applies here because the application is highly fact specific, but so far I haven't seen an argument here that they don't apply. Just a couple of people calling someone's granny a whiner.
Here are the elements for promissory estoppel. Law in your jurisdiction may vary.
quote:
(1) the promise was clear and definite;
(2) the promisee justifiably relied on the promise;
(3) the promisee’s reliance was substantial and of a definite character; and
(4) enforcing the promise will serve the best interests of justice.
Think about this. If a ortho surgeon was giving away free knee replacement and he cut into the wrong leg of a patient, do you think he can simply say, "hey, I did that operation for free, so get out of my face"
Edited by NoNukes, : No reason given.

Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)
The apathy of the people is enough to make every statue leap from its pedestal and hasten the resurrection of the dead. William Lloyd Garrison.
If there is no struggle, there is no progress. Those who profess to favor freedom, and deprecate agitation, are men who want crops without plowing up the ground, they want rain without thunder and lightning. Frederick Douglass

This message is a reply to:
 Message 25 by Jon, posted 02-22-2013 7:52 PM Jon has replied

Replies to this message:
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Jon
Inactive Member


Message 30 of 45 (691560)
02-23-2013 1:13 AM
Reply to: Message 27 by Theodoric
02-22-2013 8:23 PM


Gee, gmail is free and they have a great customer service. Pretty much destroys your argument.
Not really. I never said a free service can't be great; I simply said that the free-service provider is under no obligation to make their free service greator even mediocre.
You can believe otherwise; but that doesn't change reality.

Love your enemies!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 27 by Theodoric, posted 02-22-2013 8:23 PM Theodoric has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 32 by Dr Adequate, posted 02-23-2013 3:16 AM Jon has replied

  
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