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Author Topic:   Am I the only one who believes in God?
redstang281
Inactive Member


Message 1 of 44 (669)
12-12-2001 1:29 PM


Just curious.
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nator
Member (Idle past 343 days)
Posts: 12961
From: Ann Arbor
Joined: 12-09-2001


Message 2 of 44 (692)
12-12-2001 5:10 PM
Reply to: Message 1 by redstang281
12-12-2001 1:29 PM


No, I don't think you are the only one who believes in God.

I am an Agnostic, personally, but there are several people here who accept the overwhelming evidence for evolution and who also believe in God.

So, tell me, do you accept the evidence for common descent with modification? If not, why not?

Alliso


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Percy
Member
Posts: 18498
From: New Hampshire
Joined: 12-23-2000
Member Rating: 2.9


Message 3 of 44 (693)
12-12-2001 6:28 PM
Reply to: Message 1 by redstang281
12-12-2001 1:29 PM


I believe in God, and I also believe all the world's religions are products of the minds of men.

--Percy


This message is a reply to:
 Message 1 by redstang281, posted 12-12-2001 1:29 PM redstang281 has not yet responded

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mark24
Member (Idle past 3368 days)
Posts: 3857
From: UK
Joined: 12-01-2001


Message 4 of 44 (696)
12-12-2001 7:43 PM


Redstang 281,
No, most definately not. Before I go further, now were in a different post I feel I have to give you credit for hangin in there when there were several of us out to get ya!

As an agnostic, I always wanted to believe in a God, I really wanted someone to come up with empirical evidence of a creator, so I can rest assured that theres an afterlife of paradise. It REALLY WOULD BE NICE!!! However, what I AM sure of, is that I'd rather no God at all than the petty, vindictive, bastard you call God.

Youre judged on someone elses failings. sometimes, but curiously, not always, killed shortly after birth for Adams sins. Even you admit that its wrong for humans to kill other humans for the crime of being human, but its OK for God to do it. He gave us free will as individuals, but still judges the entire species for the crimes of one. Were still his toys, it seems. *Shudder*

------------------
Occam's razor is not for shaving with.


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redstang281
Inactive Member


Message 5 of 44 (714)
12-13-2001 9:59 AM
Reply to: Message 4 by mark24
12-12-2001 7:43 PM


quote:
Originally posted by mark24:
credit for hangin in there when there were several of us out to get ya!

Thanks, that makes me feel a little less likly that everyone wants to kill me.

[b] [QUOTE]
As an agnostic, I always wanted to believe in a God, I really wanted someone to come up with empirical evidence of a creator, so I can rest assured that theres an afterlife of paradise. It REALLY WOULD BE NICE!!! However, what I AM sure of, is that I'd rather no God at all than the petty, vindictive, bastard you call God.

Youre judged on someone elses failings. sometimes, but curiously, not always, killed shortly after birth for Adams sins. Even you admit that its wrong for humans to kill other humans for the crime of being human, but its OK for God to do it. He gave us free will as individuals, but still judges the entire species for the crimes of one. Were still his toys, it seems. *Shudder*
[/b][/QUOTE]

Like the other post, I try to explain what the scripture says. I feel like I have a pretty good understand of the message God is trying to give to us. That's why when you asked me questions I try to answer them how I think the bible means for them to be. But if I consider that the Bible is truely the word of God than it becomes apparent to me why it is so difficult to understand. For someone who created everything must also be able to write a book that is as difficult and misunderstood as the bible. Why it is not "dumbed down" for us? Maybe because even more people would blame it as the writtings of man. But anyway, back to my point. Even if you don't accept the bible as the word of God I still would like you to understand the concepts that it teaches.

[This message has been edited by redstang281, 12-13-2001]


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joz
Inactive Member


Message 6 of 44 (859)
12-17-2001 3:10 PM


I`m pretty sure you aren`t bud there`s the pope for starters....

It is however entirely possible that you are the only one who believes in God as you perceive him....

This is because due to a complete lack of evidence it is impossible to actually say "this is God do you believe in him?"....


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redstang281
Inactive Member


Message 7 of 44 (883)
12-18-2001 7:57 AM
Reply to: Message 6 by joz
12-17-2001 3:10 PM


quote:
Originally posted by joz:
Im pretty sure you arent bud theres the pope for starters....

It is however entirely possible that you are the only one who believes in God as you perceive him....

This is because due to a complete lack of evidence it is impossible to actually say "this is God do you believe in him?"....


There's the entire Christian society. As well they should believe in God as the evidence for him is overwhelming (to those who have their eyes open.) Not to mention all the prophecies in the bible are true, and creationist have answers to every statement an evolutionist makes.

Oh and then there's the fact that if you don't believe in God you have to assume our reality just exist for no reason.

[This message has been edited by redstang281, 12-18-2001]


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nator
Member (Idle past 343 days)
Posts: 12961
From: Ann Arbor
Joined: 12-09-2001


Message 8 of 44 (958)
12-19-2001 1:11 PM
Reply to: Message 7 by redstang281
12-18-2001 7:57 AM


[QUOTE]Originally posted by redstang281:
[B] There's the entire Christian society. As well they should believe in God as the evidence for him is overwhelming (to those who have their eyes open.)[/QUOTE]

OK, I can do without the patronizing, arrogant tone.

What about the Hindu society? Or the Muslim society? Or the Buddhist society? Or the Jewish society?

Did you ever think that you would have been one of those religions if you had been born and raised in India, Saudi Arabia, or China?

Did you choose Christianity out of a consideration of all religions, or were you raised to believe the way you do?

Christians are a minority in the world, you know.

quote:
Not to mention all the prophecies in the bible are true,

Um, do you mean the prohecies in the Bible which are then fulfilled in the Bible? Sorry, that's not evidence.

quote:
and creationist have answers to every statement an evolutionist makes.

I have asked every creationist I have ever spoken with the following questions, and I have NEVER ONCE gotten a straight answer. Maybe you can give me a straight answer:

What is the definition of "kind"?

What is the mechanism or process or force that prevents many small changes in a population to accumulate enough to produce speciation?

If the fossils are sorted by Noah's flood, then why do flowering plants appear so late in the fossil record? Did they run for high ground?

Why do the various radiometric dating methods agree almost all of the time? Creationists make a lot out of the occasional case when the dating methods don't agree, but don't explain why they do agree the majority of the time.

quote:
Oh and then there's the fact that if you don't believe in God you have to assume our reality just exist for no reason.

That is a philosophical problem, not a scientific one. Just because you prefer to belive that God created the Universe doesn't mean that science supports your particular interpretation of the creation stories in the
Christian Bible.


This message is a reply to:
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mark24
Member (Idle past 3368 days)
Posts: 3857
From: UK
Joined: 12-01-2001


Message 9 of 44 (1098)
12-21-2001 8:41 PM
Reply to: Message 7 by redstang281
12-18-2001 7:57 AM


quote:
Originally posted by redstang281:

Not to mention all the prophecies in the bible are true


You still have to demonstrate that theres no ambiguity, mate. I posted last over in the bible/word/God forum ( http://www.evcforum.net/cgi-bin/dm.cgi?action=page&f=2&t=7&p=8 ) & await your reply. (I know posts were lost, but fire away)

[This message has been edited by Percipient, 12-22-2001]


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Catalyst
Inactive Member


Message 10 of 44 (88958)
02-26-2004 11:20 PM
Reply to: Message 4 by mark24
12-12-2001 7:43 PM


An interesting piece of information that is a bit off the topic:
According to the Bible God created the Tree of knowledge, aka the Tree of Good and Evil, saying to adam that it was wrong to eat from it as it would give him morality which would end up certainly killing him,
when god tells adam not to eat from the tree isnt god already giving Adam the knowledge of good and evil? thus creating it in humans!
Why were humans expelled and damned into eternal sin etc etc for something God had already given them?
I believe in God but i dont believe in a literal bible like fundementalist Christians.
How can the bible be taken literally?
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Thugpreacha
Member
Posts: 12445
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003
Member Rating: 1.3


Message 11 of 44 (88959)
02-26-2004 11:35 PM
Reply to: Message 10 by Catalyst
02-26-2004 11:20 PM


Free Will and the Tree..here we go again
Catalyst writes:

when god tells adam not to eat from the tree isnt god already giving Adam the knowledge of good and evil? thus creating it in humans!

No. God merely presented the concept of Obedience and Disobedience. Free Will. Evil was an unknown reality before the act of disobedience.
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Catalyst
Inactive Member


Message 12 of 44 (88963)
02-26-2004 11:41 PM
Reply to: Message 11 by Thugpreacha
02-26-2004 11:35 PM


Re: Free Will and the Tree..here we go again
ah but is not doind what God says Evil? therefore God introduced the concept of good and evil to adam, what god says is good if you go against it your actions must be evil!
This message is a reply to:
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Thugpreacha
Member
Posts: 12445
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003
Member Rating: 1.3


Message 13 of 44 (88966)
02-27-2004 12:06 AM
Reply to: Message 12 by Catalyst
02-26-2004 11:41 PM


Re: Free Will and the Tree..here we go again
God created the possibility of evil. He did not make us own it. God created Lucifer BEFORE Lucifer chose to rebel. Lucifer chose to be independant from God, thus personifying evil by definition. Humanity chose disobedience and thus independance from Gods Spirit. This was the knowledge of good and evil by definition. God always wants us to listen to Him, yet He never makes us do it.
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Adminnemooseus
Director
Posts: 3883
Joined: 09-26-2002


Message 14 of 44 (88970)
02-27-2004 12:12 AM


Thread moved here from the The Great Debate forum.
    
Thugpreacha
Member
Posts: 12445
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003
Member Rating: 1.3


Message 15 of 44 (88997)
02-27-2004 5:18 AM
Reply to: Message 3 by Percy
12-12-2001 6:28 PM


Gods Character
Percy writes:

I believe in God, and I also believe all the world's religions are products of the minds of men.

What type of characteristics does your God have?
This message is a reply to:
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