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Author | Topic: How long would it take for a novel alelle to be fixated in a population? | |||||||||||||||||||||||
CoolBeans Member (Idle past 3636 days) Posts: 196 From: Honduras Joined: |
Things such as Haldane's dilemma are relevant to the thread. I would ask for participants of the thread to have benefitial mutations as a given. There is a thread of that already.
Unless selection is very intense the number of deaths needed to secure the substitution by natural selection, of one gene for another at a locus, is independent of the intensity of selection. It is often about 30 times the number of organisms in a generation. It is suggested that in horoletic evolution, the mean time taken for each gene substitution is about 300 generations. This accords with the observed slowness of evolution.
IIS 10.0 Detailed Error - 404.0 - Not Found Creationists like ReMine say that it refutes evolution.This paper is very old and even Haldane admitted that there might be errors in his calculations. If Haldane was wrong then what model was able to correct it? Edited by CoolBeans, : No reason given. Edited by CoolBeans, : No reason given. Edited by CoolBeans, : No reason given. Edited by CoolBeans, : No reason given.
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CoolBeans Member (Idle past 3636 days) Posts: 196 From: Honduras Joined: |
Ok I fixed my mistake.
Another thing to note, is that it may only apply to mammals since they reproduce slowly. Edited by CoolBeans, : No reason given. Edited by CoolBeans, : No reason given.
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CoolBeans Member (Idle past 3636 days) Posts: 196 From: Honduras Joined: |
Imagine a population of 100,000 apes, the putative progenitors of humans. Suppose that a male and a female both received a mutation so beneficial that they out-survived everyone else; all the rest of the population died outall 99,998 of them. And then the surviving pair had enough offspring to replenish the population in one generation. And this repeated every generation (every 20 years) for 10 million years, more than the supposed time since the last common ancestor of humans and apes. That would mean that 500,000 beneficial mutations could be added to the population (i.e., 10,000,000/20). Even with this completely unrealistic scenario, which maximizes evolutionary progress, only about 0.02% of the human genome could be generated. Considering that the difference between the DNA of a human and a chimp, our supposed closest living relative, is greater than 5%,2 evolution has an obvious problem in explaining the origin of the genetic information in a creature such as a human. Haldane's dilemma has not been solved - creation.com
Haldane calculated that no more than 1,667 beneficial substitutions could have occurred in the supposed 10 million years since the last common ancestor of apes and humans. This is a mere one substitution per 300 generations, on average. If any of this is true then it would be a problem.
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CoolBeans Member (Idle past 3636 days) Posts: 196 From: Honduras Joined: |
Here is ReMine's paper on the subject.
http://creation.com/images/pdfs/tj/j19_1/j19_1_113-125.pdf
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CoolBeans Member (Idle past 3636 days) Posts: 196 From: Honduras Joined: |
Thats why I said "IF".
PS: I referring to message 5 Edited by CoolBeans, : No reason given.
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CoolBeans Member (Idle past 3636 days) Posts: 196 From: Honduras Joined: |
Well 20% is junk DNA so it is a good point.
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CoolBeans Member (Idle past 3636 days) Posts: 196 From: Honduras Joined: |
Hmm I will read it later.
----------- A review of ReMine's work would be nice too.
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CoolBeans Member (Idle past 3636 days) Posts: 196 From: Honduras Joined: |
It seems that he wants to redefine the cost of substitution. Or at least clarified it. He cites Dr. Crow as authorities that have reviewed his work. He also argues that neutral mutations do influence too.
Edited by CoolBeans, : No reason given. Edited by CoolBeans, : No reason given.
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CoolBeans Member (Idle past 3636 days) Posts: 196 From: Honduras Joined: |
How many generations would it take for allele frequencies to change.specifically mammals with low offspring.
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CoolBeans Member (Idle past 3636 days) Posts: 196 From: Honduras Joined: |
On your soft selection answer. The author says he adressed that already. He says that the cost of substitution is unnavoidable. He says that when an organism reproduces by 1 per birth. It would require that this organis will have to rerpduce to 2.25 rate. Its in his paper.
Though to be honest. The other organism is not reproducing then the cost is lower. Edited by CoolBeans, : No reason given.
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CoolBeans Member (Idle past 3636 days) Posts: 196 From: Honduras Joined: |
That is batten's paper, not ReMine's. He argued that it doesnt matter if they are beneficial.
Edited by CoolBeans, : No reason given.
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CoolBeans Member (Idle past 3636 days) Posts: 196 From: Honduras Joined: |
.ell I wouldnt say that all the population needs to be replaced .
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CoolBeans Member (Idle past 3636 days) Posts: 196 From: Honduras Joined: |
What I meant is that this change would need to replace the old one in the population. Please read the paper.
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CoolBeans Member (Idle past 3636 days) Posts: 196 From: Honduras Joined: |
This Walt ReMine's website with responses to rebutals.
http://saintpaulscience.com/Robert_Williams.htm Edited by CoolBeans, : No reason given.
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CoolBeans Member (Idle past 3636 days) Posts: 196 From: Honduras Joined: |
So what you are saying is that alot of the changes are due to neutral mutation.
I would be happy if you read his paper.
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