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Author Topic:   Endtime Prophecy and the European Union
Faith
Member
Posts: 32154
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001
Member Rating: 1.1


Message 246 of 313 (700848)
06-08-2013 3:05 AM
Reply to: Message 239 by Panda
06-07-2013 9:50 AM


Re: Symbolism of the European Union
We recognize it as reflecting the woman on the beast in Revelation whether you like it or not.
This message is a reply to:
 Message 239 by Panda, posted 06-07-2013 9:50 AM Panda has not yet responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 247 by Tangle, posted 06-08-2013 3:24 AM Faith has responded

    
Faith
Member
Posts: 32154
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001
Member Rating: 1.1


Message 248 of 313 (700850)
06-08-2013 4:18 AM
Reply to: Message 247 by Tangle
06-08-2013 3:24 AM


Re: Symbolism of the European Union
Well, now, Panda says I'm lying that we recognize it as the Revelation beast so you are in disagreement with him. And "whether you like it or not" includes your opinion that it doesn't look enough like the beast of Revelation to satisfy YOUR judgment. That's fine, but WE do find it very interestingly suggestive "whether you think so or not." Why do you all insist on making us think like you do? Leave it alone already.
This message is a reply to:
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Replies to this message:
 Message 252 by Panda, posted 06-08-2013 7:29 AM Faith has responded

    
Faith
Member
Posts: 32154
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001
Member Rating: 1.1


Message 250 of 313 (700852)
06-08-2013 4:53 AM
Reply to: Message 249 by PaulK
06-08-2013 4:44 AM


Re: Tower of Babel
Now if you want to argue that God doesn't want people who speak different languages to work together, I guess you'd have a case, but I very much doubt that any of the traditions you favour interpret the Bible that way.

God wanted the people to disperse, He did not want them to "work together" at the specific project of "making a name for themselves" with attempts to reach the heights of God, and that's why He confounded their tongues. It did succeed in getting them to disperse.

I should also mention finally that we consider that God began to repair the curse of the confounding of tongues at Pentecost.


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 Message 249 by PaulK, posted 06-08-2013 4:44 AM PaulK has responded

Replies to this message:
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Faith
Member
Posts: 32154
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001
Member Rating: 1.1


Message 253 of 313 (700895)
06-08-2013 8:22 PM
Reply to: Message 252 by Panda
06-08-2013 7:29 AM


Re: Symbolism of the European Union
If now you think I'm lying about what you think I'm lying about, what DO you think I'm lying about? From my point of view I'm not lying about anything.

Edited by Faith, : No reason given.


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 Message 252 by Panda, posted 06-08-2013 7:29 AM Panda has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 254 by Panda, posted 06-08-2013 9:59 PM Faith has not yet responded

    
Faith
Member
Posts: 32154
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001
Member Rating: 1.1


Message 256 of 313 (700920)
06-09-2013 5:48 PM
Reply to: Message 255 by ringo
06-09-2013 3:50 PM


Re: Tower of Babel
I didn't make it up, Ringo, it's what a number of commentators on the Tower of Babel say, both about the dispersion and about the height. They couldn't replenish the earth without dispersing.

Edited by Faith, : No reason given.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 255 by ringo, posted 06-09-2013 3:50 PM ringo has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 257 by ringo, posted 06-09-2013 6:03 PM Faith has responded

    
Faith
Member
Posts: 32154
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001
Member Rating: 1.1


Message 258 of 313 (700942)
06-09-2013 8:58 PM
Reply to: Message 257 by ringo
06-09-2013 6:03 PM


Re: Tower of Babel
I really don't get what you think you are saying. What they were refusing to do was to disperse, the dispersal that was necessary for replenishing the earth.

Edited by Faith, : No reason given.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 257 by ringo, posted 06-09-2013 6:03 PM ringo has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 259 by NoNukes, posted 06-09-2013 11:03 PM Faith has responded
 Message 261 by ringo, posted 06-10-2013 12:02 PM Faith has responded

    
Faith
Member
Posts: 32154
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001
Member Rating: 1.1


Message 260 of 313 (700961)
06-10-2013 12:23 AM
Reply to: Message 259 by NoNukes
06-09-2013 11:03 PM


Re: Tower of Babel
You are right about that being the best evidence for this particular claim. I'm going by the commentaries because I haven't studied or meditated on the incident myself, and until I do that I'm not going to find fault with the commentators who have a good reputation. When a number of them agree it's a pretty good sign they have a good understanding of the passage.
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Faith
Member
Posts: 32154
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001
Member Rating: 1.1


Message 262 of 313 (701038)
06-10-2013 6:39 PM
Reply to: Message 261 by ringo
06-10-2013 12:02 PM


Re: Tower of Babel
Babel is in the general vicinity of where Noah and family debarked, the dispersal called for was across the entire world.
This message is a reply to:
 Message 261 by ringo, posted 06-10-2013 12:02 PM ringo has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 264 by ringo, posted 06-13-2013 12:23 PM Faith has not yet responded
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Faith
Member
Posts: 32154
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001
Member Rating: 1.1


Message 267 of 313 (701212)
06-14-2013 3:20 AM
Reply to: Message 265 by Coragyps
06-13-2013 4:55 PM


Re: Tower of Babel
"General vicinity" means the Middle East basically, probably you have a smaller area in mind than I did. Nobody knows for sure where the ark landed but one likely area is in Asia Minor or what is now Turkey, and Babel was founded southeast from there, maybe about a thousand miles, but hardly as far as God commanded them to disperse. India, China, Africa, Europe would have been more like "replenishing the earth."

Edited by Faith, : No reason given.


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Faith
Member
Posts: 32154
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001
Member Rating: 1.1


Message 268 of 313 (701213)
06-14-2013 3:23 AM
Reply to: Message 263 by caffeine
06-13-2013 8:23 AM


Re: The woman in Revelation
This is of course a very subjective judgment. Some Christians happen to judge the statue of Europa as I've described. Yours doesn't even involve a beast but you think it's the equivalent of ours?

Edited by Faith, : No reason given.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 263 by caffeine, posted 06-13-2013 8:23 AM caffeine has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 269 by caffeine, posted 06-14-2013 4:16 AM Faith has responded

    
Faith
Member
Posts: 32154
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001
Member Rating: 1.1


Message 270 of 313 (701216)
06-14-2013 4:30 AM
Reply to: Message 269 by caffeine
06-14-2013 4:16 AM


Re: The woman in Revelation
Yes you can tick off all those differences and to your mind that makes us wrong. Again, this is all a subjective judgment, we CAN'T be wrong. This argument is really ridiculous. We're perfectly capable of toting up the differences ourselves. Obviously to us that's all unnecessary, but since you think it's necessary you actually think that makes you RIGHT?

Edited by Faith, : No reason given.


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 Message 269 by caffeine, posted 06-14-2013 4:16 AM caffeine has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 271 by caffeine, posted 06-14-2013 4:59 AM Faith has not yet responded
 Message 272 by Tangle, posted 06-14-2013 5:21 AM Faith has responded
 Message 273 by jar, posted 06-14-2013 8:43 AM Faith has not yet responded

    
Faith
Member
Posts: 32154
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001
Member Rating: 1.1


Message 274 of 313 (701225)
06-14-2013 9:49 AM
Reply to: Message 272 by Tangle
06-14-2013 5:21 AM


Re: The woman in Revelation
Somehow "we can't be wrong" because there is no absolute certainty possible in such a subjective case translates in your mind to absolute certainty? The point is nobody could be right OR wrong on such a judgment call. What is the point in even trying to talk to people who think like you?

Edited by Faith, : No reason given.


This message is a reply to:
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Replies to this message:
 Message 275 by PaulK, posted 06-14-2013 10:16 AM Faith has responded
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Faith
Member
Posts: 32154
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001
Member Rating: 1.1


Message 277 of 313 (701228)
06-14-2013 10:23 AM
Reply to: Message 275 by PaulK
06-14-2013 10:16 AM


Re: The woman in Revelation
No desperation involved. A bunch of us IMMEDIATELY saw the Europa statue in terms of the woman on the beast in Revelation. Straightforward recognition. All the "objective" stuff is absolutely irrelevant.
This message is a reply to:
 Message 275 by PaulK, posted 06-14-2013 10:16 AM PaulK has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 278 by PaulK, posted 06-14-2013 10:29 AM Faith has responded
 Message 279 by jar, posted 06-14-2013 10:38 AM Faith has not yet responded
 Message 282 by Tangle, posted 06-14-2013 11:42 AM Faith has not yet responded
 Message 306 by Astrophile, posted 04-05-2017 5:43 PM Faith has not yet responded

    
Faith
Member
Posts: 32154
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001
Member Rating: 1.1


Message 280 of 313 (701236)
06-14-2013 11:29 AM
Reply to: Message 278 by PaulK
06-14-2013 10:29 AM


WHO SAID THE APPEARANCE OF THE STATUE IS COMPLETELY IRRELEVANT? Obviously it has to have a woman on the back of a beast. That it's got.
This message is a reply to:
 Message 278 by PaulK, posted 06-14-2013 10:29 AM PaulK has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 281 by PaulK, posted 06-14-2013 11:38 AM Faith has responded

    
Faith
Member
Posts: 32154
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001
Member Rating: 1.1


Message 283 of 313 (701239)
06-14-2013 11:46 AM
Reply to: Message 281 by PaulK
06-14-2013 11:38 AM


Like I said we immediately see the connection. Woman riding beast. We don't "determine" anything. Why is so much being made out of this very simple thing? There is no way there COULD be an exact match, all we COULD have is a hint at a similarity. Beast, woman riding. Very basic. But alone it probably wouldn't mean much. The shape of the building that reminds us of the Tower of Babel, the flag with the twelve stars in a circle that its designer saw as related to the Catholic interpretation of the woman in Revelation 12, the supposedly empty 666 seat which somebody said isn't empty but others say is. This is not some kind of hard and fast correspondence here, this is a collection of suggestions that some Christians find intriguing and in keeping with our understanding of how the last days are to play out. I don't hold any of it with an iron grip, it's all simply interestingly suggestive, nothing to deserve all this argument.
This message is a reply to:
 Message 281 by PaulK, posted 06-14-2013 11:38 AM PaulK has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 284 by PaulK, posted 06-14-2013 11:57 AM Faith has not yet responded
 Message 285 by New Cat's Eye, posted 06-14-2013 12:01 PM Faith has responded
 Message 286 by ringo, posted 06-14-2013 12:29 PM Faith has responded
 Message 295 by caffeine, posted 06-17-2013 5:08 AM Faith has responded

    
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