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Author Topic:   Are we all descendants of Adam and Eve?
ringo
Member (Idle past 432 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 346 of 376 (710720)
11-09-2013 10:53 AM
Reply to: Message 333 by jaywill
11-08-2013 1:29 PM


jaywill writes:
What indications do you have in the writing that he didn't expect anyone to take it seriously ?
The talking snake. Do you take Donald Duck seriously?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 333 by jaywill, posted 11-08-2013 1:29 PM jaywill has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 348 by jaywill, posted 11-09-2013 11:14 AM ringo has replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 432 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 347 of 376 (710721)
11-09-2013 10:56 AM
Reply to: Message 339 by jaywill
11-09-2013 8:49 AM


Re: Yet another irrelevant thing that never happened.
jaywill writes:
Wisecracks may cause me to write something useful.
We live in hope.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 339 by jaywill, posted 11-09-2013 8:49 AM jaywill has not replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 432 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 349 of 376 (710725)
11-09-2013 11:46 AM
Reply to: Message 348 by jaywill
11-09-2013 11:14 AM


jaywill writes:
The talking snake communicates to people down through the ages that besides man there IS an intelligence....
The fact that a talking snake is used should make it obvious that the intelligence is not "besides" man - it is man.
jaywill writes:
Trouble with mankind began when man took in the thought that God did not have man's utmost benefit in mind.
Trouble with mankind began when God created them with the ability to choose.
jaywill writes:
Why was a lying intelligence there ?
It wasn't a "lying" intelligence outside of them. It was an intelligence within them with the ability to choose. God put it there.
jaywill writes:
Why does it seem to possess previous experience with death ?
Indeed, why, if there supposedly was no death before "the fall"? Clearly, Adam and Eve were aquainted with death. They had seen things die - lions eating gazelles, for example. What they weren't aquainted with was their own death. Realizing one's own mortality is yet another aspect of growing up.
jaywill writes:
Why did it initiate its attack firstly through the woman to get to the man?
Again, "it" is not an external entity. Why did the woman think of eating the fruit first? Well, it was a fifty-fifty proposition. If the man had thought of it first, would it really make any difference to the story?
jaywill writes:
If it KNEW Adam would die WHY did it WANT Adam to die?
If there was a talking snake (tee hee) and if it did know that they would die, what it wanted was irrelevant. It knew that they would die whether they ate the fruit or not.
jaywill writes:
Why was it given NO promise of salvation as Adam and Eve were given?
What promise of salvation? All Adam and Eve are promised in the story is blood, sweat, toil and tears.
jaywill writes:
Why does it totally disappear from the remainder of the Old Testament.
It's a throw-away character. It serves its purpose and then it's gone. The questions in Eve's mind (about God's veracity, for one thing) had to be voiced in some way for the audience. If Shakespeare had written Genesis, it would have been a soliloquy, "To eat or not to eat...."
It's yet another indication that the character is not real.
jaywill writes:
What would have happened if Adam had first taken the tree of life...?
We don't know that he didn't.
jaywill writes:
How come some people when you study the Bible with them SOUND so much like the serpent in Genesis ?
Because the snake is in all of us. He represents human intelligence.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 348 by jaywill, posted 11-09-2013 11:14 AM jaywill has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 350 by jaywill, posted 11-09-2013 2:16 PM ringo has replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 432 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 368 of 376 (710892)
11-12-2013 11:02 AM
Reply to: Message 350 by jaywill
11-09-2013 2:16 PM


jaywill writes:
I said there is AN intelligence besides man. In other words MAN'S intelligence is not the ONLY intelligence in the creation.
If you mean that God is the other intelligence, okay. If you mean that there is another intelligent source of evil - i.e "Satan" - then no. The story is pretty plain; the snake is a fictional character representing man's ability to make decisions, including bad ones.
jaywill writes:
That is a ironical statement for a man who seems hell bent on wanting to CHOOSE not to come to God's salvation.
You seem hell bent on using ad hominem instead of addressing the argument.
jaywill writes:
Isn't it the terror of losing your freedom the main reason for all your arguing here over the years?
On the contrary, it would be nice to have a Sky Daddy to make every choice for me so I wouldn't have to take responsibility for anything.
jaywill writes:
Can you feel the heartbreak they must have had at the realization of what they led their family into?
That isn't in the story. Isn't it bad enough that Adam and Eve lost their son? Why do you have to put the blame on them when the story doesn't? God puts the responsibility squarely on Cain, not on any inheritance.
jaywill writes:
What if there was a previous world that was prepared for another being before Adam was created ?
What if pigs had wings?
jaywill writes:
And before the flood of Noah there was apparently oil or pitch in the ground.
See Wikipedia:
quote:
Ships made of wood required a flexible material, insoluble in water, to seal the spaces between planks. Pine pitch was often mixed with fibers like hemp to caulk spaces which might otherwise leak. Crude gum or oleoresin can be collected from the wounds of living pine trees.
Of course there was oil in the ground before the flood - not because of any "previous world" but because the world was already very very old by the time the flood (supposedly) happened.
jaywill writes:
The carnivorousness of animals is said not to have commenced until AFTER the flood of Noah.
It isn't said by the Bible.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 350 by jaywill, posted 11-09-2013 2:16 PM jaywill has not replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 432 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 369 of 376 (710893)
11-12-2013 11:05 AM
Reply to: Message 351 by jaywill
11-09-2013 3:18 PM


jaywill writes:
The first step in crushing the snake is to stop listening to his way of slandering God and twisting God's words.
God told Cain what the first step was in "crushing the snake": don't let it in the house.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 351 by jaywill, posted 11-09-2013 3:18 PM jaywill has not replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 432 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 370 of 376 (710894)
11-12-2013 11:09 AM
Reply to: Message 358 by jaywill
11-11-2013 10:01 AM


Re: Yet another irrelevant thing that never happened.
jaywill writes:
I take the differences as not insurmountable inconsistencies but rather difference in emphasis.
If all else fails, try a bigger shoehorn.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 358 by jaywill, posted 11-11-2013 10:01 AM jaywill has not replied

  
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