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Author Topic:   Why is evolution so controversial?
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 507 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 331 of 969 (724497)
04-17-2014 5:04 PM
Reply to: Message 310 by Percy
04-17-2014 3:24 PM


Re: Geo Timescale no longer telling time
The movement of the sea floor is very far from new to me, but in relation to a few billion years of accumulated stuff I forgot that fact, that's all.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 310 by Percy, posted 04-17-2014 3:24 PM Percy has acknowledged this reply

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 507 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 332 of 969 (724501)
04-17-2014 5:13 PM
Reply to: Message 312 by Percy
04-17-2014 3:32 PM


I think Pressie was assuming you understood that the higher the elevation the more a region is an area of net erosion, and the lower the elevation the more a region is an area of net deposition.

This has been explained to you many times, plus it's just plain old common sense. Wind, rain, rivers, streams and gravity will always cause sediments to collect at the lower elevations, the sea floor being the lowest elevation and the ultimate destination for all sediments, though any sediment eroded from a mountain top will likely have many way stations (lakes, valleys, etc.) before reaching the sea.

I have no idea what this has to do with the situation in the Grand Canyon area where the sediments stacked up three miles deep before the land rose and the canyons and cliffs were cut and the Kaibab Plateau was washed clean for thousands of square miles and so on and so forth. This is erosion with a capital E and it only happened after the layers were formed three miles deep. The whole Geologic Column making up the "Geologic Timetable" from Precambrian to Recent Time is represented in that entire three-mile deep stack (with only a displaced dinosaur layer considered to be a disconformity or some such nonsense) and this Erosion absolutely ended its accumulation which will never be resumed.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 312 by Percy, posted 04-17-2014 3:32 PM Percy has responded

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Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 507 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 333 of 969 (724502)
04-17-2014 5:22 PM
Reply to: Message 315 by Percy
04-17-2014 3:41 PM


Re: The "Geologic Timescale" does not exist
And this process is going to put the newly forming sedimentary layers on top of the continents?

Uplift has already been described in this thread, Faith, and in countless other threads that you've been a part of.

So far all you've talked about is subduction, not uplift, so now you are saying the sea floor will be tilted and raised into mountains and that will be a new continent? I don't get it. Tectonic force buckles continental land and raises mountains, it doesn't make continents. The high mountains that have been raised by tectonic force, Rockies, Himalayas etc., are buckled continental land, not former ocean floor. Oh I see, on YOUR model they were once ocean floor. Sigh. On mine they are simply once-horizontal strata full of fossils that accumulated on the land mass that were then tectonically raised into mountains. They never COULD have been ocean floor, they weren't pushed up from such a depth. Sigh.

It's funny how you can remember things like tectonic forces and uplift when it's convenient for you, like when you make up stories about the flood and the Grand Canyon (e.g., tectonic forces that cause the rotation of buried strata, uplift that causes strata to crack into pieces that the flood carries away), but which you conveniently forget whenever real evidence points to their actual occurrence, like sea shells atop Mount Everest.

Never ever "forgot" Mount Everest, I've always explained those high mountains as formed by tectonic force after the Flood, including the Rockies which were produced by the same tectonic force that created the Grand Canyon with its Great Unconformity and all the rest of the formations in that area.

Edited by Faith, : No reason given.


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Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 507 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 334 of 969 (724503)
04-17-2014 5:33 PM
Reply to: Message 322 by Percy
04-17-2014 3:52 PM


Re: The "Geologic Timescale" does not exist
I'll try to be clearer. I know sediments get deposited in the oceans and elsewhere, and get layered too, but not where the Geo Column was deposited, certainly not building Recent Time periods on top of it, and for the most part nowhere near the same scale, and not to the same depth, and not the same sediments and in other words not like the Geo Column or the Geo Timetable that is imposed on it

Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

Edited by Faith, : No reason given.


This message is a reply to:
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Replies to this message:
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 Message 421 by Percy, posted 04-19-2014 6:35 PM Faith has responded

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 507 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 335 of 969 (724504)
04-17-2014 5:40 PM
Reply to: Message 322 by Percy
04-17-2014 3:52 PM


Re: The "Geologic Timescale" does not exist
In some parts of the world, those that are regions of net deposition, the geologic column is still gradually forming.

Adding new layers to the uppermost Recent Time periods with very very modern fossils in them? Kindly show me any such thing.

In other parts of the world, those that are regions of net erosion, the geologic column is gradually disappearing.

This could happen. Funny though that it formed over hundreds of millions of years and THEN and ONLY THEN started to disappear, IF it is really the basis for the Geo Timescale.

Which of course it is not, and that's the real explanation.


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Dr Adequate
Member (Idle past 114 days)
Posts: 16112
Joined: 07-20-2006


(2)
Message 336 of 969 (724505)
04-17-2014 5:41 PM
Reply to: Message 334 by Faith
04-17-2014 5:33 PM


Re: The "Geologic Timescale" does not exist
I'll try to be clearer. I know sediments get deposited in the oceans and elsewhere, and get layered too, but not where the Geo Column was deposited, certainly not building Recent Time periods on top of it, and for the most part nowhere near the same scale, and not to the same depth, and not the same sediments and in other words not like the Geo Column or the Geo Timetable that is imposed on it

You've really gone full-on, balls-out, batshit crazy, haven't you?


This message is a reply to:
 Message 334 by Faith, posted 04-17-2014 5:33 PM Faith has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 339 by Faith, posted 04-17-2014 6:02 PM Dr Adequate has responded

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 507 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 337 of 969 (724508)
04-17-2014 5:55 PM
Reply to: Message 323 by JonF
04-17-2014 3:54 PM


Re: The "Geologic Timescale" does not exist
And this process is going to put the newly forming sedimentary layers on top of the continents? Sounds to me like it's going to bury them under the continents.

Both. Some goes on top, some goes underneath, some of what goes underneath comes back in solid or liquid form.

NONE OF IT GOES ON TOP OF THE CONTINENTS. The newly created ocean floor is just part of the MOVEMENT of the continents.

The problem here is that a supposedly continuous accumulation of strata containing a supposedly ever-evolving record of life forms up through those strata, in order to continue to BE that record, has to build ON TOP of the previously accumulated strata plus life forms,

Yes. You just are intellectually incapable of understanding or even remembering modern geological theory. You've seen and read many accurate descriptions of exactly how this happens and you haven't even remembered that it exists. Start with Dr. A's geology thread.

Have no idea what you are talking about.

but this is obviously no longer happening

Oh it is. We measure it. We have, as you have already forgotten, all sorts of evidence including photos of layers on the sea floor, and we know a lot about them.

Sea floor layers cannot possibly be the Geologic Timetable as I've shown over and over.

where it can only accumulate marine life, and where, according to your scenario, it's all getting subducted under the continents and disappearing anyway

You get an occasional non-marine fossil in marine sediments.

The occasional fisherman or oceanographer probably. Wonder which will be regarded as the most or least "evolved" a few million years from now.

Gee that REALLY clinches it, doesn't it. Must be the Geo Timescale continuing then.

But as I wrote above and you obviously don't understand because you haven't a clue about the mainstream geology is, some of it goes on top and some goes below.

NOT ON TOP OF THE CONTINENTS.

Of the stuff which goes below, some of it returns in solid or liquid form, it doesn't just disappear. We have images of it happening today. And you are ignoring that some goes on top. There are detailed investigations and scenarios for how this has happened for lots of interesting places. You've been exposed to a few of them, but of course you don't remember and can't learn.

In that case have pity on me and explain what on earth you are talking about. I've never seen anything about continents being built out of ocean floor. Volcanic islands is It.

Whatever you're saying it doesn't answer the problem of the discontinuation of the building of the Geologic Timetable.

Ther's no problem to answer. Just a few looney tunes who can't face reality.

No, just me. I just hit on this in this thread. Suddenly realized how clear it is that the Geo Column and therefore Timescale has absolutely stopped forming and how absolutely stupid the idea of it continuing on the ocean floor is.

Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

Edited by Faith, : No reason given.


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Replies to this message:
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Tanypteryx
Member
Posts: 2622
From: Oregon, USA
Joined: 08-27-2006
Member Rating: 5.6


(2)
Message 338 of 969 (724509)
04-17-2014 5:57 PM
Reply to: Message 329 by Faith
04-17-2014 4:14 PM


Re: Geo Timescale no longer telling time
Who says I don't know anything about Geology?

We all say you don't know shit about Geology. Tens of thousands of Geologists say you don't know anything about geology.

Everything that you have written at EvC says you don't know anything about Geology, in spades.

The fact that you are trying to defend a childish flood myth, that was disproved 200 years ago, with a hodgepodge of ridiculous assertions demonstrates that you don't have a clue about Geology. 12 years here and you still can't figure out what's wrong.

Delusional fantasies and lies will never convince anyone Faith.


What if Eleanor Roosevelt had wings? -- Monty Python

One important characteristic of a theory is that is has survived repeated attempts to falsify it. Contrary to your understanding, all available evidence confirms it. --Subbie

If evolution is shown to be false, it will be at the hands of things that are true, not made up. --percy


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 Message 329 by Faith, posted 04-17-2014 4:14 PM Faith has responded

Replies to this message:
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Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 507 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 339 of 969 (724510)
04-17-2014 6:02 PM
Reply to: Message 336 by Dr Adequate
04-17-2014 5:41 PM


Re: The "Geologic Timescale" does not exist
You're so cute.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 336 by Dr Adequate, posted 04-17-2014 5:41 PM Dr Adequate has responded

Replies to this message:
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Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 507 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 340 of 969 (724511)
04-17-2014 6:03 PM
Reply to: Message 338 by Tanypteryx
04-17-2014 5:57 PM


Re: Geo Timescale no longer telling time
Na, the fact is that I DISAGREE with some Geology and that's what you don't like. I don't toe the party line so I'm crazy. Oh well.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 338 by Tanypteryx, posted 04-17-2014 5:57 PM Tanypteryx has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 341 by Tanypteryx, posted 04-17-2014 6:13 PM Faith has not yet responded
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Tanypteryx
Member
Posts: 2622
From: Oregon, USA
Joined: 08-27-2006
Member Rating: 5.6


Message 341 of 969 (724512)
04-17-2014 6:13 PM
Reply to: Message 340 by Faith
04-17-2014 6:03 PM


Re: Geo Timescale no longer telling time
a, the fact is that I DISAGREE with some Geology and that's what you don't like. I don't toe the party line so I'm crazy. Oh well.

Na, Geology disagrees with you about everything.

And I like it. I love it when I can tell people who are wrong, that they wrong.

Evidence and reality are the party line.

You keep saying you're crazy and we keep saying, "We know!"


What if Eleanor Roosevelt had wings? -- Monty Python

One important characteristic of a theory is that is has survived repeated attempts to falsify it. Contrary to your understanding, all available evidence confirms it. --Subbie

If evolution is shown to be false, it will be at the hands of things that are true, not made up. --percy


This message is a reply to:
 Message 340 by Faith, posted 04-17-2014 6:03 PM Faith has not yet responded

  
Dr Adequate
Member (Idle past 114 days)
Posts: 16112
Joined: 07-20-2006


Message 342 of 969 (724513)
04-17-2014 6:37 PM
Reply to: Message 339 by Faith
04-17-2014 6:02 PM


Re: The "Geologic Timescale" does not exist
You're so cute.

Faith said something true!


This message is a reply to:
 Message 339 by Faith, posted 04-17-2014 6:02 PM Faith has not yet responded

  
Coyote
Member (Idle past 1169 days)
Posts: 6117
Joined: 01-12-2008


(1)
Message 343 of 969 (724515)
04-17-2014 6:42 PM
Reply to: Message 340 by Faith
04-17-2014 6:03 PM


Re: Geo Timescale no longer telling time
Na, the fact is that I DISAGREE with some Geology and that's what you don't like. I don't toe the party line so I'm crazy. Oh well.

What you are disagreeing with is reality. You are clinging to your fantasies in the face of overwhelming evidence to the contrary.

That's not the sanest of things one can do.


Religious belief does not constitute scientific evidence, nor does it convey scientific knowledge.

Belief gets in the way of learning--Robert A. Heinlein

How can I possibly put a new idea into your heads, if I do not first remove your delusions?--Robert A. Heinlein

It's not what we don't know that hurts, it's what we know that ain't so--Will Rogers

If I am entitled to something, someone else is obliged to pay--Jerry Pournelle

If a religion's teachings are true, then it should have nothing to fear from science...--dwise1

"Multiculturalism" does not include the American culture. That is what it is against.


This message is a reply to:
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Dr Adequate
Member (Idle past 114 days)
Posts: 16112
Joined: 07-20-2006


(1)
Message 344 of 969 (724516)
04-17-2014 7:06 PM
Reply to: Message 340 by Faith
04-17-2014 6:03 PM


Re: Geo Timescale no longer telling time
Na, the fact is that I DISAGREE with some Geology and that's what you don't like. I don't toe the party line so I'm crazy.

That's one hypothesis for why people think you're crazy. Another is that you're a dumbfuck fruitloop screwball nutjob crackpot dingbat know-nothing batshit cretinous assclown.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 340 by Faith, posted 04-17-2014 6:03 PM Faith has not yet responded

  
Minnemooseus
Member
Posts: 3860
From: Duluth, Minnesota, U.S. (West end of Lake Superior)
Joined: 11-11-2001
Member Rating: 5.9


Message 345 of 969 (724518)
04-17-2014 7:29 PM
Reply to: Message 257 by Tanypteryx
04-16-2014 8:14 PM


The Kaibab sediments vs. deep ocean basin sediments
Things are totally off-topic, but I can't let this pass:

Tanypteryx writes:

Faith writes:

Oh and I keep forgetting to state the main point about the Kaibab plateau, which is that people keep saying the same processes that formed the strata are continuing as they always have, but the huge expanse of the Kaibab alone should tell you it's not going on as it always has. Where on earth is anything like that continuing on such a scale? And consider also those diagrams of the different strata of North America that HBD posted on a thread a while back, strata that extend across the entire continent. Layer after layer extending for vast distances. That is NOT going on anywhere today. The accumulations of sediment you can point to here and there are paltry little collections by comparison.

Have you ever looked at a globe of the earth? There is this huge area that we call the Pacific Ocean. Sediment is being deposited there in an area that is many times the size of the Kaibab, in square miles. Over millions of years those sediments will become layered strata.

Pretty damn bogus reply.

I can't see AT ALL how the deep ocean basin deposition model really has anything to do with any with the sediment deposition of the Grand Canyon area rocks. At best, MAYBE the bottom-most pre-Cambrian rocks that are now high grade metamorphics MIGHT have some sort of deep ocean origins. MAYBE.

Moose


This message is a reply to:
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