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Author Topic:   Persecuted Christians finally getting noticed
ringo
Member
Posts: 16242
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005
Member Rating: 2.0


Message 31 of 137 (727755)
05-20-2014 12:56 PM
Reply to: Message 30 by AZPaul3
05-19-2014 8:10 AM


Re: To The Sudan
AZPaul3 writes:

First, if there were some way to chose which christians went....


There would be no point in sending any but the "True" Christians. I don't know if you could find 10 milion.
This message is a reply to:
 Message 30 by AZPaul3, posted 05-19-2014 8:10 AM AZPaul3 has acknowledged this reply

  
Dr Adequate
Member
Posts: 16086
Joined: 07-20-2006
Member Rating: 10.0


Message 32 of 137 (728653)
05-31-2014 11:02 PM


Meriam Ibrahim 'to be freed' from death row in Sudan

A senior Khartoum official reveals that Meriam Ibrahim will be freed following worldwide protests about her treatment

This is more of a rumor than an official declaration as yet:

A Foreign Office spokeswoman said: "We are aware of and urgently seeking clarification from the Sudanese authorities of reports that Meriam Ibrahim, the mother facing the death penalty in Sudan, is to be freed."

Replies to this message:
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Faith
Inactive Member


Message 33 of 137 (728654)
05-31-2014 11:08 PM
Reply to: Message 32 by Dr Adequate
05-31-2014 11:02 PM


Thank you.
This message is a reply to:
 Message 32 by Dr Adequate, posted 05-31-2014 11:02 PM Dr Adequate has not yet responded

  
Faith
Inactive Member


Message 34 of 137 (728689)
06-01-2014 8:25 PM


She's still not released but the international uproar is very encouraging.

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-africa-27646890

Edited by Faith, : No reason given.


Replies to this message:
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Faith
Inactive Member


Message 35 of 137 (729714)
06-17-2014 4:29 PM
Reply to: Message 34 by Faith
06-01-2014 8:25 PM


Guess it was too much to hope that even an international outcry would make a difference to the hidebound Sudanese government. This is the same government that engineered, and I gather is still promoting, the genocidal atrocities of Darfur. The UN doesn't do anything despite international opinion against these actions. What can anybody do in such a situation?

This woman's plight is pitiable, and especially that of her small children, most particularly the little boy who is old enough to suffer in a way his newborn sister isn't yet. Meriam has been subjected to unnecessary pain and indignities, including having to give birth to her daughter while her feet were shackled to the floor and then lying in the blood from the delivery for days afterward.

There is also a claim that her children are US citizens that is either being ignored or unfairly contested so that the US is doing nothing about it.

Here are some links:

Guardian story describing her mistreatment.

Kerry responds but nothing happens. Question of children's US citizenship raised.

ACLJ on children's US citizenship. Accuses Obama administration of following Shariah law rather than US law.

Amnesty International report and petition.


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Replies to this message:
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Granny Magda
Member
Posts: 2380
From: UK
Joined: 11-12-2007


Message 36 of 137 (730024)
06-23-2014 10:22 AM
Reply to: Message 35 by Faith
06-17-2014 4:29 PM


Meriam Ibrahim Freed
Guess it was too much to hope that even an international outcry would make a difference to the hidebound Sudanese government.

Apparently not. The BBC report the Ibrahim has been freed and her sentence overturned. They don't detail quite how this leaves the exact status of the charge, but it's still breaking news so far.

Mutate and Survive


This message is a reply to:
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Faith
Inactive Member


(1)
Message 37 of 137 (730055)
06-23-2014 12:06 PM
Reply to: Message 36 by Granny Magda
06-23-2014 10:22 AM


Re: Meriam Ibrahim Freed
Oh I missed the report, thanks for posting it. I hope those quote marks around "freed" don't imply some kind of deception about whether she really was let go or not, especially since as the Guardian says nobody has yet seen any of the family.

Tears of joy.


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 Message 36 by Granny Magda, posted 06-23-2014 10:22 AM Granny Magda has not yet responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 38 by Dr Adequate, posted 06-23-2014 6:11 PM Faith has responded

  
Dr Adequate
Member
Posts: 16086
Joined: 07-20-2006
Member Rating: 10.0


Message 38 of 137 (730108)
06-23-2014 6:11 PM
Reply to: Message 37 by Faith
06-23-2014 12:06 PM


Re: Meriam Ibrahim Freed
Seems legit.

http://www.amnesty.org/...-international-pressure-2014-06-23


This message is a reply to:
 Message 37 by Faith, posted 06-23-2014 12:06 PM Faith has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 39 by Faith, posted 06-24-2014 12:18 AM Dr Adequate has not yet responded

  
Faith
Inactive Member


Message 39 of 137 (730128)
06-24-2014 12:18 AM
Reply to: Message 38 by Dr Adequate
06-23-2014 6:11 PM


Re: Meriam Ibrahim Freed
Very happy.
This message is a reply to:
 Message 38 by Dr Adequate, posted 06-23-2014 6:11 PM Dr Adequate has not yet responded

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 Message 40 by kjsimons, posted 06-24-2014 8:59 AM Faith has not yet responded

  
kjsimons
Member
Posts: 665
From: Orlando,FL
Joined: 06-17-2003


Message 40 of 137 (730140)
06-24-2014 8:59 AM
Reply to: Message 39 by Faith
06-24-2014 12:18 AM


Re: Meriam Ibrahim Freed
Unfortunately it appears she has now been rearrested. Not much in the way of details yet on why, but it's probably a safe bet that it has to do with her original "crime".
This message is a reply to:
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 Message 41 by NoNukes, posted 06-24-2014 4:51 PM kjsimons has not yet responded

  
NoNukes
Inactive Member


Message 41 of 137 (730175)
06-24-2014 4:51 PM
Reply to: Message 40 by kjsimons
06-24-2014 8:59 AM


Re: Meriam Ibrahim Freed
Unfortunately it appears she has now been rearrested.

It appears she was detained at the airport. Details are sketchy even now, but the state department is saying that she has NOT be arrested again.


Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)

I have never met a man so ignorant that I couldn't learn something from him. Galileo Galilei

If there is no struggle, there is no progress. Those who profess to favor freedom, and deprecate agitation, are men who want crops without plowing up the ground, they want rain without thunder and lightning. Frederick Douglass


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Faith
Inactive Member


Message 42 of 137 (730182)
06-25-2014 4:28 AM
Reply to: Message 41 by NoNukes
06-24-2014 4:51 PM


Re: Meriam Ibrahim Freed
And now released again . And here's another report
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Dr Adequate
Member
Posts: 16086
Joined: 07-20-2006
Member Rating: 10.0


Message 43 of 137 (730183)
06-25-2014 4:33 AM


Oh now the Sudanese are just dicking with us.
  
Faith
Inactive Member


Message 44 of 137 (730184)
06-25-2014 4:48 AM


Complicated politics in the Sudan, one bunch objecting to the decisions of another bunch and both with enough political power to back up their opinions. And the personal situation is also complicated. Meriam has enemies on her Muslim father's side of the family, which her husband says are really after her successful businesses, but whether that's their motive or not they are persecuting her for being Christian with a Muslim father.
Replies to this message:
 Message 45 by dwise1, posted 06-25-2014 10:40 AM Faith has responded

  
dwise1
Member
Posts: 3310
Joined: 05-02-2006
Member Rating: 5.1


Message 45 of 137 (730197)
06-25-2014 10:40 AM
Reply to: Message 44 by Faith
06-25-2014 4:48 AM


... but whether that's their motive or not they are persecuting her for being Christian with a Muslim father.

The charges include apostasy from Islam, that she had left Islam to become a Christian. Under Islamic law, apostasy is a capital offense. Whether or not the facts of the case support that charge -- and on the surface they don't appear to, but that depends on what being born to a Muslim father means under the law -- , she is not being persecuted merely for being a Christian but rather is being prosecuted for apostasy.

What is Biblical Law on apostasy? Deuteronomy 13:610 calls for immediately killing the apostate, though it also discusses the apostate trying to talk others into following him into apostasy. A leading advocate of implementing Biblical Law to govern American society, Calvinist and Christian Reconstructionist Rousas John Rushdoony, includes apostasy as a long list of capital crimes. If all these advocates of imposing Biblical Law ever succeed, non-Christians and ex-Christians would face the same situation in this country.

The only difference is that Islam takes its religious laws seriously enough to enforce them, while Christians and Jews do not. Evangelical/Fundamentalist/Conservative/"True" Christians typically condemn others for not taking their religions' God-given laws seriously and yet they also condemn Muslims precisely for taking their religious laws seriously.

I most certainly do not agree with Islamic Law on apostasy, nor with the Bible nor with "true Christians", and call for her release. But please call it what it is.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 44 by Faith, posted 06-25-2014 4:48 AM Faith has responded

Replies to this message:
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