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Author | Topic: How did the stomach evolve? | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
CoolBeans Member (Idle past 3635 days) Posts: 196 From: Honduras Joined: |
Dont gastric acids disolve the food but without the protection it would burn the stomach and for them to exist we would need something to be protected from. Im just curious.
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Admin Director Posts: 13017 From: EvC Forum Joined: Member Rating: 1.8 |
I think you're asking how gastric acids evolved before the protective stomach lining existed. I'll promote this now, if I got that wrong you can clarify.
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Admin Director Posts: 13017 From: EvC Forum Joined: Member Rating: 1.8 |
Thread copied here from the How did the stomach evolve? thread in the Proposed New Topics forum.
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Stile Member Posts: 4295 From: Ontario, Canada Joined:
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CoolBeans writes: Don't gastric acids dissolve the food but without the protection it would burn the stomach and for them to exist we would need something to be protected from. Yes, this is correct.
How did the stomach evolve? The stomach evolved a long time before humans were around. By the time humans came around, the stomach had already evolved to the point where it had gastric acids and mucous protection. The mucous would be present first... although not like the mucous we have. A much more basic version.The mucous would work with a simple in/out system just helping things move around (before there's even a "stomach!"). Eventually, a "digesting pouch" evolves that we can sort of call a stomach. Once this basic stomach exists, small amounts of gastric acids would help with digestion. At this point, the acids and protection would evolve together.As one gets a bit stronger... so does the other. Not necessarily either one over the other at any specific time. And then... one day... a stomach! And then... after a lot more days... humans with a stomach!
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Taq Member Posts: 10038 Joined: Member Rating: 5.3
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Dont gastric acids disolve the food but without the protection it would burn the stomach and for them to exist we would need something to be protected from. Im just curious. The first thing to keep in mind is that the esophagus, stomach, and intestines are considered the "outside" of your body. One of the things that the outside of our bodies needs to protect us from is pathogens, and that is exactly what our mucosal membranes do. The lining of the stomach is a mucous membrane. I would strongly suspect that the first function of acid in the digestive tract was to kill off unwanted pathogens, and our stomachs still serve this purpose. The fauna in our intestine differs from our oral fauna partly due to our stomach separating the two.
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NoNukes Inactive Member |
This question seems of a type with the question of how could an electric eel evolve, and I don't think it is too terribly difficult to come up with a starting point and a path that could work. As a class they require thinking of acids or electricity only at their most potent levels.
First, acids do attack the digestive track, but really weak acids need not do so at a rate that endangers the organisms survival. So a starting point might be a digestive system only able to digest the easiest foods. Natural selection might then favor variation providing greater resistance to stronger digestive fluid allowing more choice of foodstuff. Organisms do have some control over eating stuff that upsets their tummies and also in the strength of the acid they secrete. But evolution could favor animals that can eat stuff that makes their competition sick. Next up how did cheetahs evolve their great speed? Shouldn't they have all died out when they were too slow to catch gazelles or escape lions? Edited by NoNukes, : No reason given.Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846) I have never met a man so ignorant that I couldn't learn something from him. Galileo Galilei If there is no struggle, there is no progress. Those who profess to favor freedom, and deprecate agitation, are men who want crops without plowing up the ground, they want rain without thunder and lightning. Frederick Douglass
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ringo Member (Idle past 433 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined:
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CoolBeans writes:
Very carefully.
How did the stomach evolve?
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Dogmafood Member (Idle past 370 days) Posts: 1815 From: Ontario Canada Joined: |
It wasn't careful at all. It just kept on evolving until it worked. In fact it could still use a little fine tuning.
Like for example, it should regurgitate anything that is not good and wholesome. Processed food should make you puke on the spot and illogical arguments should make us bilious. If there was any care involved at all then McDonald's would have gone out of business long ago.
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ringo Member (Idle past 433 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
ProtoTypical writes:
Well, no. It had to be working all along. Each step had to be "careful" in the sense that it couldn't be fatal.
It just kept on evolving until it worked. ProtoTypical writes:
If you talk about what it "should" do, you're arguing for design. Like for example, it should regurgitate anything that is not good and wholesome. (If I had added, "like porcupines mating," would you have recognized the joke?)
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Cedre Member (Idle past 1511 days) Posts: 350 From: Russia Joined: |
Stile said:
"And then... one day... a stomach! And then... after a lot more days... humans with a stomach!" Voila! Magic! Edited by Cedre, : No reason given.
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AZPaul3 Member Posts: 8527 From: Phoenix Joined: Member Rating: 5.2 |
Voila! Magic! Since you believe in majik I would have thought this would make you happy. I guess the slow time consuming incremental magic of evolution is just not majikie enough for you . You prefer the ...
... kind, like when your god blows his nose at you, I suppose.
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RAZD Member (Idle past 1426 days) Posts: 20714 From: the other end of the sidewalk Joined: |
Dont gastric acids disolve the food but without the protection it would burn the stomach and for them to exist we would need something to be protected from. Im just curious Consider a sponge. by our ability to understand Rebel American Zen Deist ... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ... to share. Join the effort to solve medical problems, AIDS/HIV, Cancer and more with Team EvC! (click)
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Stile Member Posts: 4295 From: Ontario, Canada Joined: |
Your comment seems a little lacking in substance. Perhaps you could try again with a bit more information on your particular issues.
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Saviourmachine Member (Idle past 3575 days) Posts: 113 From: Holland Joined: |
I've been always amazed that fire has not invented by one branch of animals. It would have been great, you'll need a very tough stomach and a mother who breathes into you her fire when you are born. And of course, some sophisticated cooling mechanism would be required as well. However, after this, you can eat things, very few other animals can eat. Perhaps, if oil was closer to the surface, this would have been a valuable path for evolution.
To be able to handle an acidic solution seems less of a feat.
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Larni Member (Idle past 185 days) Posts: 4000 From: Liverpool Joined:
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Bombardier Beatle says 'hi'.
The above ontological example models the zero premise to BB theory. It does so by applying the relative uniformity assumption that the alleged zero event eventually ontologically progressed from the compressed alleged sub-microscopic chaos to bloom/expand into all of the present observable order, more than it models the Biblical record evidence for the existence of Jehovah, the maximal Biblical god designer. -Attributed to Buzsaw Message 53 The explain to them any scientific investigation that explains the existence of things qualifies as science and as an explanation-Attributed to Dawn Bertot Message 286 Does a query (thats a question Stile) that uses this physical reality, to look for an answer to its existence and properties become theoretical, considering its deductive conclusions are based against objective verifiable realities.-Attributed to Dawn Bertot Message 134
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