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Author Topic:   Continuation of Flood Discussion
NoNukes
Inactive Member


Message 206 of 1304 (731464)
05-12-2014 2:19 PM


Re: To edge: no tectonic activity in Grand Canyon Paleozoic
I keep trying to get you to focus on a very specific set of facts, but you keep bringing in others which only confuses things.
You don't see anything silly about your position? Your thesis should explain all facts. Bringing in other evidence is exactly what someone disagreeing with you should be doing.

Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)
I have never met a man so ignorant that I couldn't learn something from him. Galileo Galilei
If there is no struggle, there is no progress. Those who profess to favor freedom, and deprecate agitation, are men who want crops without plowing up the ground, they want rain without thunder and lightning. Frederick Douglass

  
NoNukes
Inactive Member


Message 218 of 1304 (731476)
05-13-2014 8:01 AM


I haven't laid out all its parts in this thread
You cannot do that because you don't have a model. What you have is a conclusion which all facts must be fit into. Small wonder that you object to people asking about facts that you are not willing to consider. Small wonder that you pretend that relevant issues are a paradigm shift.
Right now I couldn't care less what anybody thinks, you won't consider what I'm saying
Once again you feel you need to tell us how you've suffered by not being believed. It is not about you. You are free to believe what you want and to type what you want. But you cannot post that weak stuff here and not get a rebuttal.
And your own rebuttal response is the perfect opportunity to show me where I've done wrong in my critique. Somehow you always take it as the time to whine. If you want a forum to publish stuff without critique, there is always your blog.
I'm trying to show can be thought of in a different way
Apparently, your 'way' involves quite a bit of selective viewing of the evidence and ignoring of the facts. That is not the least bit convincing. Nobody is going to change away from a scientific method of looking at the evidence until you've shown you have something better.
Let's be specific. When you say that seismic activity should have caused effect X and that effect Y is not enough, why should we believe your unsupported statement? You have zero credentials and no background. From that view point, every answer can be rejected and none accepted. Not surprising that you yourself cannot find anything wrong with your own proposals.
that I'd love to see you all take a flying leap off the GC north rim (it's higher).
I hope your day is blessed. Mine will be.
Edited by NoNukes, : No reason given.

Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)
I have never met a man so ignorant that I couldn't learn something from him. Galileo Galilei
If there is no struggle, there is no progress. Those who profess to favor freedom, and deprecate agitation, are men who want crops without plowing up the ground, they want rain without thunder and lightning. Frederick Douglass

  
NoNukes
Inactive Member


Message 240 of 1304 (731498)
05-13-2014 8:36 PM


Re: Thickness of layers doesn't change parallel
That of course is quite wrong but I guess an illustration is needed.
Do you know what the word parallel means? I ask that because your drawing does not show even a single pair of parallel layers. Perhaps you mean to emphasize the maintaining of some other relationship between the layers other than being parallel.
Edited by NoNukes, : No reason given.

Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)
I have never met a man so ignorant that I couldn't learn something from him. Galileo Galilei
If there is no struggle, there is no progress. Those who profess to favor freedom, and deprecate agitation, are men who want crops without plowing up the ground, they want rain without thunder and lightning. Frederick Douglass

  
NoNukes
Inactive Member


Message 248 of 1304 (731506)
05-13-2014 10:08 PM


Re: "Parallel"
Actually, I asked you that.
Is the fish in your picture actually parallel to the snake? Nope. Are the scissors actually parallel to anything? Nope.
But at least with this picture I can identify an axis of some kind for each object and I can decide that in the 2D picture, the axes are lines that are parallel to each other. Clearly that is all that this picture shows. I could call those objects parallel in at least that sense. I would be ignoring any thickness those objects have perpendicular to the plane of the paper.
But I'd only be talking about the drawings of the objects. Quite clearly the fish is in water and and the snake, while depicted below the fish is on the surface of the ground. The objects are not really parallel if I take into account how they really appear.
And now back to the picture of the layers which is actually supposed to represent something in 3D. What would be the axes or plane defined by the green layer for example that can be said to be parallel to an axis or plane defined by the orangish layer? Neither layer is horizontal.
I maintain that there is no such line or plane.
Edited by NoNukes, : No reason given.

Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)
I have never met a man so ignorant that I couldn't learn something from him. Galileo Galilei
If there is no struggle, there is no progress. Those who profess to favor freedom, and deprecate agitation, are men who want crops without plowing up the ground, they want rain without thunder and lightning. Frederick Douglass

  
NoNukes
Inactive Member


Message 250 of 1304 (731508)
05-14-2014 8:16 AM


Re: "Parallel"
What you are saying when you call all of those layers parallel is that we should ignore how the heights of the layers change at various points.
Well, no. That's not what parallel means.

Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)
I have never met a man so ignorant that I couldn't learn something from him. Galileo Galilei
If there is no struggle, there is no progress. Those who profess to favor freedom, and deprecate agitation, are men who want crops without plowing up the ground, they want rain without thunder and lightning. Frederick Douglass

  
NoNukes
Inactive Member


Message 251 of 1304 (731509)
05-14-2014 8:20 AM


Re: "Parallel"
What you are saying when you call all of those layers parallel is that we should ignore how the heights of the layers change at various points.
Well, no. That's not what parallel means.

Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)
I have never met a man so ignorant that I couldn't learn something from him. Galileo Galilei
If there is no struggle, there is no progress. Those who profess to favor freedom, and deprecate agitation, are men who want crops without plowing up the ground, they want rain without thunder and lightning. Frederick Douglass

  
NoNukes
Inactive Member


Message 256 of 1304 (731514)
05-14-2014 10:01 AM


Re: "Parallel"
cross section are in fact much more neatly parallel overall
More neatly parallel?
What they prove is that tectonic disturbance did not occur during their laying down at all,
Interesting conclusion. We had an earthquake in Northern Virginia a couple of years ago. The seismic activity was felt at least as far south as Central North Carolina. But when I went outside I found that all of the streets that had been approximately horizontal remained so. Could not see any difference in alignment. The streets were all still nearly parallel to their original planes as far as I could see.
I'm not sure what kind of distortions from perfectly flat and horizontal you would accept as being evidence of tectonic activity, but when you call the layers in your drawing parallel, then I can see that you would ignore any deviation from horizontal anyway.
Edited by NoNukes, : No reason given.

Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)
I have never met a man so ignorant that I couldn't learn something from him. Galileo Galilei
If there is no struggle, there is no progress. Those who profess to favor freedom, and deprecate agitation, are men who want crops without plowing up the ground, they want rain without thunder and lightning. Frederick Douglass

  
NoNukes
Inactive Member


Message 274 of 1304 (731532)
05-15-2014 7:11 AM


Re: More unbelievable stuff!
which I'm sure Faith will find laughably incredible since it shows 14 minor transgressive/regressive cycles in 2500 feet of section at the Joggins coal fields of Nova Scotia.
I think it would be cool to discuss the geology of Nova Scotia. After all that area was surely covered by the Great Flood even if Noah never saw it, right? It isn't all about the GC.
Edited by NoNukes, : No reason given.

Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)
I have never met a man so ignorant that I couldn't learn something from him. Galileo Galilei
If there is no struggle, there is no progress. Those who profess to favor freedom, and deprecate agitation, are men who want crops without plowing up the ground, they want rain without thunder and lightning. Frederick Douglass

  
NoNukes
Inactive Member


Message 275 of 1304 (731533)
05-15-2014 7:15 AM


Irony meter hits the peg.
Actually the problem isn't English is it? It's that you don't know how to put a picture into words so that someone else can understand you.
Ouch. Coming from Miss Parallel, that's got to hurt.

Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)
I have never met a man so ignorant that I couldn't learn something from him. Galileo Galilei
If there is no struggle, there is no progress. Those who profess to favor freedom, and deprecate agitation, are men who want crops without plowing up the ground, they want rain without thunder and lightning. Frederick Douglass

  
NoNukes
Inactive Member


Message 435 of 1304 (731693)
05-22-2014 8:19 PM


Re: Summation Time?
Maybe a technical discussion could continue.
I'd like to see the technical discussion continue, but I don't know much geology beyond the rock cycle stuff they teach in general science courses. If you or anyone else out there could comment on one of the following questions maybe that would be of some interest. I understand that the questions are highly subjective, and it is no problem if you change your mind about the answers.
1. What feature of the grand canyon would you say is most problematic for people who maintain that the GC was created in a few months by flood waters.
2. What features of the grand canyon exist for which the scientific explanations are very speculative and possibly bordering on just plain guessing? Surely there are some perplexing features.
Edited by NoNukes, : No reason given.

Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)
I have never met a man so ignorant that I couldn't learn something from him. Galileo Galilei
If there is no struggle, there is no progress. Those who profess to favor freedom, and deprecate agitation, are men who want crops without plowing up the ground, they want rain without thunder and lightning. Frederick Douglass

  
NoNukes
Inactive Member


Message 500 of 1304 (731758)
06-29-2014 12:50 PM


The Colorado River drains a large area, some seven states if I recall correctly, so it could be the remains of the water from the Flood that washed through all that area including Monument Valley, but I don't know.
Do you know what a river is?

Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)
I have never met a man so ignorant that I couldn't learn something from him. Galileo Galilei
If there is no struggle, there is no progress. Those who profess to favor freedom, and deprecate agitation, are men who want crops without plowing up the ground, they want rain without thunder and lightning. Frederick Douglass

  
NoNukes
Inactive Member


Message 645 of 1304 (732029)
07-03-2014 12:20 AM
Reply to: Message 644 by edge
07-02-2014 11:22 PM


Re: massive erosion after 100s of MYs of no massive erosion
Good points. I think that the best service that Faith's posts provide is bullet-proof confirmation that YEC is intellectually bankrupt. They remind us that science is the correct instrument for viewing the universe.
I think Faith is particularly bad at explaining YEC. I don't judge them by what I see from her.

Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)
I have never met a man so ignorant that I couldn't learn something from him. Galileo Galilei
If there is no struggle, there is no progress. Those who profess to favor freedom, and deprecate agitation, are men who want crops without plowing up the ground, they want rain without thunder and lightning. Frederick Douglass

This message is a reply to:
 Message 644 by edge, posted 07-02-2014 11:22 PM edge has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 647 by hooah212002, posted 07-03-2014 1:08 AM NoNukes has not replied

  
NoNukes
Inactive Member


Message 803 of 1304 (732341)
07-06-2014 5:47 PM
Reply to: Message 800 by Faith
07-06-2014 4:50 PM


Re: Imagination rules in the sciences of the unwitnessed past
There is blatant in-your-face evidence for the Flood in the Geologic Column and its bazillions of fossils.
As has been pointed out any number of times. That evidence is completely consistent with an ancient earth and no flood. And when viewed in detail, the arrangement of fossils requires Creation proponents to put forth inane explanations that do not work. That problem alone is enough to rule out the flood as a cause of the geologic column.
Edited by NoNukes, : No reason given.

Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)
I have never met a man so ignorant that I couldn't learn something from him. Galileo Galilei
If there is no struggle, there is no progress. Those who profess to favor freedom, and deprecate agitation, are men who want crops without plowing up the ground, they want rain without thunder and lightning. Frederick Douglass

This message is a reply to:
 Message 800 by Faith, posted 07-06-2014 4:50 PM Faith has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 804 by ringo, posted 07-06-2014 6:05 PM NoNukes has replied

  
NoNukes
Inactive Member


Message 805 of 1304 (732344)
07-06-2014 6:59 PM
Reply to: Message 804 by ringo
07-06-2014 6:05 PM


Re: Imagination rules in the sciences of the unwitnessed past
I recall somebody suggesting that birds are higher in the geological column than dinosaurs because they might have been riding on dinosaurs.
It's as sensible as any other thing they've come up with;
Henny Youngman
There are a few clips of HY on youtube. I took the opportunity to watch a couple. Thanks

Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)
I have never met a man so ignorant that I couldn't learn something from him. Galileo Galilei
If there is no struggle, there is no progress. Those who profess to favor freedom, and deprecate agitation, are men who want crops without plowing up the ground, they want rain without thunder and lightning. Frederick Douglass

This message is a reply to:
 Message 804 by ringo, posted 07-06-2014 6:05 PM ringo has seen this message but not replied

  
NoNukes
Inactive Member


Message 1264 of 1304 (733274)
07-15-2014 3:05 PM
Reply to: Message 1263 by Faith
07-15-2014 1:58 PM


Re: Still wrong -- yep, you in this case
Do blieve that's a COAL SEAM , not igneous rock.
This question is a bit off the direct topic, but surely you are not limiting the geological column to igneous rock? Sedimentary rock includes rock made up of chemical substances (salts and other minerals), organic substances, and of course broken up bits of other rocks. I don't see any reason why combinations of sedimentary, igneous, and metamorphic rocks might not be present.
But back to the topic. You believe you have a definition of the geological column that is at variance with the definition everyone else claims is correct. But you have yet to do the obvious thing in defense of your position, which would be to site a source using your definition. Why is that?
Edited by NoNukes, : No reason given.

Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)
I have never met a man so ignorant that I couldn't learn something from him. Galileo Galilei
If there is no struggle, there is no progress. Those who profess to favor freedom, and deprecate agitation, are men who want crops without plowing up the ground, they want rain without thunder and lightning. Frederick Douglass

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1263 by Faith, posted 07-15-2014 1:58 PM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 1266 by New Cat's Eye, posted 07-15-2014 3:09 PM NoNukes has replied
 Message 1268 by Faith, posted 07-15-2014 3:21 PM NoNukes has not replied
 Message 1271 by Faith, posted 07-15-2014 3:43 PM NoNukes has not replied

  
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