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Author Topic:   Homeless in Paradise
RAZD
Member (Idle past 1427 days)
Posts: 20714
From: the other end of the sidewalk
Joined: 03-14-2004


(2)
Message 16 of 25 (736762)
09-12-2014 6:41 PM
Reply to: Message 14 by NoNukes
09-12-2014 5:35 PM


Re: mini homes
... homelessness was just another symptom. ...
Indeed, and the mental health aspect is embarrassing in the ignorance and ignoring of this major contributor to this problem. Closing mental health hospitals (thank you Reagan) doesn't cure the problem, it just shifts it.
The number of veterans is another embarrassing aspect -- often with a lot of overlap due to untreated traumatic stress.

we are limited in our ability to understand
by our ability to understand
RebelAmerican☆Zen☯Deist
... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ...
to share.


Join the effort to solve medical problems, AIDS/HIV, Cancer and more with Team EvC! (click)

This message is a reply to:
 Message 14 by NoNukes, posted 09-12-2014 5:35 PM NoNukes has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 17 by NoNukes, posted 09-12-2014 6:47 PM RAZD has replied

  
NoNukes
Inactive Member


Message 17 of 25 (736763)
09-12-2014 6:47 PM
Reply to: Message 16 by RAZD
09-12-2014 6:41 PM


Re: mini homes
The number of veterans is another embarrassing aspect
When I first moved back to NC, one of the first people to catch my eye was a homeless guy downtown bearing a sign saying he was a Navy Seal.

Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)
I have never met a man so ignorant that I couldn't learn something from him. Galileo Galilei
If there is no struggle, there is no progress. Those who profess to favor freedom, and deprecate agitation, are men who want crops without plowing up the ground, they want rain without thunder and lightning. Frederick Douglass

This message is a reply to:
 Message 16 by RAZD, posted 09-12-2014 6:41 PM RAZD has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 18 by RAZD, posted 09-12-2014 9:08 PM NoNukes has seen this message but not replied

  
RAZD
Member (Idle past 1427 days)
Posts: 20714
From: the other end of the sidewalk
Joined: 03-14-2004


Message 18 of 25 (736765)
09-12-2014 9:08 PM
Reply to: Message 17 by NoNukes
09-12-2014 6:47 PM


Re: mini homes
When I first moved back to NC, one of the first people to catch my eye was a homeless guy downtown bearing a sign saying he was a Navy Seal.
Taking care of vets should be one of the highest priorities in healthcare.

we are limited in our ability to understand
by our ability to understand
RebelAmerican☆Zen☯Deist
... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ...
to share.


Join the effort to solve medical problems, AIDS/HIV, Cancer and more with Team EvC! (click)

This message is a reply to:
 Message 17 by NoNukes, posted 09-12-2014 6:47 PM NoNukes has seen this message but not replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 434 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 19 of 25 (736800)
09-13-2014 11:57 AM
Reply to: Message 13 by Jon
09-12-2014 5:12 PM


Re: Business Taxes for Shelters
Jon writes:
As I discussed in my earlier post, it wasn't seeing the homeless people that was bothersome. It was the fact of how many of them behaved: unpredictable, ill-tempered, rude, etc. It is hard to enjoy anything with such people aroundwhether they're homeless or not.
So you're saying you don't mind seeing elephants as long as they're not big and gray with a trunk in front and eating trees and so on.
You don't solve a problem by moving it. You don't cure erratic behaviour by (ware)housing.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 13 by Jon, posted 09-12-2014 5:12 PM Jon has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 20 by Jon, posted 09-13-2014 1:33 PM ringo has replied

  
Jon
Inactive Member


Message 20 of 25 (736809)
09-13-2014 1:33 PM
Reply to: Message 19 by ringo
09-13-2014 11:57 AM


Re: Business Taxes for Shelters
So you're saying you don't mind seeing elephants as long as they're not big and gray with a trunk in front and eating trees and so on.
No. I'm saying I don't mind seeing elephants as long as they're not trying to step on me.

Love your enemies!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 19 by ringo, posted 09-13-2014 11:57 AM ringo has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 21 by ringo, posted 09-13-2014 1:43 PM Jon has replied
 Message 23 by NoNukes, posted 09-13-2014 11:07 PM Jon has not replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 434 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 21 of 25 (736810)
09-13-2014 1:43 PM
Reply to: Message 20 by Jon
09-13-2014 1:33 PM


Re: Business Taxes for Shelters
Jon writes:
No. I'm saying I don't mind seeing elephants as long as they're not trying to step on me.
As the scorpion said to the frog as they both drowned, "I couldn't help stinging you. I'm a scorpion. It's what I do."
Stepping on you is what elephants do. Acting cazy is what crazy people do. Moving them doesn't change their nature.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 20 by Jon, posted 09-13-2014 1:33 PM Jon has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 22 by Jon, posted 09-13-2014 3:53 PM ringo has replied

  
Jon
Inactive Member


Message 22 of 25 (736814)
09-13-2014 3:53 PM
Reply to: Message 21 by ringo
09-13-2014 1:43 PM


Re: Business Taxes for Shelters
Stepping on you is what elephants do. Acting cazy is what crazy people do. Moving them doesn't change their nature.
No, but it does keep me from getting stepped on.

Love your enemies!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 21 by ringo, posted 09-13-2014 1:43 PM ringo has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 25 by ringo, posted 09-14-2014 2:09 PM Jon has not replied

  
NoNukes
Inactive Member


(1)
Message 23 of 25 (736855)
09-13-2014 11:07 PM
Reply to: Message 20 by Jon
09-13-2014 1:33 PM


Re: Business Taxes for Shelters
No. I'm saying I don't mind seeing elephants as long as they're not trying to step on me.
Aren't you talking about the elephants you encounter when you visit their locale?
Tourists are a mixed bag. People who live in 'spring break' destinations will be happy to tell you stories about tourists who cause essentially the same types of damage as homeless people.
Tourists do generate revenue and some people benefit immensely and directly, but tourists also create local price inflation. Not everyone benefits.
Not sure what the right answer is, but if the policies in your community helped create homelessness, and you don't provide services like drug treatment and mental health coverage, you shouldn't dump problems on someone else or on an empty area. Homeless people cannot survive away from a community.
You have talked about ways to have business people support the homeless. But really, the entire community is part of the problem.
Edited by NoNukes, : No reason given.
Edited by NoNukes, : No reason given.

Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)
I have never met a man so ignorant that I couldn't learn something from him. Galileo Galilei
If there is no struggle, there is no progress. Those who profess to favor freedom, and deprecate agitation, are men who want crops without plowing up the ground, they want rain without thunder and lightning. Frederick Douglass

This message is a reply to:
 Message 20 by Jon, posted 09-13-2014 1:33 PM Jon has not replied

  
NoNukes
Inactive Member


Message 24 of 25 (736864)
09-14-2014 5:20 AM
Reply to: Message 15 by RAZD
09-12-2014 6:37 PM


Re: mini homes
Yep, that's my experience too, and it is unfortunate - they would probably get a lot more donations of time and money if they weren't so self-important about it.
That kind of proselytizing is against National Habitat for Humanity policy. For what it's worth, I haven't experienced that from the local Restore here in central NC, but I haven't worked with them extensively. But yes they are a religiously motivated group.
quote:
Habitat for Humanity International and its affiliated organizations will not proselytize. Nor will HFH work with entities or individuals who insist on proselytizing as part of their work with HFH. This means that HFH will not offer assistance on the expressed or implied condition that people must adhere to or convert to a particular faith or listen and respond to messaging designed to induce conversion to a particular faith.

Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)
I have never met a man so ignorant that I couldn't learn something from him. Galileo Galilei
If there is no struggle, there is no progress. Those who profess to favor freedom, and deprecate agitation, are men who want crops without plowing up the ground, they want rain without thunder and lightning. Frederick Douglass

This message is a reply to:
 Message 15 by RAZD, posted 09-12-2014 6:37 PM RAZD has seen this message but not replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 434 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 25 of 25 (736885)
09-14-2014 2:09 PM
Reply to: Message 22 by Jon
09-13-2014 3:53 PM


Re: Business Taxes for Shelters
Jon writes:
No, but it does keep me from getting stepped on.
So "Love your enemies!" but dump your garbage in your neighbour's yard? Nice.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 22 by Jon, posted 09-13-2014 3:53 PM Jon has not replied

  
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