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Author Topic:   Is the Bible the inerrant word of God? Or is it the words of men?
New Cat's Eye
Inactive Member


(2)
Message 781 of 2241 (743904)
12-05-2014 1:07 PM
Reply to: Message 780 by Faith
12-05-2014 12:47 PM


Re: Myths and Legends and Fairy Tales Come True
The truth can't drive anyone away from Christianity.
Its your falsehoods that drive people away from Christianity.
Not that I think I've done a stellar job of it, but I know I've only presented truth here.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 780 by Faith, posted 12-05-2014 12:47 PM Faith has not replied

  
PaulK
Member
Posts: 17825
Joined: 01-10-2003
Member Rating: 2.2


Message 782 of 2241 (743907)
12-05-2014 1:11 PM
Reply to: Message 776 by Faith
12-05-2014 12:17 PM


Re: Knowing God
quote:
What?
You go from accusing me of denying that the Bible is a God-inspired whole, but now "admitting" it, to what exactly?
I merely point out that claiming that God is the author of the Bible contradicts the claim that it had multiple human authors.
quote:
But the evidence is incredibly strong and worthy of trust.
No, it isn't. That's why you can't come up with anything good.
quote:
Try believing it instead of criticizing it.
I did. Maybe you will one day. Or better yet, maybe you'll understand it instead of ising it as an excuse to justify your own prejudices.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 776 by Faith, posted 12-05-2014 12:17 PM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 783 by Faith, posted 12-05-2014 1:31 PM PaulK has replied

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1466 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 783 of 2241 (743911)
12-05-2014 1:31 PM
Reply to: Message 782 by PaulK
12-05-2014 1:11 PM


Re: Knowing God
I merely point out that claiming that God is the author of the Bible contradicts the claim that it had multiple human authors.
But that's ridiculous. Of course it had multiple human authors, all moved by the Spirit of God.
As for the rest, Oh well.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 782 by PaulK, posted 12-05-2014 1:11 PM PaulK has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 784 by PaulK, posted 12-05-2014 1:47 PM Faith has replied

  
PaulK
Member
Posts: 17825
Joined: 01-10-2003
Member Rating: 2.2


Message 784 of 2241 (743914)
12-05-2014 1:47 PM
Reply to: Message 783 by Faith
12-05-2014 1:31 PM


Re: Knowing God
quote:
But that's ridiculous. Of course it had multiple human authors, all moved by the Spirit of God.
Who said "Being inspired means God authored it" ?
quote:
As for the rest, Oh well.
Yeah, I guess you know that you don't have any decent evidence. That's why you won't discuss it.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 783 by Faith, posted 12-05-2014 1:31 PM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 785 by Faith, posted 12-05-2014 1:52 PM PaulK has replied

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1466 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 785 of 2241 (743915)
12-05-2014 1:52 PM
Reply to: Message 784 by PaulK
12-05-2014 1:47 PM


Re: Knowing God
But that's ridiculous. Of course it had multiple human authors, all moved by the Spirit of God.
Who said "Being inspired means God authored it" ?
I don't know how you are finding this difficult. God DID author it, by inspiring the human writers to write according to His inspiration.
Yeah, I guess you know that you don't have any decent evidence. That's why you won't discuss it.
As I said, I have serious doubts that you would be persuaded by the excellent evidence there is. But I haven't yet read the Scarlet Thread of Redemption. We'll see how that goes.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 784 by PaulK, posted 12-05-2014 1:47 PM PaulK has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 786 by PaulK, posted 12-05-2014 2:03 PM Faith has not replied
 Message 797 by GDR, posted 12-07-2014 9:12 PM Faith has replied

  
PaulK
Member
Posts: 17825
Joined: 01-10-2003
Member Rating: 2.2


Message 786 of 2241 (743916)
12-05-2014 2:03 PM
Reply to: Message 785 by Faith
12-05-2014 1:52 PM


Re: Knowing God
quote:
I don't know how you are finding this difficult. God DID author it, by inspiring the human writers to write according to His inspiratiOn
I'm not having any trouble at all. You're the one with the problem. If the human authors aren't writing their words from their experiences they aren't making any sort of witness statement.
quote:
As I said, I have serious doubts that you would be persuaded by the excellent evidence there is.
You mean that you expect me to tell the truth rather than pretending that you're right.
quote:
But I haven't yet read the Scarlet Thread of Redemption. We'll see how that goes.
I've glanced at it. It's a sermon, not very long. And it says much less than you claimed. Not that I expect you to put the actual text ahead of what you want it to say. After your treatment of the Bible and Calvin I have no illusions on that score.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 785 by Faith, posted 12-05-2014 1:52 PM Faith has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 790 by NoNukes, posted 12-06-2014 3:03 AM PaulK has replied

  
NoNukes
Inactive Member


Message 787 of 2241 (743917)
12-05-2014 2:26 PM
Reply to: Message 767 by Phat
12-05-2014 10:23 AM


Re: Knowing God
Is the evidence we seek evidence for absolute (or complete) truth or is this a necessity?
Phat, I don't understand your question. Is what a necessity?

Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)
I have never met a man so ignorant that I couldn't learn something from him. Galileo Galilei
If there is no struggle, there is no progress. Those who profess to favor freedom, and deprecate agitation, are men who want crops without plowing up the ground, they want rain without thunder and lightning. Frederick Douglass

This message is a reply to:
 Message 767 by Phat, posted 12-05-2014 10:23 AM Phat has not replied

  
jar
Member (Idle past 415 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 788 of 2241 (743932)
12-05-2014 9:11 PM
Reply to: Message 773 by Faith
12-05-2014 12:03 PM


Re: Myths and Legends and Fairy Tales Come True
Faith writes:
And there you are again speaking your false reading of the Bible from the deepest darkest jungle of self-inspired Bible mutilation.
Faith I am not giving any false reading, and folk (as long as they are not "Biblical Christians) can even go and read what is actually written in Genesis 2&3.
We don't need the Book of Revelation to be able to actually read what is written in Genesis 2&3.
AbE: Also, I've read the Bible Faith and in Revelation Satan is called the serpent that deceives mankind while in Genesis 2&3 the serpent actually tells the truth and deceives no one. It is the God character that deceives mankind so the God character in Genesis 2&3 is Satan according to Revelation?
Edited by jar, : see AbE:

Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 773 by Faith, posted 12-05-2014 12:03 PM Faith has not replied

  
Astrophile
Member (Idle past 149 days)
Posts: 92
From: United Kingdom
Joined: 02-10-2014


Message 789 of 2241 (743940)
12-06-2014 1:48 AM
Reply to: Message 770 by Faith
12-05-2014 11:30 AM


Re: Myths and Legends and Fairy Tales Come True
That one was, because it was possessed by Satan, and he can talk.
In Genesis, 3:12-13, the man says,
quote:
'The woman whom thou gavest to be with me, she gave me of the tree, and I did eat.'
and the woman says,
quote:
'The serpent beguiled me, and I did eat.'
If the serpent was possessed by Satan, and was therefore able to talk, why didn't God ask it why it had beguiled the woman? I'm sure a lot of people would be very interested to know, and even the serpent had a right to say something in its defence.
Also, if the serpent was possessed by Satan, one could argue that it was not responsible for its actions. If so, why did God punish all natural snakes by forcing them to march on their stomachs, like Napoleon's army?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 770 by Faith, posted 12-05-2014 11:30 AM Faith has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 792 by NoNukes, posted 12-06-2014 4:49 AM Astrophile has seen this message but not replied
 Message 795 by Phat, posted 12-07-2014 5:38 PM Astrophile has seen this message but not replied

  
NoNukes
Inactive Member


Message 790 of 2241 (743941)
12-06-2014 3:03 AM
Reply to: Message 786 by PaulK
12-05-2014 2:03 PM


Re: Knowing God
I'm not having any trouble at all. You're the one with the problem. If the human authors aren't writing their words from their experiences they aren't making any sort of witness statement.
Perhaps the answer to this seeming contradiction is simply to think of God more in the way a Calvinist would. In a universe where everything is pre-ordained, men simply write the scripture God would have them write. If under such thinking, all of the evil men do is predestined by God, surely their Biblical writings are as well.

Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)
I have never met a man so ignorant that I couldn't learn something from him. Galileo Galilei
If there is no struggle, there is no progress. Those who profess to favor freedom, and deprecate agitation, are men who want crops without plowing up the ground, they want rain without thunder and lightning. Frederick Douglass

This message is a reply to:
 Message 786 by PaulK, posted 12-05-2014 2:03 PM PaulK has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 791 by PaulK, posted 12-06-2014 3:31 AM NoNukes has seen this message but not replied

  
PaulK
Member
Posts: 17825
Joined: 01-10-2003
Member Rating: 2.2


Message 791 of 2241 (743943)
12-06-2014 3:31 AM
Reply to: Message 790 by NoNukes
12-06-2014 3:03 AM


Re: Knowing God
Which makes all books equally "inspired by God". I suppose Christians should be glad that Calvinism is not as Biblical as Faith pretends (even if she only means that her version of Calvinism agrees with her version of the Bible)

This message is a reply to:
 Message 790 by NoNukes, posted 12-06-2014 3:03 AM NoNukes has seen this message but not replied

  
NoNukes
Inactive Member


Message 792 of 2241 (743945)
12-06-2014 4:49 AM
Reply to: Message 789 by Astrophile
12-06-2014 1:48 AM


Re: Myths and Legends and Fairy Tales Come True
If the serpent was possessed by Satan, and was therefore able to talk, why didn't God ask it why it had beguiled the woman? I'm sure a lot of people would be very interested to know, and even the serpent had a right to say something in its defence.
For a real challenge, try to spin this story in a way that makes sense under Calvinist doctrine.

Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)
I have never met a man so ignorant that I couldn't learn something from him. Galileo Galilei
If there is no struggle, there is no progress. Those who profess to favor freedom, and deprecate agitation, are men who want crops without plowing up the ground, they want rain without thunder and lightning. Frederick Douglass

This message is a reply to:
 Message 789 by Astrophile, posted 12-06-2014 1:48 AM Astrophile has seen this message but not replied

  
ramoss
Member (Idle past 633 days)
Posts: 3228
Joined: 08-11-2004


Message 793 of 2241 (744020)
12-07-2014 1:32 PM
Reply to: Message 603 by Faith
11-16-2014 6:07 PM


Re: Some sermons on inspiration and inerrancy that back me up
How is the claim that so many people believe it is the truth evidence it is the truth? That is the logical fallacy known as 'argumentum ad populum' , also known as ". argumentum ad numerum ".

This message is a reply to:
 Message 603 by Faith, posted 11-16-2014 6:07 PM Faith has not replied

  
ramoss
Member (Idle past 633 days)
Posts: 3228
Joined: 08-11-2004


Message 794 of 2241 (744021)
12-07-2014 1:37 PM
Reply to: Message 626 by jar
11-25-2014 9:21 AM


Re: Dying for a Cause
Not only that, but the inquisition burnt many Jews, who died with them reciting the schema as the burnt to the crisp. that must mean Judaism is the truth, since these people died rejecting Christianity and they were tortured to death rather than renounce their faith.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 626 by jar, posted 11-25-2014 9:21 AM jar has not replied

  
Phat
Member
Posts: 18300
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003
Member Rating: 1.1


Message 795 of 2241 (744050)
12-07-2014 5:38 PM
Reply to: Message 789 by Astrophile
12-06-2014 1:48 AM


Re: Myths and Legends and Fairy Tales Come True
If the serpent was possessed by Satan, and was therefore able to talk, why didn't God ask it why it had beguiled the woman?
I'm quite sure that God already knew why. Satan was merely acting out the choice that he had made...to oppose God. God never asked questions to find out the answer. God asked us questions so that we would reflect on our decisions and choices and see ourselves in a mirror.

Saying, "I don't know," is the same as saying, "Maybe."~ZombieRingo
One of the major purposes of debate is to help you hone your arguments. Yours are pretty bad. They can use all the honing they can get.~Ringo

This message is a reply to:
 Message 789 by Astrophile, posted 12-06-2014 1:48 AM Astrophile has seen this message but not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 796 by jar, posted 12-07-2014 7:43 PM Phat has not replied

  
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