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Author Topic:   Earth science curriculum tailored to fit wavering fundamentalists
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1563 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 240 of 1053 (751846)
03-06-2015 2:25 PM
Reply to: Message 238 by ThinAirDesigns
03-06-2015 12:50 PM


Re: Iridium boundary layer
The thing is, the existence of a worldwide deposition of iridium can be explained in terms of the Flood of Noah too, as evidence of a meteor hit during the Flood, dispersing its iridium along with all the sediments the Flood deposited. I've mentioned it many times here and HERE's one of those posts.

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 Message 238 by ThinAirDesigns, posted 03-06-2015 12:50 PM ThinAirDesigns has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 242 by edge, posted 03-06-2015 2:32 PM Faith has replied
 Message 254 by ThinAirDesigns, posted 03-06-2015 4:40 PM Faith has replied
 Message 345 by kbertsche, posted 03-07-2015 12:28 PM Faith has replied

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1563 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 243 of 1053 (751851)
03-06-2015 2:35 PM
Reply to: Message 242 by edge
03-06-2015 2:32 PM


Re: Iridium boundary layer
The "so what?" is that as long as there is a plausible explanation for a given phenomenon's being caused by the Flood, you can't use it as an argument against YEC belief in the Flood.

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 Message 242 by edge, posted 03-06-2015 2:32 PM edge has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 244 by edge, posted 03-06-2015 2:43 PM Faith has replied
 Message 248 by New Cat's Eye, posted 03-06-2015 3:09 PM Faith has replied
 Message 253 by Taq, posted 03-06-2015 4:39 PM Faith has replied

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1563 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 245 of 1053 (751854)
03-06-2015 2:51 PM
Reply to: Message 244 by edge
03-06-2015 2:43 PM


Re: Iridium boundary layer
I think it does for ThinAir. His whole point is to find arguments against YEC.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 244 by edge, posted 03-06-2015 2:43 PM edge has replied

Replies to this message:
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Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1563 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 247 of 1053 (751858)
03-06-2015 3:07 PM
Reply to: Message 246 by edge
03-06-2015 2:59 PM


Re: Iridium boundary layer
If the Flood explains it all, there is no such thing as "Cambrian" animals for iridium to prove or disprove. They're all antediluvian creatures from bottom to top of the geo column.
But I can leave you to your argument with ThinAir if you like. Just wanted him to know that establishing how widespread the iridium is won't give him all that much of a case against YEC so he might as well not waste his time.

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 Message 246 by edge, posted 03-06-2015 2:59 PM edge has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 251 by edge, posted 03-06-2015 4:01 PM Faith has replied

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1563 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 249 of 1053 (751861)
03-06-2015 3:10 PM
Reply to: Message 248 by New Cat's Eye
03-06-2015 3:09 PM


Re: Iridium boundary layer
I do my best with whatever gets thrown at me.

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Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1563 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 256 of 1053 (751875)
03-06-2015 5:00 PM
Reply to: Message 251 by edge
03-06-2015 4:01 PM


Re: Iridium boundary layer
Sorry, I misspoke. It's not that the Flood "explains" the iridium layer, it's that it can be explained in relation to the Flood.

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Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1563 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 257 of 1053 (751877)
03-06-2015 5:01 PM
Reply to: Message 250 by New Cat's Eye
03-06-2015 3:31 PM


Re: Iridium boundary layer
As I said, I do what I can with what gets thrown at me. I don't expect to be able to answer everything that gets thrown at me but I have faith that it can be answered nevertheless.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 250 by New Cat's Eye, posted 03-06-2015 3:31 PM New Cat's Eye has replied

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Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1563 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 258 of 1053 (751878)
03-06-2015 5:02 PM
Reply to: Message 253 by Taq
03-06-2015 4:39 PM


Re: Iridium boundary layer
No.

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Replies to this message:
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Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1563 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 263 of 1053 (751883)
03-06-2015 5:07 PM
Reply to: Message 254 by ThinAirDesigns
03-06-2015 4:40 PM


Re: Iridium boundary layer
Settling out of standing water isn't the only way layers could form. Layers form in the deltas of rivers. Water does sort sediments. Running water. There's a whole thread here on Walther's Law showing how layers are formed by rising sea water. There were also some experiments done that show sorting occurring in a tank, keep forgetting the experimenter's name. Bertolt? Berthault? Something like that.
But I've argued out the Flood stuff for so long at EvC I really am not up to getting back into the whole thing, sorry. I just wanted to make that one comment about the iridium layer.
Yes there are lots of different ideas about what the Flood would have done and I have my own.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

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Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1563 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 265 of 1053 (751886)
03-06-2015 5:12 PM
Reply to: Message 264 by New Cat's Eye
03-06-2015 5:09 PM


Re: Iridium boundary layer
What I can envision is irrelevant. There are many things that are not explained by the Flood that are nevertheless not in conflict with it either. So what.

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Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1563 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 269 of 1053 (751891)
03-06-2015 5:27 PM
Reply to: Message 266 by ThinAirDesigns
03-06-2015 5:16 PM


Re: Iridium boundary layer
My "wave" theory? It's just obvious that when the Flood waters were receding from the land mass there would have been very long waves continuing to wash up over the land with the tides and normal wave action, and waves deposit sand on beaches, so why not whatever other sediments were being carried in the water? In fact the patterns of deposition of the different sedimentary layers across the North American continent suggest that sort of deposition, some extending all the way across, some only across a few states.
B: even if you DO have time to settle out a layer, any significant motion will displace and suspend the fresh layer once again. Just wade into any farm pond that has been sitting calm all year and you immediately stir up the soft silt layer and displace/suspend the particles in the water. Even a hard rain or strong wind rippling the surface heavily is enough to cause the water to become silty again. Watch what happens when they release extra water from a dam -- the muddy water is not from rain washing particles in (there's no rain after all), but from silt being stirred up by the current.
There's no reason to expect such disturbances after the rain stopped.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

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Replies to this message:
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Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1563 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 271 of 1053 (751893)
03-06-2015 5:28 PM
Reply to: Message 268 by Taq
03-06-2015 5:25 PM


Re: Iridium boundary layer
Shall I be more precise then for the hairsplitting nitpickers? The WHOLE SCOPE of what I can envision is irrelevant. That was the question I was answering. The specific things that I CAN envision is something else.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

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Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1563 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 272 of 1053 (751894)
03-06-2015 5:33 PM
Reply to: Message 260 by Taq
03-06-2015 5:04 PM


Re: Iridium boundary layer
Mountains.

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Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1563 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 275 of 1053 (751898)
03-06-2015 5:42 PM
Reply to: Message 273 by RAZD
03-06-2015 5:39 PM


Re: The Topic
This stuff is all speculative because it is about the past. They speculate about the iridium layer, I speculate about the iridium layer. I mentioned some observations I'm aware of about water deposition of sediments, which is already off the topic of iridium. I'm not interested in getting deeper into this right now.

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Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1563 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 277 of 1053 (751900)
03-06-2015 5:53 PM
Reply to: Message 274 by ThinAirDesigns
03-06-2015 5:40 PM


Re: Iridium boundary layer
If you agree that water sorts sediments, that's all I was saying. Some argue that the Flood would only have mixed things up, but water sorts sediments in many ways. Settling out, wave deposition of beach sand, Walther's Law deposition as sea water rises and falls, all suggest ways it must have happened in the Flood.
"Sloshed about in a tub" is hardly a model of the Flood. Rain saturating the land mass, causing mudslides probably the first effect, water rushing down in streams and rivers from higher to lower land, carrying massive amounts of sediments that then mix with the rising sea water. Sea water sorts into layers anyway, and currents. However it sorts beach sand it would sort the sediments now mixing into it, and the living things that it picked up with the sediments. When the water covers everything it may still have a lot of wave action but should become relatively placid after a while. When the deposition of sediments occurs is a question, perhaps during different stages of the rising and standing and falling. Walther's Law shows a definite pattern of deposition that should be explored. Anyway, no "sloshing" in my scenario.
And just for your information, I did not learn anything about creationism from church as a child, I gave up on religion for thirty years from age 15 on, became born again in my mid forties, and a few years later read some of the creationists but a lot of my thinking is my own variations on their ideas. I BECAME a YEC from my own reading and study, I wasn't subjected to it.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
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Replies to this message:
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