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Author Topic:   Windows 8
xongsmith
Member
Posts: 2578
From: massachusetts US
Joined: 01-01-2009
Member Rating: 6.8


Message 31 of 97 (754019)
03-23-2015 8:18 PM
Reply to: Message 30 by Son Goku
03-23-2015 6:34 PM


Re: .NET
I started out with Fortran IV, then Fortran 77, then C. I have never liked C++. I have dabbled in Java and javascript. Of them all, C is still my favorite.

- xongsmith, 5.7d

This message is a reply to:
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Replies to this message:
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 Message 33 by PaulK, posted 03-24-2015 8:30 AM xongsmith has not replied
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Percy
Member
Posts: 22391
From: New Hampshire
Joined: 12-23-2000
Member Rating: 5.2


Message 32 of 97 (754045)
03-24-2015 7:19 AM
Reply to: Message 31 by xongsmith
03-23-2015 8:18 PM


Re: .NET
xongsmith writes:
I have never liked C++.
While the object oriented structure of C++ is useful, the language itself is just a verbose pain until you start taking advantage of STL, which makes it possible to prototype very quickly, or at least that was my experience.
I've always felt that the advantages of object oriented design are oversold. Object oriented has value, but one big advantage it supposedly provides and that is described by most introductory texts is how easy object oriented makes it to extend, enhance and update programs without significant data structure redesign. In my own experience the object oriented data structures for real applications tend toward the non-trivial and never anticipate future needs to the point that redesigns aren't necessary. But STL, which deals with fairly simple object types, is an excellent example of the power of object oriented design, and object oriented has other advantages, the big one being polymorphism.
--Percy

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Replies to this message:
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PaulK
Member
Posts: 17822
Joined: 01-10-2003
Member Rating: 2.2


Message 33 of 97 (754049)
03-24-2015 8:30 AM
Reply to: Message 31 by xongsmith
03-23-2015 8:18 PM


Re: .NET
I got started with at school. At Uni I learned Fortran IV and Pascal (and a little machine code) worked with those (and some others) for a few years and then switched over to mainly using C. Many years later, C is still my main language, although I do some Java work on the side.
Object orientation may not be everything it was sold as, but it does help in some ways. Multi-threaded code is less difficult to write, for instance.

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coffee_addict
Member (Idle past 477 days)
Posts: 3645
From: Indianapolis, IN
Joined: 03-29-2004


Message 34 of 97 (754064)
03-24-2015 10:22 AM
Reply to: Message 32 by Percy
03-24-2015 7:19 AM


Re: .NET
Hey Percy, what do you think of C#?
After years of going from language to the other, I've fallen in love with C#. I think it is the perfect language for fake programmers like myself who never had formal training and had to learn everything on my own.

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Replies to this message:
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 Message 37 by New Cat's Eye, posted 03-24-2015 4:53 PM coffee_addict has replied

  
Percy
Member
Posts: 22391
From: New Hampshire
Joined: 12-23-2000
Member Rating: 5.2


(2)
Message 35 of 97 (754107)
03-24-2015 1:00 PM
Reply to: Message 34 by coffee_addict
03-24-2015 10:22 AM


Re: .NET
coffee_addict writes:
I think it is the perfect language for fake programmers like myself who never had formal training and had to learn everything on my own.
I'm an EE myself.
Hey Percy, what do you think of C#?
I've never used it. I did look into it, but that was long enough ago that I don't remember much. I was investigating whether development in Java or C# might provide significant enough advantages over PHP to make it worth switching.
In the end I decided that what's most important for building dynamic pages is Javascript, that the base development language isn't so important. I've shied away from the various Javascript libraries like jQuery and AngularJS because I usually have a clear idea of what I want, while the various JS libraries have their own idea of what you should want, so even if I began using them I think I might end up implementing from scratch a good deal of the time anyway. Plus these libraries add their own layer of bugs and idiosyncrasies.
To be more clear about why I avoid the JS libraries, has anyone else noticed that webpages are increasingly using JS libraries that detect whether you're on a computer versus a mobile based platform based on the width of your browser window? One example is DHMC and Clinics. If you're on a normal computer, visit that webpage and then gradually lessen the width of the browser until it's around 700 or less. The nice handy menu bar at the top will disappear to be replaced by one of those little icons consisting of three horizontal lines in the upper left. You're now using the website in mobile-mode on a normal computer.
The first time I encountered a website like this I just figured they hadn't gone to the trouble to properly detect whether they're on a mobile platform or not, but then I began encountering more and more websites doing this. I assume the behavior just comes along for free with whatever JS library they're using. I definitely wouldn't want my website to behave this way (mobile support is coming), and would prefer not to have to work around idiosyncrasies in the JS library. That's why I'm a bit skittish about using JS libraries.
About that Dartmouth/Hitchcock website, the width at which it used to go into mobile mode used to be 800. I reported the issue to them last year and exchanged a few emails with their web development manager. I haven't been back to the site until today, finding that they changed the mobile-mode width to 700. At the resolution I use I can still fit their full menu bar down to a width of 600.
One facet of the website experience I focus on when developing my own webpages is making sure that a webpage is useful across a wide range of aspect ratios and visible areas, but more and more websites seem to be assuming that your browser page will be at least 900 pixels wide, and they're making their minimum page size 900 pixels, forcing those of us using lesser browser widths to have to use left/right scroll to see the page, though what I often do is hit Ctrl-Minus to zoom out a bit. I use an 800 pixel width for browsers because it enables me to have two browser windows side by side. Anyway, I suspect this flood of 900-pixel width webpages is in some way connected to their JS libraries.
--Percy

This message is a reply to:
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Son Goku
Inactive Member


(1)
Message 36 of 97 (754151)
03-24-2015 4:30 PM
Reply to: Message 31 by xongsmith
03-23-2015 8:18 PM


Re: .NET
C++11 is a better language than C++98 (C++03 is mainly a bug fix for '98), but I know what you mean.
Related to what Percy said, the STL is really the core of C++. For a lot of projects and from working with other teams you would be surprised how much work is actually done just by using the STL, and not any object-oriented or C-language features. A lot of professional code I've seen (game graphics and game physics) in C++ barely uses the object oriented features.
C++ really becomes a monster though when you combine features from the different paradigms it supports (i.e. functional or generic stuff with object-oriented stuff)
I really like C, because it's clean and you really can know the whole language.
Edited by Son Goku, : No reason given.

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New Cat's Eye
Inactive Member


Message 37 of 97 (754152)
03-24-2015 4:53 PM
Reply to: Message 34 by coffee_addict
03-24-2015 10:22 AM


Re: .NET
what do you think of C#?
How do you say "C#" out loud in English? Like, phonetically?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 34 by coffee_addict, posted 03-24-2015 10:22 AM coffee_addict has replied

Replies to this message:
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kjsimons
Member
Posts: 821
From: Orlando,FL
Joined: 06-17-2003
Member Rating: 6.7


Message 38 of 97 (754155)
03-24-2015 5:00 PM
Reply to: Message 37 by New Cat's Eye
03-24-2015 4:53 PM


Re: .NET
"C Sharp" as in the musical notation.

This message is a reply to:
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New Cat's Eye
Inactive Member


Message 39 of 97 (754156)
03-24-2015 5:07 PM
Reply to: Message 38 by kjsimons
03-24-2015 5:00 PM


Re: .NET
Awesome! Thanks, that sounds great.
I was thinking: there's no way they're calling that "C Hashtag"...

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coffee_addict
Member (Idle past 477 days)
Posts: 3645
From: Indianapolis, IN
Joined: 03-29-2004


Message 40 of 97 (754161)
03-24-2015 6:33 PM
Reply to: Message 37 by New Cat's Eye
03-24-2015 4:53 PM


Re: .NET
It's pronounced "see pound".

This message is a reply to:
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Replies to this message:
 Message 41 by Jon, posted 03-24-2015 7:31 PM coffee_addict has replied
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Jon
Inactive Member


Message 41 of 97 (754166)
03-24-2015 7:31 PM
Reply to: Message 40 by coffee_addict
03-24-2015 6:33 PM


Re: .NET
By whom?

Love your enemies!

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Replies to this message:
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Theodoric
Member
Posts: 9076
From: Northwest, WI, USA
Joined: 08-15-2005
Member Rating: 3.7


Message 42 of 97 (754168)
03-24-2015 7:40 PM
Reply to: Message 40 by coffee_addict
03-24-2015 6:33 PM


Re: .NET
C sharp
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/.../C_Sharp_(programming_language)
Edited by Admin, : Fix link.

Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts
"God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness.

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coffee_addict
Member (Idle past 477 days)
Posts: 3645
From: Indianapolis, IN
Joined: 03-29-2004


Message 43 of 97 (754176)
03-24-2015 8:34 PM
Reply to: Message 41 by Jon
03-24-2015 7:31 PM


Re: .NET
C in English is pronounced "see".
On your telephone, the key with "#" symbol is called the pound sign.
added by edit
Have I stumbled upon a forum with inhabitants completely lacking of a sense of humor?
Edited by coffee_addict, : No reason given.

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nwr
Member
Posts: 6408
From: Geneva, Illinois
Joined: 08-08-2005
Member Rating: 5.1


Message 44 of 97 (754180)
03-24-2015 9:01 PM
Reply to: Message 43 by coffee_addict
03-24-2015 8:34 PM


Re: .NET
On your telephone, the key with "#" symbol is called the pound sign.
However, the computer language is still "C sharp".

Fundamentalism - the anti-American, anti-Christian branch of American Christianity

This message is a reply to:
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coffee_addict
Member (Idle past 477 days)
Posts: 3645
From: Indianapolis, IN
Joined: 03-29-2004


Message 45 of 97 (754182)
03-24-2015 9:23 PM
Reply to: Message 44 by nwr
03-24-2015 9:01 PM


Re: .NET
Who needs a computer when I can program with my telephone just fine?

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