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Author | Topic: The Awesome Republican Primary Thread | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Dr Adequate Member (Idle past 284 days) Posts: 16113 Joined:
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Well, actually, officially, legally it is. Then why is persuasion legal but bribery illegal? Edited by Dr Adequate, : No reason given.
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Dr Adequate Member (Idle past 284 days) Posts: 16113 Joined:
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Faith's a Birther?
Of course Faith's a Birther.
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Dr Adequate Member (Idle past 284 days) Posts: 16113 Joined:
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There's lots of evidence from Kenya that he was born there but the fact that his own literary agent described him in 1991 as born in Kenya and raised in Indonesia and Hawaii is very good evidence too: Well, I guess there's no stronger bond than that between a man and his literary agent. So naturally the agent would have been present at little Obama's birth ... somewhere in Kenya. Like all literary agents, he spends a lot of time hanging round African maternity wards looking for potential talent.
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Dr Adequate Member (Idle past 284 days) Posts: 16113 Joined: |
If there isn't a problem if he was born in Kenya there would be no need for all the extreme efforts to prove he wasn't. Oh yes, the extreme efforts. Wrestling with flaming tigers, diving into a pit of molten lava, climbing Mount Everest in his underwear while a dwarf sat on his shoulders and beat him around the head with a flat-iron ... oh, and I believe he also had one of his aides show a piece of paper to a journalist.
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Dr Adequate Member (Idle past 284 days) Posts: 16113 Joined:
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I think citizens have a legitimate interest in knowing whether their politicians are qualified for their offices or not. If there's real evidence here, it's worth discussing and not simply brushing it off. Yeah. Also if there's any real evidence, someone should mention it to the Republican party, it sounds like the sort of thing they'd be keen to know. Of course, they themselves are too high-minded to dig into the backgrounds of their ideological opponents looking for dirt --- they're much like Fox News in that respect. But if the evidence was actually presented to them, then purely in the interests of justice they might finally get around to making use of it.
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Dr Adequate Member (Idle past 284 days) Posts: 16113 Joined:
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Don't be silly. Where would his agent get such information except from Obama himself or biographical material Obama or the university supplied? Since Obama says he was born in Hawaii, he was evidently not the source of this "information". I know how much you love bad arguments, but if you propose to base your claim on the implicit notion that Obama is a Birther, this may be going too far even for you. The person responsible for the mistake, who was, incidentally, not Obama's literary agent, says that she didn't get the information from Obama:
Miriam Goderich edited the text of the bio; she is now a partner at the Dystel & Goderich agency, which lists Obama as one of its current clients.
"You're undoubtedly aware of the brouhaha stirred up by Breitbart about the erroneous statement in a client list Acton & Dystel published in 1991 (for circulation within the publishing industry only) that Barack Obama was born in Kenya. This was nothing more than a fact checking error by me an agency assistant at the time," Goderich wrote. "There was never any information given to us by Obama in any of his correspondence or other communications suggesting in any way that he was born in Kenya and not Hawaii. I hope you can communicate to your readers that this was a simple mistake and nothing more."
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Dr Adequate Member (Idle past 284 days) Posts: 16113 Joined:
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Not at all convincing except to someone who desperately wants to be convinced. The pot is calling the refrigerator black.
A "mistake" in a blurb advertising a book by Obama that neither he nor anyone else caught until 2007? Well, I doubt he even saw it. If he had, he'd have pointed out the mistake, but why would he?
How does anyone even MAKE such a mistake in the first place? You are asking how people make mistakes? It happens all the time. For example, you attributed this claim about Kenya to "Obama's literary agent", despite the fact that Miriam Goderich wasn't Obama's literary agent. How did you come to make this mistake?
That was official information they could only get from Obama ... Again, Obama is not a Birther.
That was official information they could only get from Obama or those official documents. Which official documents? Did Miriam Goderich fly to Kenya and find his Secret Real Birth Certificate? If so, why is she keeping quiet about it?
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Dr Adequate Member (Idle past 284 days) Posts: 16113 Joined:
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According to one of the videos I posted he has said both at different times. There are also videos on the Internet saying that Bush was behind 9/11.
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Dr Adequate Member (Idle past 284 days) Posts: 16113 Joined:
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HARVARD OFFICIAL DOCUMENTS. THIS WAS A HARVARD PUBLICATION Uh ... no. The agency Acton & Dystel (now Dystel & Goderich) is a completely ordinary literary agency, and, like all the other literary agencies, is entirely unaffiliated with Harvard University and is indeed located over 200 miles away from it in another state. There is no conceivable sense in which this was a "Harvard publication". Now, perhaps you could think again about how it is possible for people to make mistakes. How did you come to be so convinced of this obvious and palpable falsehood that you proclaimed it loudly in public and in capital letters? Was it because you have seen "official documents" proving that Acton & Dystel is Harvard University? Or did you, y'know, make a mistake? Edited by Dr Adequate, : No reason given.
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Dr Adequate Member (Idle past 284 days) Posts: 16113 Joined:
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He's identified as the editor of the Harvard Law Review on the same page that the bio is given about birth in Kenya and raised in Indonesia and Hawaii. My mistake is trivial, but that statement is just way too precise to be a mistake. Your statement was precise. You didn't write "IT WAS A HARVARD PUBLICATION, OR MAYBE YALE OR PRINCETON". But it was not too precise to be a mistake.
Lie all you want. Is that your way of saying: "Thank you, Dr A, for pointing out that what I just proclaimed to be true, in public and in capital letters, was in fact totally false"?
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Dr Adequate Member (Idle past 284 days) Posts: 16113 Joined:
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So, we're beginning to get the picture of what must have happened. The year is 1991, and Miriam Goderich is a youthful assistant at Acton & Dystel. Junior though she is, she has been charged with the crucial task of writing a promotional booklet. Mr. Dystel himself has impressed on her the importance of absolute factual accuracy. "Some day, young lady", he said to her "the very destiny of the nation may rest on you getting every last detail right".
And so one fateful hour she comes to write the author bio for Barack Obama, and realizes she doesn't know where he was born. Now, at this point she might have asked him, he would have said "Hawaii", and his secret would have been safe. But fortunately for us, she had received a heavy blow to the head earlier that day, and being therefore somewhat confused and irrational, she decided instead to drive 200 miles to Cambridge, Massachusetts, to look it up in the Official Harvard Archives. At first the archivist is obstructive, pointing out that the student files are confidential. But "I'm a literary agent", Goderich explains, flashing her badge, "now show me the file or I'll have you run in for obstructing literature." Luckily for her, Harvard University keeps records of the exact birthplaces of all their students --- I have no idea why, but for the purposes of this narrative it's necessary that they do so. Let's not get bogged down with things like facts and plausibility. And so it was that Goderich's eyes lit on the word KENYA. The truth was out! But then we must ask ourselves how KENYA got into the file in the first place. Obama, let me explain once more for Faith's benefit, is not a Birther. He would have written HAWAII. And indeed he did. Let us shift our scene back two years. It is the office of Professor Furtwangler, Harvard's Dean of Student Birthplaces. A hot August day. A fly buzzes somnolently at the window-pane, and Furtwangler leafs idly through a stack of Official Student Birthplace Forms. When --- suddenly --- the finely-honed instincts that gained him the high office of Dean of Student Birthplaces stir him into action. "Obama!" he cries. "Hawaii! This cannot be. First of all, the feller's black, and all black people come from Africa. And secondly, Hawaii's not a real place." He lifts the phone for his secretary. "Miss Ponsonby? I'll need a return ticket to Africa, a set of bush gear, and my largest mosquito net. There's something I have to know ..." Edited by Dr Adequate, : No reason given.
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Dr Adequate Member (Idle past 284 days) Posts: 16113 Joined:
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Uh huh. And there's no problem explaining any of it. We have a "mistake" made in publishing an awfully precise sounding bio, none of which is true Yes, people make factual errors. You yourself have made two gross errors of fact while discussing this one.
we have a "mistranslation" of a word used by Obama's grandmother who is misunderstood to be saying he was born in that village when she was really only being poetic and metaphorically calling him a "son of" the village Reference?
and we also have a "slip of the tongue" by Obama himself who said he was born in Kenya but of course didn't really mean to say that. I haven't looked that one up but remember something of the sort occurring. Oh, great. Now we have to take your word for it. Faith, would even you take your word for it? From the woman who told us that the pamphlet was written by Obama's literary agent, from the woman who told us that the pamphlet was published by Harvard University, we now have "I haven't looked that one up but remember something of the sort occurring". Well, that settles it. What you "seem to remember" is obviously the gold standard for truth.
And we have a birth certificate with some very strange typographical anomalies. Also haven't looked this one up but I think I spent some time on it a few years ago. You think you spent some time on it? So now, from the woman who told us that the pamphlet was written by Obama's literary agent, from the woman who told us that the pamphlet was published by Harvard University, now she's making claims about a subject when by her own confession she hasn't looked it up and she's not even certain whether she researched it at all. Faith, I ask again, would you take your word for it? Given that when talking about this subject you have committed gross factual errors, given that you admit that you haven't even been bothered to look it up, and given that you aren't sure if you ever researched it, but if you did it was "some years ago" ... would that be convincing to you? If someone else said that, would you consider that as hard evidence? Edited by Dr Adequate, : No reason given.
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Dr Adequate Member (Idle past 284 days) Posts: 16113 Joined:
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Obama saying he's from Kenya. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cQcd41RO25k Oh, oh you poor sucker. I don't just feel sorry for you for falling for this this one particular time ... but also because I guess I'm going to bring it up in every thread in which you participate from now on. And you didn't think ... it didn't occur to you ... no, I guess it didn't. As this thread is going into summation mode I have started a new thread devoted to Birthism, because why stop now, just when Faith's calling me gullible? Edited by Dr Adequate, : No reason given.
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