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Author Topic:   What is Christianity?
NoNukes
Inactive Member


(2)
Message 121 of 451 (760488)
06-22-2015 1:24 PM
Reply to: Message 119 by Faith
06-22-2015 1:11 PM


Re: And yet another definition of what a makes a Christian
So the more inclusive you are the more true your version of Christianity, but that's not claiming your view is the truth? What kind of gobbledygook is that?
It is the kind of "gobbledygook" that is inevitable when you are both honest, and when you stop worshiping other men who have purported to interpret the Bible for you. I do my best to ascertain truth. Sometimes I fail. But because of God's grace, my salvation does not require perfection.
You, however don't suffer from such issues. Just as surely as you know that King James lived a blameless life, that the Pope is the anti-Christ, and that Puritans never tormented Quakers, you are perfect in your own knowledge and free to cast stones.
Edited by NoNukes, : No reason given.

Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)
History will have to record that the greatest tragedy of this period of social transition was not the strident clamor of the bad people, but the appalling silence of the good people. Martin Luther King
If there are no stupid questions, then what kind of questions do stupid people ask? Do they get smart just in time to ask questions? Scott Adams

This message is a reply to:
 Message 119 by Faith, posted 06-22-2015 1:11 PM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 122 by Faith, posted 06-22-2015 1:27 PM NoNukes has replied

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1444 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 122 of 451 (760489)
06-22-2015 1:27 PM
Reply to: Message 121 by NoNukes
06-22-2015 1:24 PM


Re: And yet another definition of what a makes a Christian
You've been viciously slandering me for quite a while now. You consider yourself a Christian?
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 121 by NoNukes, posted 06-22-2015 1:24 PM NoNukes has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 124 by NoNukes, posted 06-22-2015 1:34 PM Faith has replied

  
jar
Member (Idle past 393 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 123 of 451 (760490)
06-22-2015 1:31 PM
Reply to: Message 119 by Faith
06-22-2015 1:11 PM


Re: And yet another definition of what a makes a Christian
Faith writes:
So the more inclusive you are the more true your version of Christianity, but that's not claiming your view is the truth? What kind of gobbledygook is that?
But no one but you has claimed to be the "true" Christians. Jesus most certainly was not a true Christian or even a Christian at all and so far I have not seen any evidence there is a "true Christian".

Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 119 by Faith, posted 06-22-2015 1:11 PM Faith has not replied

  
NoNukes
Inactive Member


Message 124 of 451 (760491)
06-22-2015 1:34 PM
Reply to: Message 122 by Faith
06-22-2015 1:27 PM


Re: And yet another definition of what a makes a Christian
Christians aren't supposed to lie, NN, but you've been doing a lot of it lately. Just one more reason to ignore your opinions.
I've called things as I see them. I'm not trying to please you.
I can see in your zeal, your desire to follow Christ. It is not for me to judge the minutiae in your walk or that of a Jehovah witness or a Catholic.
I see now that you needed to remove your accusation regarding lying to accuse me of slander. Perhaps you can point to something in my message that I cannot back up by referring to one of your own posts.
Edited by NoNukes, : No reason given.

Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)
History will have to record that the greatest tragedy of this period of social transition was not the strident clamor of the bad people, but the appalling silence of the good people. Martin Luther King
If there are no stupid questions, then what kind of questions do stupid people ask? Do they get smart just in time to ask questions? Scott Adams

This message is a reply to:
 Message 122 by Faith, posted 06-22-2015 1:27 PM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 125 by Faith, posted 06-22-2015 1:40 PM NoNukes has replied

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1444 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 125 of 451 (760492)
06-22-2015 1:40 PM
Reply to: Message 124 by NoNukes
06-22-2015 1:34 PM


Re: And yet another definition of what a makes a Christian
You are judging me with your vicious slanders. Unbelievable evil stuff you've said over the last few weeks.
Slanders ARE lies, I wanted to be more to the point. But you make a lie out of that too,.
It IS the Christian's job to judge false doctrine, not personal sin but false doctrine. JW's follow false doctrine but you wouldn't judge them though they are going to hell because of it? Typical false Christianity. I've never attacked Catholics as individuals because some of them may be saved but I know the institution of the Roman Church is a Hell-bound set of pagan lies and if you don't know that you are badly misguided. I don't know if you are saved, but if you are it is by the skin of your teeth because you are pursuing a lot of evil lies.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 124 by NoNukes, posted 06-22-2015 1:34 PM NoNukes has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 128 by NoNukes, posted 06-22-2015 2:55 PM Faith has replied

  
Phat
Member
Posts: 18262
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003
Member Rating: 1.1


Message 126 of 451 (760497)
06-22-2015 2:38 PM
Reply to: Message 111 by NoNukes
06-22-2015 12:15 PM


My View on Who wrote the Bible
In fact most of the people who claim to be literalists insist that you cannot be a Christian unless you read the entire Bible as literally true. Faith claims that Jesus 'authored' the entire Bible.
I said that the entire Bible was likely authored by the holy Spirit. Jesus was not alive on earth at the time the other books were written. Whether the Bible was authored by Christ or The Holy Spirit is a matter of semantics. Same GOD.
Human authors wrote it. It did not simply drop from the clouds. The question is the source of their inspiration. Be it Jesus Christ? Be it The Holy Spirit?

God created war so that Americans would learn geography. —Mark Twain
"A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." —Mark Twain

This message is a reply to:
 Message 111 by NoNukes, posted 06-22-2015 12:15 PM NoNukes has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 127 by NoNukes, posted 06-22-2015 2:53 PM Phat has seen this message but not replied

  
NoNukes
Inactive Member


(1)
Message 127 of 451 (760499)
06-22-2015 2:53 PM
Reply to: Message 126 by Phat
06-22-2015 2:38 PM


Re: My View on Who wrote the Bible
I said that the entire Bible was likely authored by the holy Spirit. Jesus was not alive on earth at the time the other books were written. Whether the Bible was authored by Christ or The Holy Spirit is a matter of semantics. Same GOD.
You did say that. I am responding to your claim that your views represent literalists. That does not seem to be correct, but perhaps you are defining 'literalist' to mean whatever Phat thinks the Bible literally says.

Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)
History will have to record that the greatest tragedy of this period of social transition was not the strident clamor of the bad people, but the appalling silence of the good people. Martin Luther King
If there are no stupid questions, then what kind of questions do stupid people ask? Do they get smart just in time to ask questions? Scott Adams

This message is a reply to:
 Message 126 by Phat, posted 06-22-2015 2:38 PM Phat has seen this message but not replied

  
NoNukes
Inactive Member


Message 128 of 451 (760500)
06-22-2015 2:55 PM
Reply to: Message 125 by Faith
06-22-2015 1:40 PM


Re: And yet another definition of what a makes a Christian
You are judging me with your vicious slanders. Unbelievable evil stuff you've said over the last few weeks.
You appear to be judging yourself based on my citing of your past actions. There is nothing I can do about that.
ABE:
JW's follow false doctrine but you wouldn't judge them though they are going to hell because of it? Typical false Christianity.
Nice stone casting!
Edited by NoNukes, : No reason given.

Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)
History will have to record that the greatest tragedy of this period of social transition was not the strident clamor of the bad people, but the appalling silence of the good people. Martin Luther King
If there are no stupid questions, then what kind of questions do stupid people ask? Do they get smart just in time to ask questions? Scott Adams

This message is a reply to:
 Message 125 by Faith, posted 06-22-2015 1:40 PM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 131 by Faith, posted 06-22-2015 5:13 PM NoNukes has replied

  
Rocky.C
Member (Idle past 3008 days)
Posts: 32
Joined: 06-17-2015


(1)
Message 129 of 451 (760506)
06-22-2015 4:26 PM
Reply to: Message 96 by jar
06-21-2015 11:12 AM


Re: still trying to define what Christianity is.
It is commonly assumed that God the Father was God of the OT; but this is false. Jesus Christ is both God of the OT and the NT.
Here's proof:
In Exodus 33:18-23 we find where Moses pleaded with God to allow him to see Him in all His glory, but God replied that no one could see His face and live. Yet, the Lord placed Moses in the clift of a rock and covered Moses eyes until He had passed by. He then removed
His hand and allowed Moses to see His back parts.
In Exodus 24: 9-11 it is stated that 70 elders of Israel were allowed to see God, and to eat and drink with Him.
There were numerous men in the Old Testament who saw and spoke with God to His face.
None of these men ever saw or spoke with the Father. They saw and spoke with the personage who later became Jesus Christ.
Consider these verses:
John 1:18 " No man hath seen God at any time; the only begotten Son, which is in the bosom of the Father, he hath declared him."
John 5:37 " And the Father himself, which hath sent me, hath borne witness of me. Ye have neither heard his voice at any time, nor seen his shape."
John 6:46 " Not that any man hath seen the Father, save he which is of God, he hath seen the Father."
John 17:26 " And I have declared unto them thy name, and will declare it:
The member of the God family whom the prophets spoke with and saw was not God, the Father, but Jesus Christ.
In Exodus 3:14 Moses asked God how to answer the children of Israel when they asked him the name of God who sent him. God's reply was: "I AM THAT I AM: and he said, Thus shalt thou say unto the children of Israel, I AM hath sent me unto you."
Now, notice the exchange between Jesus and the Pharisees in John 8:53-59
"Art thou greater than our father Abraham, which is dead? and the prophets are dead: whom makest thou thyself?
54 Jesus answered, If I honour myself, my honour is nothing: it is my Father that honoureth me; of whom ye say, that he is your God:
55 Yet ye have not known him; but I know him: and if I should say, I know him not, I shall be a liar like unto you: but I know him, and keep his saying.
56 Your father Abraham rejoiced to see my day: and he saw it, and was glad.
57 Then said the Jews unto him, Thou art not yet fifty years old, and hast thou seen Abraham?
58 Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Before Abraham was, I am.
59 Then took they up stones to cast at him: but Jesus hid himself, and went out of the temple, going through the midst of them, and so passed by."
Jesus told them that He was the great "I AM," and they tried to stone Him. They knew exactly what He meant.
Also notice what Jesus said when they came by night to arrest Him.
John 18:4-8
"Jesus therefore, knowing all things that should come upon him, went forth, and said unto them, Whom seek ye?
5 They answered him, Jesus of Nazareth. Jesus saith unto them, I am he. And Judas also, which betrayed him, stood with them.
6 As soon then as he had said unto them, I am he, they went backward, and fell to the ground.
7 Then asked he them again, Whom seek ye? And they said, Jesus of Nazareth.
8 Jesus answered, I have told you that I am he: if therefore ye seek me, let these go their way:"
The word he after "I Am" is in italics, meaning it was added by the translators. Also notice that the guards fell backward when Jesus said that He was the great "I AM."
John 8:23-24
23 And he said unto them, Ye are from beneath; I am from above: ye are of this world; I am not of this world.
24 I said therefore unto you, that ye shall die in your sins: for if ye believe not that I am he, ye shall die in your sins.
Again, he is added by the translators. Jesus refers to Himself as "I AM" in the following verses"
John 6:8 the "bread of Life"
John 8:12 the "light of the world"
John 10:9 the "door"
John10:11 the "good shepherd"
John 11:25 the "resurrection and the life"
John 14:6 the "way, truth, and the life"
John 15:1 the "vine"
In the Old Testament God referred to Himself in the same ways.
In John 13: 19 Jesus warned His disciples "19 Now I tell you before it come, that, when it is come to pass, ye may believe that I am he." the he is added. Jesus is our "Rock."He is referred to as the "Rock" in dozens of verses in both the OT and the NT.
In Exodus 13:21-22 & 14:19 we see that God followed the Israelite out of Egypt in "a pillar of a cloud"
"21 And the LORD went before them by day in a pillar of a cloud, to lead them the way; and by night in a pillar of fire, to give them light; to go by day and night:
22 He took not away the pillar of the cloud by day, nor the pillar of fire by night, from before the people.
19 And the angel of God, which went before the camp of Israel, removed and went behind them; and the pillar of the cloud went from before their face, and stood behind them:"
Now, notice the final and absolute proof that Jesus was the God Personage who led the Israelites out of Egypt and through the Red Sea!
1Corinthians 10: 1-4
1 Moreover, brethren, I would not that ye should be ignorant, how that all our fathers were under the cloud, and all passed through the sea;
2 And were all baptized unto Moses in the cloud and in the sea;
3 And did all eat the same spiritual meat;
4 And did all drink the same spiritual drink: for they drank of that spiritual Rock that followed them: and that Rock was Christ.
The general consensus among Christianity is that the Father was God of the OT and that Jesus came to abolish the 10 Commandments, and establish a new way to worship, but that is far from the truth.
Jesus Himself wrote the 10 Commandments on stone, which denotes permanence.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 96 by jar, posted 06-21-2015 11:12 AM jar has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 130 by jar, posted 06-22-2015 5:10 PM Rocky.C has replied

  
jar
Member (Idle past 393 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 130 of 451 (760508)
06-22-2015 5:10 PM
Reply to: Message 129 by Rocky.C
06-22-2015 4:26 PM


Re: still trying to define what Christianity is.
Nothing there tells us anything about what Christianity is or what God is or what Christian are supposed to do and it proves nothing except that conmen can quotemine. But we knew that.

Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 129 by Rocky.C, posted 06-22-2015 4:26 PM Rocky.C has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 132 by Rocky.C, posted 06-22-2015 6:26 PM jar has replied

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1444 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 131 of 451 (760509)
06-22-2015 5:13 PM
Reply to: Message 128 by NoNukes
06-22-2015 2:55 PM


Re: And yet another definition of what a makes a Christian
Citing my past actions? You mean slandering me with your lies?
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 128 by NoNukes, posted 06-22-2015 2:55 PM NoNukes has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 133 by NoNukes, posted 06-22-2015 6:35 PM Faith has replied

  
Rocky.C
Member (Idle past 3008 days)
Posts: 32
Joined: 06-17-2015


Message 132 of 451 (760514)
06-22-2015 6:26 PM
Reply to: Message 130 by jar
06-22-2015 5:10 PM


Re: still trying to define what Christianity is.
You need to learn patience man. It is impossible to tell someone what it means to be a Christian in such a short time. You need to absorb what has already been written.
I am by no means done. But, after learning that God wants a family; after learning that He wants to share all He owns with us; after learning that His way is the way of give; and, you still have no inkling about what He expects from us then I must wonder what in life has messed you up so badly!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 130 by jar, posted 06-22-2015 5:10 PM jar has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 134 by jar, posted 06-22-2015 6:37 PM Rocky.C has replied
 Message 136 by jar, posted 06-22-2015 6:45 PM Rocky.C has replied

  
NoNukes
Inactive Member


Message 133 of 451 (760515)
06-22-2015 6:35 PM
Reply to: Message 131 by Faith
06-22-2015 5:13 PM


Re: And yet another definition of what a makes a Christian
Faith writes:
Citing my past actions?
Here is what I have claimed.
NoNukes writes:
You [Faith], however don't suffer from such issues. Just as surely as you know that King James lived a blameless life, that the Pope is the anti-Christ, and that Puritans never tormented Quakers, you are perfect in your own knowledge and free to cast stones.
Please identify the lie among the above statements. I would be happy to provide documentation for any of them.
And to drag this bash fast back onto the topic, which is the definition of Christianity. I cannot pretend to define Christianity for you or jar or Phat. I've presented my own view. I don't expect you to agree, but given that this is a debate, I do think it appropriate to point out where offered definitions do not make sense.
Edited by NoNukes, : No reason given.

Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)
History will have to record that the greatest tragedy of this period of social transition was not the strident clamor of the bad people, but the appalling silence of the good people. Martin Luther King
If there are no stupid questions, then what kind of questions do stupid people ask? Do they get smart just in time to ask questions? Scott Adams

This message is a reply to:
 Message 131 by Faith, posted 06-22-2015 5:13 PM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 145 by Faith, posted 06-23-2015 5:40 AM NoNukes has seen this message but not replied

  
jar
Member (Idle past 393 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 134 of 451 (760516)
06-22-2015 6:37 PM
Reply to: Message 132 by Rocky.C
06-22-2015 6:26 PM


Re: still trying to define what Christianity is.
Rocky writes:
You need to learn patience man. It is impossible to tell someone what it means to be a Christian in such a short time. You need to absorb what has already been written.
I am by no means done. But, after learning that God wants a family; after learning that He wants to share all He owns with us; after learning that His way is the way of give; and, you still have no inkling about what He expects from us then I must wonder what in life has messed you up so badly!
Remember, I am a Christian, a member of one of the recognized chapters of Club Christian, raised in a Christian household and educated at a Christian school.
But what you posted was just nonsense, quotemining that simply did not support even one of your assertions, your editorial comments in the post.
So the fact remains that both of us are Christians yet both of us think the others position is just word salad.
After all, Exodus is hardly something that can tell us anything more than any other total fiction and something that presents a God character that is certainly unworthy of respect much less worship.

Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 132 by Rocky.C, posted 06-22-2015 6:26 PM Rocky.C has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 135 by Rocky.C, posted 06-22-2015 6:45 PM jar has not replied

  
Rocky.C
Member (Idle past 3008 days)
Posts: 32
Joined: 06-17-2015


(1)
Message 135 of 451 (760517)
06-22-2015 6:45 PM
Reply to: Message 134 by jar
06-22-2015 6:37 PM


Re: still trying to define what Christianity is.
Okay, let's do it your way!
Take my last two posts and show that they are not correct.
Prove to me that Jesus was not the God of the OT, or that God does not want a family.
Let's see what you do know about the Bible. Being that you claim to be a Christian, you should have extensive knowledge.
I don't think that you can discredit my posts at all. No, not you!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 134 by jar, posted 06-22-2015 6:37 PM jar has not replied

  
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