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Author
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Topic: Should countries outlaw the hijab, niqab and burka?
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Modulous
Member Posts: 7801 From: Manchester, UK Joined: 05-01-2005
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Re: Not in MY Courtroom!
Quite possibly not but her culture and peers are likely doing so. You are also constrained in what clothes you wear because of your culture and peers. It is why you rarely wear silk kimonos, bustle dresses or powdered wigs. Do you feel oppressed? Would you like it if Muslim women were forcing you to wear a skirt? For the sake of freedom. {note: presumptions of time period and gender were made during this post}
Every story will be different but our duty is to extend the freedoms we have earned to all within our borders and we will get the best bang for the buck by outlawing the signs of slavery that the garb in question represents. One does not maximise freedom by adding restraints. What should we also outlaw? The mantilla? The apostolnik? The mitre? The yamulkah?
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Dogmafood
Member (Idle past 370 days) Posts: 1815 From: Ontario Canada Joined: 08-04-2010
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Message 242 of 372 (773863)
12-10-2015 7:54 AM
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Reply to: Message 241 by Modulous
12-10-2015 4:18 AM
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Re: Not in MY Courtroom!
What should we also outlaw? The mantilla? The apostolnik? The mitre? The yamulkah? Pirate hats as they signify a wanton disregard for maritime law.
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 241 by Modulous, posted 12-10-2015 4:18 AM | | Modulous has seen this message but not replied |
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Bliyaal
Member (Idle past 2389 days) Posts: 171 From: Quebec City, Qc, Canada Joined: 02-17-2012
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Re: Not in MY Courtroom!
I do not want to remove a woman's right to choose. Yes that's exactly what you want.
I do want to remove the oppression of their Muslim husbands and fathers who force them to wear what they choose. You've been told many times that we already have laws for that.
I want to free slaves while you do nothing. You want to be the slaver!
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Greatest I am
Member (Idle past 295 days) Posts: 1676 Joined: 01-24-2007
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Message 244 of 372 (773870)
12-10-2015 9:34 AM
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Reply to: Message 239 by DrJones*
12-09-2015 10:25 PM
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DrJones Exactly. Equal to all of us. Some do not mind paying a bit for equality and an end to slavery. Regards DL
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 239 by DrJones*, posted 12-09-2015 10:25 PM | | DrJones* has not replied |
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Greatest I am
Member (Idle past 295 days) Posts: 1676 Joined: 01-24-2007
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Message 245 of 372 (773871)
12-10-2015 9:37 AM
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Reply to: Message 240 by AZPaul3
12-10-2015 2:34 AM
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AZPaul3 Arrest! How cruel you are. Why would we arrest someone already being oppressed by her husband? I prefer the fine system used in other countries that have outlawed signs of slavery. Regards DL
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 240 by AZPaul3, posted 12-10-2015 2:34 AM | | AZPaul3 has replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 249 by AZPaul3, posted 12-10-2015 10:58 AM | | Greatest I am has replied |
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Greatest I am
Member (Idle past 295 days) Posts: 1676 Joined: 01-24-2007
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Message 246 of 372 (773872)
12-10-2015 9:40 AM
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Reply to: Message 241 by Modulous
12-10-2015 4:18 AM
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Re: Not in MY Courtroom!
Modulous If I hade to wear a skirt to insure the freedom of all in my country, I wold be pleased to show my bony knees. Regards DL
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 241 by Modulous, posted 12-10-2015 4:18 AM | | Modulous has replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 251 by Modulous, posted 12-10-2015 1:05 PM | | Greatest I am has replied |
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Greatest I am
Member (Idle past 295 days) Posts: 1676 Joined: 01-24-2007
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Message 247 of 372 (773874)
12-10-2015 9:52 AM
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Reply to: Message 243 by Bliyaal
12-10-2015 8:09 AM
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Re: Not in MY Courtroom!
Bliyaal "You've been told many times that we already have laws for that." We have laws against everything but yet much evil continues. As to your last. "You want to be the slaver". No argument. We all have what Jung and Freud called the Father complex which makes all of us want to be top dog. That Complex is strong in me. I think it is the strongest in the most moral and the most corrupt. Regards DL
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 243 by Bliyaal, posted 12-10-2015 8:09 AM | | Bliyaal has replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 248 by Bliyaal, posted 12-10-2015 10:19 AM | | Greatest I am has replied |
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Bliyaal
Member (Idle past 2389 days) Posts: 171 From: Quebec City, Qc, Canada Joined: 02-17-2012
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Re: Not in MY Courtroom!
We have laws against everything but yet much evil continues. What do you propose then? Dictatorship? And what if you make the hijab illegal? By your logic it will continues. Try to make some sense.
No argument. We all have what Jung and Freud called the Father complex which makes all of us want to be top dog. That Complex is strong in me. I think it is the strongest in the most moral and the most corrupt. And I guess you view yourself as the most moral since intolerance is moral in your mind.
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AZPaul3
Member Posts: 8529 From: Phoenix Joined: 11-06-2006 Member Rating: 5.1
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Arrest! How cruel you are. Me cruel? You cruel! You're the one who wants to punish the woman for wearing a scarf. My inquiry (you did see the question mark?) was to how cruel you wanted to be.
Why would we arrest someone already being oppressed by her husband? Who said she is being oppressed by her husband? Do you think the reason she wears a scarf is because it is forced against her will? Is your knowledge of Islam that cursory and naive? You need to find out why a devout believing Muslim woman would insist on wearing the hijab. I'm thinking the reason you have not done so this deep into the discussion is because ... well you know ... Muslim. And you're not just opposed, you're bigoted.
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ringo
Member (Idle past 433 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: 03-23-2005
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Re: Not in MY Courtroom!
Greatest I am writes: I do not want to remove a woman's right to choose.
You want to ban the hijab, don't you? That IS removing a woman's right to choose to wear a hijab.
Greatest I am writes: I want to free slaves while you do nothing.
Even if women were being forced to wear the hijab, taking away that one form of oppression would do NOTHING to improve the life of Muslim women.
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Modulous
Member Posts: 7801 From: Manchester, UK Joined: 05-01-2005
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Re: Not in MY Courtroom!
If I hade to wear a skirt to insure the freedom of all in my country, I wold be pleased to show my bony knees. How does not wearing a hijab ensure my freedom?
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Greatest I am
Member (Idle past 295 days) Posts: 1676 Joined: 01-24-2007
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Message 252 of 372 (773894)
12-10-2015 1:10 PM
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Reply to: Message 248 by Bliyaal
12-10-2015 10:19 AM
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Re: Not in MY Courtroom!
Bliyaal "And I guess you view yourself as the most moral since intolerance is moral in your mind." I believe in a political system that the world has yet to form. Socrates would call it a Timocratic system. It is basically a system run by duty and honor while at the same time being quite intolerant and in fact quite tyrannical in the case of those who break the law. So yes, intolerance is a quality in many cases as it means, in this one, that I will not tolerate an immoral religion and ideology like Islam and Sharia to come into my country if I can help it. Regards DL
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 248 by Bliyaal, posted 12-10-2015 10:19 AM | | Bliyaal has replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 261 by Bliyaal, posted 12-11-2015 8:20 AM | | Greatest I am has replied |
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Greatest I am
Member (Idle past 295 days) Posts: 1676 Joined: 01-24-2007
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Message 253 of 372 (773895)
12-10-2015 1:14 PM
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Reply to: Message 249 by AZPaul3
12-10-2015 10:58 AM
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AZPaul3 What is devout about wearing a particular head and face covering? Nowhere in the Muslim holy books is it said to be a sign of being devout in the wearing of such garb. Why would you advocate one-upmanship for Muslim women against other nwomen who do not see anything devout in such garb? Regards DL
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 249 by AZPaul3, posted 12-10-2015 10:58 AM | | AZPaul3 has replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 258 by AZPaul3, posted 12-10-2015 7:10 PM | | Greatest I am has replied |
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Greatest I am
Member (Idle past 295 days) Posts: 1676 Joined: 01-24-2007
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Message 254 of 372 (773896)
12-10-2015 1:16 PM
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Reply to: Message 250 by ringo
12-10-2015 11:00 AM
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Re: Not in MY Courtroom!
ringo An oppressed woman would likely not agree. One chain at a time. Regards DL
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 250 by ringo, posted 12-10-2015 11:00 AM | | ringo has replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 262 by ringo, posted 12-11-2015 10:38 AM | | Greatest I am has replied |
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Greatest I am
Member (Idle past 295 days) Posts: 1676 Joined: 01-24-2007
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Message 255 of 372 (773897)
12-10-2015 1:20 PM
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Reply to: Message 251 by Modulous
12-10-2015 1:05 PM
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Re: Not in MY Courtroom!
Modulous "How does not wearing a hijab ensure my freedom?" It does not but if we ignore all signs of oppression then who will be left to save our sorry asses when oppressors come for us who say we are free but will not do what is required to insure that all share the freedom we say we have? That is you first duty as a free person. Do it. "First they came for the Jews, but I did nothing because I'm not a Jew. Then they came for the socialists, but I did nothing because I'm not a socialist. Then they came for the Catholics, but I did nothing because I'm not a Catholic. Finally, they came for me, but by then there was no one left to help me." — Pastor Father Niemoller (1946) Regards DL
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 251 by Modulous, posted 12-10-2015 1:05 PM | | Modulous has replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 256 by Modulous, posted 12-10-2015 1:43 PM | | Greatest I am has replied |
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