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Author Topic:   What is Christianity?
Bob Bobber
Member (Idle past 2956 days)
Posts: 187
Joined: 12-30-2015


Message 301 of 451 (775337)
12-31-2015 11:29 AM
Reply to: Message 300 by Phat
12-31-2015 6:54 AM


Re: Its Not What You Do. Its Who He Is
Some have called God’s justification, cheap justification; if it is that easy, if a person can obtain righteousness without doing something, or even trying to do something in order to gain it, that would be too easy, and that would make it cheap.
That is difficult for people imbued with the pride of life to imagine; it is difficult to accept, because it does not seem fair to the human mind, especially to the religiously minded. It does not seem quite right that God could consider someone righteous, especially if that person is not expending the same amount of effort or attention that they are to become righteous by way of their practice.
The fact is Christ became the redeemer of the entire world, when he satisfied the justice of God for the sins of the entire world. The sin issue was resolved for everyone, but understand, that having a redeemer and accepting the redeemer that we have, and what that redeemer accomplished, are two different things.
God’s justification is absolutely free, but it was certainly not cheap, it came at tremendous cost. Apart from God’s grace, the justification Paul’s been telling us about would be totally impossible, but then, apart from the price the son of God paid to make it possible, God’s grace could not offer it.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 300 by Phat, posted 12-31-2015 6:54 AM Phat has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 302 by Tangle, posted 12-31-2015 12:02 PM Bob Bobber has replied
 Message 317 by Phat, posted 01-15-2016 12:15 AM Bob Bobber has not replied

  
Tangle
Member
Posts: 9504
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 4.7


Message 302 of 451 (775339)
12-31-2015 12:02 PM
Reply to: Message 301 by Bob Bobber
12-31-2015 11:29 AM


Re: Its Not What You Do. Its Who He Is
Bob B writes:
God’s justification is absolutely free, but it was certainly not cheap, it came at tremendous cost. Apart from God’s grace, the justification Paul’s been telling us about would be totally impossible, but then, apart from the price the son of God paid to make it possible, God’s grace could not offer it.
EvC Forum: Login
God’s justification is absolutely free, but it was certainly not cheap, it came at tremendous cost. Apart from God’s grace, the justification Paul’s been telling us about would be totally impossible, but then, apart from the price the son of God paid to make it possible, God’s grace could not offer it.
A Ransom For All, page 1
God’s justification is absolutely free, but it was certainly not cheap, it came at tremendous cost. Apart from God’s grace, the justification Paul’s been telling us about would be totally impossible, but then, apart from the price the son of God paid to make it possible, God’s grace could not offer it.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=2JDt-2_9JNY
Etc etc etc

Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif. Je suis Parisien.
Life, don't talk to me about life - Marvin the Paranoid Android
"Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.
Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved."
- Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 301 by Bob Bobber, posted 12-31-2015 11:29 AM Bob Bobber has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 303 by Bob Bobber, posted 12-31-2015 12:19 PM Tangle has replied

  
Bob Bobber
Member (Idle past 2956 days)
Posts: 187
Joined: 12-30-2015


Message 303 of 451 (775340)
12-31-2015 12:19 PM
Reply to: Message 302 by Tangle
12-31-2015 12:02 PM


Re: Its Not What You Do. Its Who He Is
But would you go and study Curt Crist? Curt knows Bob Bobber uses his reasonings. Those hearing this message of Paul, might believe this good news and become the instantaneous recipients of a new identity by being placed into Jesus Christ, the one who reconciled them to God?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 302 by Tangle, posted 12-31-2015 12:02 PM Tangle has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 304 by Tangle, posted 12-31-2015 12:31 PM Bob Bobber has replied

  
Tangle
Member
Posts: 9504
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 4.7


(1)
Message 304 of 451 (775341)
12-31-2015 12:31 PM
Reply to: Message 303 by Bob Bobber
12-31-2015 12:19 PM


Re: Its Not What You Do. Its Who He Is
Bob B writes:
But would you go and study Curt Crist? Curt knows Bob Bobber uses his reasonings. Those hearing this message of Paul, might believe this good news and become the instantaneous recipients of a new identity by being placed into Jesus Christ, the one who reconciled them to God?
Are you only here to proselytise and use other people's material? If so please stop. We're not interested in it. If you want to stay here, start using your own, original words. Don't copy and paste and don't think we won't notice.
I assume this is impossible for you because you have to do what your organisation tells you. If so, don't waste your time, go knock on someone else's door.
If you are able to talk freely, then welcome, we'd like to hear your own thoughts.

Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif. Je suis Parisien.
Life, don't talk to me about life - Marvin the Paranoid Android
"Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.
Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved."
- Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 303 by Bob Bobber, posted 12-31-2015 12:19 PM Bob Bobber has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 305 by Bob Bobber, posted 12-31-2015 12:55 PM Tangle has not replied

  
Bob Bobber
Member (Idle past 2956 days)
Posts: 187
Joined: 12-30-2015


Message 305 of 451 (775343)
12-31-2015 12:55 PM
Reply to: Message 304 by Tangle
12-31-2015 12:31 PM


Re: Its Not What You Do. Its Who He Is
So what is everyones point of view on this reconciliation, sin not an issue anymore?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 304 by Tangle, posted 12-31-2015 12:31 PM Tangle has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 306 by Phat, posted 12-31-2015 1:19 PM Bob Bobber has replied

  
Phat
Member
Posts: 18298
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003
Member Rating: 1.1


Message 306 of 451 (775345)
12-31-2015 1:19 PM
Reply to: Message 305 by Bob Bobber
12-31-2015 12:55 PM


Re: Its Not What You Do. Its Who He Is
So what is everyone's point of view on this reconciliation, sin not an issue anymore?
Sin is always an issue. Its just not leading to eternal condemnation as it originally would have done.

Chance as a real force is a myth. It has no basis in reality and no place in scientific inquiry. For science and philosophy to continue to advance in knowledge, chance must be demythologized once and for all. —RC Sproul
"A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." —Mark Twain

This message is a reply to:
 Message 305 by Bob Bobber, posted 12-31-2015 12:55 PM Bob Bobber has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 307 by Bob Bobber, posted 12-31-2015 2:02 PM Phat has not replied

  
Bob Bobber
Member (Idle past 2956 days)
Posts: 187
Joined: 12-30-2015


Message 307 of 451 (775347)
12-31-2015 2:02 PM
Reply to: Message 306 by Phat
12-31-2015 1:19 PM


Re: Its Not What You Do. Its Who He Is
True, their is no condemnation because of our sanctified identity in the last Adam; God is the sanctifier. But reconciliation is a different truth then justification, because sin is not an issue with the human race?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 306 by Phat, posted 12-31-2015 1:19 PM Phat has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 310 by AdminPhat, posted 01-02-2016 7:36 PM Bob Bobber has not replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 432 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 308 of 451 (775506)
01-02-2016 10:52 AM
Reply to: Message 299 by Bob Bobber
12-31-2015 2:55 AM


Re: Its Not What You Do. Its Who He Is
Bob Bobber writes:
God purchased the human race out of sins dominion, never to be returned to the market place of sin again.
Who was it that put us up for sale in the first place?
Bob Bobber writes:
To say your works have anything at all to do with God’s gift declaration of righteousness is to slap the giver in the face.
Well, Jesus said it:
quote:
Matthew 25:34-40 Then shall the King say unto them on his right hand, Come, ye blessed of my Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world: For I was an hungred, and ye gave me meat: I was thirsty, and ye gave me drink: I was a stranger, and ye took me in: Naked, and ye clothed me: I was sick, and ye visited me: I was in prison, and ye came unto me. Then shall the righteous answer him, saying, Lord, when saw we thee an hungred, and fed thee? or thirsty, and gave thee drink? When saw we thee a stranger, and took thee in? or naked, and clothed thee? Or when saw we thee sick, or in prison, and came unto thee? And the King shall answer and say unto them, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye have done it unto one of the least of these my brethren, ye have done it unto me.
The ones who inherit the kingdom are clearly those who do good works.
If Jesus' death was more important than His words, why did He say anything at all? Why didn't he just come to earth and die?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 299 by Bob Bobber, posted 12-31-2015 2:55 AM Bob Bobber has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 309 by Tangle, posted 01-02-2016 1:11 PM ringo has seen this message but not replied

  
Tangle
Member
Posts: 9504
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 4.7


Message 309 of 451 (775534)
01-02-2016 1:11 PM
Reply to: Message 308 by ringo
01-02-2016 10:52 AM


Re: Its Not What You Do. Its Who He Is
ringo writes:
Bob Bobber writes:
God purchased the human race out of sins dominion, never to be returned to the market place of sin again.
Who was it that put us up for sale in the first place?
Anything as flowery as that, is a copy and paste job from a million JW sermons and blogs
This search found dozens
God purchased the human race out of sins dominion, never to be returned to the market place of sin again. - Google Search

Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif. Je suis Parisien.
Life, don't talk to me about life - Marvin the Paranoid Android
"Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.
Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved."
- Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 308 by ringo, posted 01-02-2016 10:52 AM ringo has seen this message but not replied

  
AdminPhat
Inactive Member


Message 310 of 451 (775576)
01-02-2016 7:36 PM
Reply to: Message 307 by Bob Bobber
12-31-2015 2:02 PM


We dont want junkmail
I tried to give you a chance, Robert Stone. If you want another one, please take your request here.
Thank you, Tangle. You google better than I do.
Edited by AdminPhat, : No reason given.
Edited by AdminPhat, : No reason given.

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This message is a reply to:
 Message 307 by Bob Bobber, posted 12-31-2015 2:02 PM Bob Bobber has not replied

  
John 10:10
Member (Idle past 3016 days)
Posts: 766
From: Mt Juliet / TN / USA
Joined: 02-01-2006


Message 311 of 451 (776504)
01-14-2016 3:04 PM


Is Christianity the one and only true religion?
Several decades ago a guest on Larry King's late night talk show asked him an interesting question. Larry is a great host, asks great questions, then lets the guests talk without much interruption, saying whatever they want to say about the issues Larry asks the guests about. This night the guest turned the tables on Larry and asked him the right question about who God is. The guest knew that Larry had invited many Christians to come on his program, and was very familiar with Christian beliefs of the Bible. The guest also knew Larry, who was not Jewish, had converted to Judaism at some point in his past. Here is the question the guest asked Larry:
Is Christianity the one and only true religion?
Larry responded, If the resurrection (of Jesus) is true, all bets are off.
WOW! Not only was the right question asked, the right answer was given!
Every religion in the world other than Christianity that does not believe and practice that Christianity is the one and only true revelation of the ONE true GOD must discount many truths about Christianity, but these two specific truths about Christianity MUST be discounted and rejected in order for their religion about who they believe God is to gain a foothold in people's minds:
(1) They must discount the truth that Jesus Christ was God before His incarnation, and was made flesh during His time on earth.
(2) They must discount that the crucifixion and resurrection of Jesus Christ was true.
Once they have discounted these primary truths concerning Christianity, 95% of their time is then spent arguing about what the rest of Bible Scripture says and means, not realizing that you can't understand what the rest of the Bible says and means AFTER you have rejected these two primary truths about Christianity.
It's as simple and as difficult as that!
Edited by John 10:10, : No reason given.

Replies to this message:
 Message 312 by NoNukes, posted 01-14-2016 4:24 PM John 10:10 has replied
 Message 313 by jar, posted 01-14-2016 5:14 PM John 10:10 has not replied
 Message 314 by Tangle, posted 01-14-2016 6:27 PM John 10:10 has replied

  
NoNukes
Inactive Member


Message 312 of 451 (776505)
01-14-2016 4:24 PM
Reply to: Message 311 by John 10:10
01-14-2016 3:04 PM


Re: Is Christianity the one and only true religion?
They must discount the truth that Jesus Christ was God before His incarnation, and was made flesh during His time on earth
I take this to mean that only people who embrace Trinity Doctrine can be Christian. I find this particular part of your definition problematic primarily because the Bible is full of supporting and contradictory statements about the topic.

Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)
History will have to record that the greatest tragedy of this period of social transition was not the strident clamor of the bad people, but the appalling silence of the good people. Martin Luther King
If there are no stupid questions, then what kind of questions do stupid people ask? Do they get smart just in time to ask questions? Scott Adams

This message is a reply to:
 Message 311 by John 10:10, posted 01-14-2016 3:04 PM John 10:10 has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 315 by John 10:10, posted 01-15-2016 12:00 AM NoNukes has replied

  
jar
Member (Idle past 414 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 313 of 451 (776506)
01-14-2016 5:14 PM
Reply to: Message 311 by John 10:10
01-14-2016 3:04 PM


Re: Is Christianity the one and only true religion?
As if there even was something like "Christianity". Since there is no universal version of Christianity then the question itself was simply silly.
Edited by jar, : appalin spallin

Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 311 by John 10:10, posted 01-14-2016 3:04 PM John 10:10 has not replied

  
Tangle
Member
Posts: 9504
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 4.7


Message 314 of 451 (776508)
01-14-2016 6:27 PM
Reply to: Message 311 by John 10:10
01-14-2016 3:04 PM


Re: Is Christianity the one and only true religion?
John writes:
WOW! Not only was the right question asked, the right answer was given!
Yeh, wow.
If someone unequivocally dies and then unequivocally comes back to life in modern circumstances with good supporting evidence, we've got a few things to consider.
2,000 year old hearsay reports of an absurdity is an utter irrelevance.

Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif. Je suis Parisien.
Life, don't talk to me about life - Marvin the Paranoid Android
"Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.
Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved."
- Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 311 by John 10:10, posted 01-14-2016 3:04 PM John 10:10 has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 316 by John 10:10, posted 01-15-2016 12:05 AM Tangle has not replied

  
John 10:10
Member (Idle past 3016 days)
Posts: 766
From: Mt Juliet / TN / USA
Joined: 02-01-2006


Message 315 of 451 (776516)
01-15-2016 12:00 AM
Reply to: Message 312 by NoNukes
01-14-2016 4:24 PM


Re: Is Christianity the one and only true religion?
You write, "I take this to mean that only people who embrace Trinity Doctrine can be Christian."
Yes, this is the essence of the Gospel of Christ, that God was in Christ reconciling the sins of the world to Himself thru the incarnation, death on a cross for our sins, and the resurrection to now sit at the right hand of God the Father.
Reject this and you cannot be "born again" or a Christian.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 312 by NoNukes, posted 01-14-2016 4:24 PM NoNukes has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 318 by NoNukes, posted 01-15-2016 9:09 AM John 10:10 has not replied
 Message 320 by ringo, posted 01-15-2016 10:48 AM John 10:10 has not replied

  
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