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Author | Topic: Republican Healthcare Plan | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
NoNukes Inactive Member |
Of course these folks are going to eventually get it together and dismantle the Affordable Care Act, but...
CNN is reporting that Trump has asked Paul Ryan to pull the current bill to replace the ACA with something. Given the dozens of repeal votes during Obama's presidency, which we can now see were only made under the cover of knowing that those past repeals would never see the light of day, it is clear that there never was an actual Republican Plan. Maybe someday there will be a Republican plan, but that plan certainly won't meet Trump's promise of giving better coverage to more people for less money. ABC, Fox and NBC are confirming that Ryan has pulled the bill. And I thought neocons sucked... Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846) History will have to record that the greatest tragedy of this period of social transition was not the strident clamor of the bad people, but the appalling silence of the good people. Martin Luther King I never considered a difference of opinion in politics, in religion, in philosophy, as cause for withdrawing from a friend. Thomas Jefferson Seems to me if its clear that certain things that require ancient dates couldn't possibly be true, we are on our way to throwing out all those ancient dates on the basis of the actual evidence. -- Faith Some of us are worried about just how much damage he will do in his last couple of weeks as president, to make it easier for the NY Times and Washington post to try to destroy Trump's presidency. -- marc9000
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PaulK Member Posts: 17827 Joined: Member Rating: 2.3 |
It was pulled because they couldn't get the votes. And that was partly because some Republicans didn't think it went far enough.
I wonder if Trump will fulfil his threat to "come after" the Republicans who would not support the bill. And if it will amount to anything more than malicious tweeting.
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jar Member (Idle past 422 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined: |
Maybe he can send them a cease and desist order like he did on the kitty website.
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vimesey Member (Idle past 100 days) Posts: 1398 From: Birmingham, England Joined: |
If you can't make a deal with a politician, then there's certainly something wrong with you - you're not very good. Could there be any greater conceit, than for someone to believe that the universe has to be simple enough for them to be able to understand it ? |
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Percy Member Posts: 22500 From: New Hampshire Joined: Member Rating: 4.9 |
NoNukes writes: Of course these folks are going to eventually get it together and dismantle the Affordable Care Act, but... Agreed.
Maybe someday there will be a Republican plan, but that plan certainly won't meet Trump's promise of giving better coverage to more people for less money. I wonder if Trump supporters understood they were being lied to when Trump claimed they were replacing Obamacare with something better. Or maybe he meant it would be better for the rich. As a compromise Obamacare is very likely not the best that could be done, but if the goal is to provide widely available and affordable health insurance then Trumpcare is several steps in the wrong direction from Obamacare. When most Republicans talk about improving Obamacare they don't mean improving it in terms of healthcare but in terms of limited government. --Percy
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jar Member (Idle past 422 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined:
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What is really sad is if they would simply adopt a universal health care system like every other first world nation they would assure themselves long term success.
They are really stupid!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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NoNukes Inactive Member |
And that was partly because some Republicans didn't think it went far enough. That's clearly only the glass empty part of it. Those tea party folk wanted it to repeal some very popular parts of Obamacare that the rest of the Republican party were either opposed to dropping or felt that their constituents were opposed to dropping.
I wonder if Trump will fulfil his threat to "come after" the Republicans who would not support the bill Trump may not have the popularity to pull this off nationwide, but he can go after some Republicans that are in the reddest districts. Is going after tea party candidates in really red districts going to be a winning proposition? I think not. Edited by NoNukes, : No reason given. Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846) History will have to record that the greatest tragedy of this period of social transition was not the strident clamor of the bad people, but the appalling silence of the good people. Martin Luther King I never considered a difference of opinion in politics, in religion, in philosophy, as cause for withdrawing from a friend. Thomas Jefferson Seems to me if its clear that certain things that require ancient dates couldn't possibly be true, we are on our way to throwing out all those ancient dates on the basis of the actual evidence. -- Faith Some of us are worried about just how much damage he will do in his last couple of weeks as president, to make it easier for the NY Times and Washington post to try to destroy Trump's presidency. -- marc9000
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14174dm Member (Idle past 1136 days) Posts: 161 From: Cincinnati OH Joined:
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So after six plus years of campaigning to repeal ObamaCare the Republicans had nothing other than "Repeal ObamaCare" when they won the House, the Senate & the Presidency. No plan at all.
WTF. Basically the Republicans are now promising to screw up ObamaCare until it collapses and hope the voters won't notice their thumbs on the scales.
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LamarkNewAge Member Posts: 2423 Joined: Member Rating: 1.2 |
I have a copy of the March 29 Washington Post and Stephen Brill actually admitted he is "carrying water for the insurance companies " in his How to Keep Trump Honest on Obamacare article. I will paste 3 breathtaking paragraphs soon but can't right now. He said that insurers are on consumers side because they "pay medical bills " and want to save money on bills just like the consumers they cover. He then jumped right to the issue of Trump keeping "his promise to bring prescription drug prices down to where they are in every other developed country, which is at least 40 percent below what we pay, based on my research." The Brill sleight of hand is as breathtaking as it is sly. The insurance companies ALREADY negotiate prices down as Brill points out in his book but leaves out in the article. In this article, he slides from the issue of private insurance premiums and deductibles, as his piece is (bait and switch tactic aside ) about, to the issue of Medicare. Most readers won't notice or even be aware of the particulars especially the separate issues of Medicare bills compared to exploding private insurance premiums and deductibles. He then also fails to mention that all profits will then be eliminated and that ironically will solve the Prescription Drug price problem for good. No more R and D will happen and no new drugs will be developed which will mean that all drugs will be older drugs which in turn will have the patents expire (per the existing law ) in seven years. That "solution " would have worked wonders had we used it in 2000 when prescribed drugs costed 100 billion dollars a year. If not for allowing the 15 to 20 percent profits in the prescriptiondrug industry then the added costs from newly developed drugs since then wouldn't need to be an issue as the lifesaving discoveries wouldn't exist and thus OUT with the 300 billion dollar prescription drug costs per year Americans must pay. That includes the 45 billion that went to profits last year. Save that 1 percent in total health care costs and Brill speculates "could translate into a drop of 6 to 8 percent in premiums " reduced for Medicare beneficiary costs. The insurance company premiums and deductibles should be proof of the near total irrelevancy of this dangerous idea. Paul Krugman actually made a 100 flawless article in a recent New York Times issue. He said that Obama Care is having premium and deductible problems simply due to underfunded subsidies. Correct. He said that Obama Care has cost less than a third of the projected costs forecasted when it passed nearly a decade ago and it actually makes up a taxpayer funded expense of only 0.7 percent of GDP. An increase in subsidies of just 0.2 percent would eliminate alot of the brutal deductibles and would help solve 2 problems at once. The lower deductibles would have the effect of attracting insurance purchasers while the increased customer dollars would keep insurance company profits high enough that the result would be lower chances of premium and deductibles getting raised by the private insurers themselves. All while the government covers the costs of most of the 6000 dollars in deductibles the poor consumers suffer from.
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LamarkNewAge Member Posts: 2423 Joined: Member Rating: 1.2 |
Typing is hard for a number of reasons. I am going to have to point out that Krugman actually said that the ObamaCare costs are only two thirds of the best projections from around 2010. Only 0.7 percent of GDP if you confine costs to the amount that the government pays for the subsidies, Medicaid expansion, Medicare Drug changes, and other additional services. I guess that means the cost is around 140 billion dollars a year and the 826 billion dollars for the first 10 years were a major distortion since the beginning of the major funding wouldn't be till around the middle of the decade. I find it so ironic that Obama Care supporters used ignorance as a weapon to ( in their minds ) help make the program sellable (as if Americans would know what the practical difference would have been between 82 billion dollars a year and whatever the actual yearly cost was assumed to be ), when all this nickel and dime-ing seems to be the best observable explanation for the massive failure that Obama Care has genuinely been and ultimately always will be.
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NoNukes Inactive Member |
quote: Seriously brother? How about some honey instead of vinegar. Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846) History will have to record that the greatest tragedy of this period of social transition was not the strident clamor of the bad people, but the appalling silence of the good people. Martin Luther King I never considered a difference of opinion in politics, in religion, in philosophy, as cause for withdrawing from a friend. Thomas Jefferson Seems to me if its clear that certain things that require ancient dates couldn't possibly be true, we are on our way to throwing out all those ancient dates on the basis of the actual evidence. -- Faith Some of us are worried about just how much damage he will do in his last couple of weeks as president, to make it easier for the NY Times and Washington post to try to destroy Trump's presidency. -- marc9000
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LamarkNewAge Member Posts: 2423 Joined: Member Rating: 1.2 |
My heart just about stopped! See March 29, 2017 Washington Post article, Trump now says he wants to work with Democrats by Abby Phillip, Ashley Parker, and David WEigel. "One of the few Democrats that Trump talked with on health - care issues was Zeke Emmanuel... who has met with Trump three times since the election. " O dear God! The end of any meaningful "health care " for all but the rich could be around the corner FOR EVER AND EVER, A-MEN!
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LamarkNewAge Member Posts: 2423 Joined: Member Rating: 1.2 |
quote: Washington post has a disclosure that he works for an insurance company at bottom of print article. Brill is influential.His 2012 Time piece was well received and frequently referenced. His 40% figure ignores rebates which make a difference of some $50 billion a year I think.
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Percy Member Posts: 22500 From: New Hampshire Joined: Member Rating: 4.9
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Just to get this on the record, the Republicans are again trying to push a repeal of Obamacare through the Senate: New Republican Healthcare Bill
This bill would have these effects:
Modern non-third world nations take care of their people. It's like the Republicans come from the 16th century. --Percy
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Diomedes Member Posts: 996 From: Central Florida, USA Joined:
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Cause around 30 million people to lose insurance. The preceding statement adequately summarizes to me just how ethically bereft some politicians (and people) truly are. How precisely is it an improvement to remove 30 million people from having health insurance? How does this benefit our country? The true irony is that many of these people will just start leveraging emergency rooms for their standard medical needs, since it is against the law to turn anyone away from medical service. It's funny how Republicans can reconcile that notion with their capitalistic predilections. But mandate the purchasing of insurance to mitigate that cost? Can't do that because it's socialism. And we all know socialism is evil.
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