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Author Topic:   The TRVE history of the Flood...
JonF
Member (Idle past 168 days)
Posts: 6174
Joined: 06-23-2003


Message 1201 of 1352 (813403)
06-27-2017 8:18 AM
Reply to: Message 1196 by ICANT
06-27-2017 4:30 AM


Re: how much water?
No. If it was converted to a uniform layer over a perfect sphere the size of the Earth it would be 2.7 km thick, and there would be no land-based life.
That would equal 8,856 feet.
And it would equal 13.4216 furlongs. SFW?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1196 by ICANT, posted 06-27-2017 4:30 AM ICANT has seen this message but not replied

  
JonF
Member (Idle past 168 days)
Posts: 6174
Joined: 06-23-2003


Message 1202 of 1352 (813404)
06-27-2017 8:19 AM
Reply to: Message 1197 by ICANT
06-27-2017 4:36 AM


Re: how much water?
After the flood in the days of Peleg God divided the earth and that is when all the mountain ranges were created
Not according to the Bible. "Mountains of Ararat", remember?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1197 by ICANT, posted 06-27-2017 4:36 AM ICANT has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 1211 by ICANT, posted 06-27-2017 12:12 PM JonF has replied

  
jar
Member (Idle past 394 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


(1)
Message 1203 of 1352 (813407)
06-27-2017 8:46 AM
Reply to: Message 1193 by ICANT
06-27-2017 3:09 AM


Re: Ducking, dodging and weaving (same as always)
We know what you claim.
But what is missing is any evidence for what you claim, any method or mechanism for what you claim, or even any reasoned scenario.
Sorry but there is absolutely no evidence Biblical Flood ever happened and positive evidence that it has not happened at any time humans existed.
The Biblical Flood is just plain nonsense.

My Sister's Website: Rose Hill Studios My Website: My Website

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1193 by ICANT, posted 06-27-2017 3:09 AM ICANT has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 1207 by ICANT, posted 06-27-2017 11:50 AM jar has replied

  
Coyote
Member (Idle past 2106 days)
Posts: 6117
Joined: 01-12-2008


Message 1204 of 1352 (813409)
06-27-2017 10:03 AM
Reply to: Message 1191 by ICANT
06-27-2017 1:49 AM


Re: Flood waters receeded into depths
So, no mechanism, just magic, eh?
"Goddidit" is not a very satisfying or convincing argument...

Religious belief does not constitute scientific evidence, nor does it convey scientific knowledge.
Belief gets in the way of learning--Robert A. Heinlein
In the name of diversity, college student demands to be kept in ignorance of the culture that made diversity a value--StultisTheFool
It's not what we don't know that hurts, it's what we know that ain't so--Will Rogers
If I am entitled to something, someone else is obliged to pay--Jerry Pournelle
If a religion's teachings are true, then it should have nothing to fear from science...--dwise1
"Multiculturalism" demands that the US be tolerant of everything except its own past, culture, traditions, and identity.
Liberals claim to want to give a hearing to other views, but then are shocked and offended to discover that there are other points of view--William F. Buckley Jr.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1191 by ICANT, posted 06-27-2017 1:49 AM ICANT has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 1206 by ICANT, posted 06-27-2017 11:38 AM Coyote has not replied

  
ICANT
Member
Posts: 6769
From: SSC
Joined: 03-12-2007
Member Rating: 1.5


Message 1205 of 1352 (813415)
06-27-2017 11:22 AM
Reply to: Message 1184 by ringo
06-24-2017 12:21 PM


Re: Flood waters receeded into depths
Hi ringo,
ringo writes:
The "division of the earth" refers to the proliferation of languages after the Tower of Babel (Genesis 11). It has nothing to do with land masses.
So says Hebrew scholar ringo.
In Genesis 11:7 God confounded the languages.
In Genesis 11:8 They scattered themselves because they could not understand each other. So those who spoke alike got to gather and moved into a new territory.
Genesis 10:25 And unto Eber were born two sons: the name of one was Peleg; for in his days was the earth divided; and his brother's name was Joktan.
In Genesis 10 25 the Hebrew word פלג is translated divided. It means divide or split.
This verse appears in the Bible 4 times. Genesis 10:25, 1 Ch 1:19 Job 38.25, and Psa 55:9.
1 Ch 1:19 is quoting Genesis 10:25. That leaves 2 verses.
Job 38:25 is talking about dividing land with water.
Psa. 55:9 A prayer to destroy and divide the tongue of the people.
Genesis 10:31 These are the sons of Shem, after their families, after their tongues, in their lands, after their nations.
10:32 These are the families of the sons of Noah, after their generations, in their nations: and by these were the nations divided in the earth after the flood.
In verse 32 the Hebrew word חלק is translated divided. This word means: 1.to separate, divide.
This word appears 26 times in the Bible and translated: separate 12, part 4, divided 3, scattered abroad 1, dispersed 1, joint 1, scattered 1, severed 1, stretched 1, sundered 1.
Genesis 11:8 So the LORD scattered them abroad from thence upon the face of all the earth: and they left off to build the city.
In this verse the Hebrew word פוץ is translated scattered. It means: 1.to scatter, be dispersed, be scattered.
This word is used 67 times: scatter 48, scatter abroad 6, disperse 3, spread abroad 2, cast abroad 2, drive 1, break to pieces 1, shake to pieces 1, dash to pieces 1, retired 1
Now if the author had wanted to say the people were scattered over the face of the earth in Genesis 10:25 why wouldn't he have used the word used in 11:8 which would have been the best choice. The second choice would have been the one in Genesis 10:32.
If you will pay close attention you will find that these three Hebrew words are different with different meanings and used to portray something different.
Since the author knew the meaning of the words he used he chose one that best show what he was trying to point out.
He was trying to point out that the land mass that appeared in Genesis 1:9 was divided with watercourses which is exactly what we see.
These are the facts if you care to dispute them please do so giving your reasoning that the texts do not say what I have presented.
This is getting a little far (maybe a lot) off the OP so if you would like to discuss it further please start a new thread in which to do so as I will not address it in this thread again.
God Bless,

"John 5:39 (KJS) Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me."

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1184 by ringo, posted 06-24-2017 12:21 PM ringo has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 1210 by ringo, posted 06-27-2017 12:05 PM ICANT has replied

  
ICANT
Member
Posts: 6769
From: SSC
Joined: 03-12-2007
Member Rating: 1.5


Message 1206 of 1352 (813417)
06-27-2017 11:38 AM
Reply to: Message 1204 by Coyote
06-27-2017 10:03 AM


Re: Flood waters receeded into depths
Hi Coyote,
Coyote writes:
So, no mechanism, just magic, eh?
"Goddidit" is not a very satisfying or convincing argument...
I gave you a mechanism. God moved each continent to where they are in a nano second.
No magic at all.
Just God rearranging part of His creation just like you could do with a puzzle on a table.
Would you rather have me believe that over 500 million years the continents moved from where they were in 1 place to where they are today?
What is your mechanism?
It took a lot more power to ram the continents together to push the mountain ranges to where they are today. Show me where and how that power would be generated.
Your method takes more magic than mine does.
God Bless,

"John 5:39 (KJS) Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me."

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1204 by Coyote, posted 06-27-2017 10:03 AM Coyote has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 1212 by kjsimons, posted 06-27-2017 12:15 PM ICANT has replied
 Message 1226 by 14174dm, posted 06-27-2017 6:18 PM ICANT has replied
 Message 1228 by NoNukes, posted 06-27-2017 7:24 PM ICANT has replied
 Message 1231 by CRR, posted 06-28-2017 12:41 AM ICANT has replied
 Message 1242 by ringo, posted 06-28-2017 3:31 PM ICANT has seen this message but not replied

  
ICANT
Member
Posts: 6769
From: SSC
Joined: 03-12-2007
Member Rating: 1.5


Message 1207 of 1352 (813420)
06-27-2017 11:50 AM
Reply to: Message 1203 by jar
06-27-2017 8:46 AM


Re: Ducking, dodging and weaving (same as always)
Hi jar,
jar writes:
Sorry but there is absolutely no evidence Biblical Flood ever happened and positive evidence that it has not happened at any time humans existed.
The Biblical Flood is just plain nonsense.
And exactly what evidence would you expect to find if a single land mass that had been covered with water was then divided into what we have today.
You would probably find sea critter fossils on the top of every mountain and even in every mountain as all the land was covered in water for an indefinite period of duration.
That is exactly what we find. But they were not put there during the flood of Noah. They accumulated there while being covered with the water that is found at Genesis 1:2. as all land was covered.
You may think the flood is nonsense, that's OK. I think just about everything you say is nonsense.
We are each entitled to our own opinions.
God Bless,

"John 5:39 (KJS) Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me."

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1203 by jar, posted 06-27-2017 8:46 AM jar has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 1209 by Coyote, posted 06-27-2017 11:53 AM ICANT has not replied
 Message 1219 by jar, posted 06-27-2017 1:30 PM ICANT has replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 412 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 1208 of 1352 (813422)
06-27-2017 11:53 AM
Reply to: Message 1194 by ICANT
06-27-2017 3:22 AM


Re: Ducking, dodging and weaving (same as always)
ICANT writes:
The Bible says nothing about an "eruption", it says that God opened the fountains of the deep.
We're talking about the supposed "fountains of the deep" and edge called it an eruption. We're using HIS concept of an eruption, not yours.
ICANT writes:
He chose to have the water available in the earth and sky to use for the flood.
The Bible doesn't say that.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1194 by ICANT, posted 06-27-2017 3:22 AM ICANT has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 1213 by ICANT, posted 06-27-2017 12:20 PM ringo has replied

  
Coyote
Member (Idle past 2106 days)
Posts: 6117
Joined: 01-12-2008


Message 1209 of 1352 (813423)
06-27-2017 11:53 AM
Reply to: Message 1207 by ICANT
06-27-2017 11:50 AM


Re: Ducking, dodging and weaving (same as always)
We are each entitled to our own opinions.
But not to our own facts.
And the facts show there was no worldwide flood during historic times.

Religious belief does not constitute scientific evidence, nor does it convey scientific knowledge.
Belief gets in the way of learning--Robert A. Heinlein
In the name of diversity, college student demands to be kept in ignorance of the culture that made diversity a value--StultisTheFool
It's not what we don't know that hurts, it's what we know that ain't so--Will Rogers
If I am entitled to something, someone else is obliged to pay--Jerry Pournelle
If a religion's teachings are true, then it should have nothing to fear from science...--dwise1
"Multiculturalism" demands that the US be tolerant of everything except its own past, culture, traditions, and identity.
Liberals claim to want to give a hearing to other views, but then are shocked and offended to discover that there are other points of view--William F. Buckley Jr.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1207 by ICANT, posted 06-27-2017 11:50 AM ICANT has not replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 412 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 1210 of 1352 (813424)
06-27-2017 12:05 PM
Reply to: Message 1205 by ICANT
06-27-2017 11:22 AM


Re: Flood waters receeded into depths
ICANT writes:
Since the author knew the meaning of the words he used he chose one that best show what he was trying to point out.
You don't know why the author chose a certain word.
ICANT writes:
He was trying to point out that the land mass that appeared in Genesis 1:9 was divided with watercourses which is exactly what we see.
You don't know what he was trying to point out.
The mention of the earth being divided is in the context of the story of the Tower of Babel. If the author was concerned about conveying his intentions, he woulda/coulda/shoulda been careful about the context.
He did say in Genesis 10:32, "These are the families of the sons of Noah, after their generations, in their nations: and by these were the nations divided in the earth after the flood." The NATIONS were divided, not the land they lived on.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1205 by ICANT, posted 06-27-2017 11:22 AM ICANT has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 1217 by ICANT, posted 06-27-2017 1:10 PM ringo has replied

  
ICANT
Member
Posts: 6769
From: SSC
Joined: 03-12-2007
Member Rating: 1.5


Message 1211 of 1352 (813425)
06-27-2017 12:12 PM
Reply to: Message 1202 by JonF
06-27-2017 8:19 AM


Re: how much water?
Hi Jon,
Jon writes:
Not according to the Bible. "Mountains of Ararat", remember?
Are you going to blame the author for not knowing that the land mass was a lot different when it was in one place than it was when he was observing it? He would have been a Genius, as well as omniscient.
He did not have science to help him to understand that the land mass above water was in one place at one time, and was divided into the locations it is in today.
He wrote that all the water was in one place and he assumed it was still all in one place and he used terms that describe the landscape as he knew it to be.
But remember a mole hill could be called a הר.
God Bless,

"John 5:39 (KJS) Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me."

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1202 by JonF, posted 06-27-2017 8:19 AM JonF has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 1215 by JonF, posted 06-27-2017 12:43 PM ICANT has not replied
 Message 1229 by NoNukes, posted 06-27-2017 7:50 PM ICANT has replied

  
kjsimons
Member
Posts: 821
From: Orlando,FL
Joined: 06-17-2003
Member Rating: 6.7


Message 1212 of 1352 (813426)
06-27-2017 12:15 PM
Reply to: Message 1206 by ICANT
06-27-2017 11:38 AM


Re: Flood waters receeded into depths
Icant writes:
Would you rather have me believe that over 500 million years the continents moved from where they were in 1 place to where they are today?
What is your mechanism?
It took a lot more power to ram the continents together to push the mountain ranges to where they are today. Show me where and how that power would be generated.
Your method takes more magic than Mine does.
Are you for real? Plate tectonics is not a controversial theory and the continents are all still on the move. Europe and North America are moving away from each other at about an inch a year, we can and do measure these things. Do you deny that continents are still moving?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1206 by ICANT, posted 06-27-2017 11:38 AM ICANT has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 1253 by ICANT, posted 07-01-2017 1:53 AM kjsimons has not replied

  
ICANT
Member
Posts: 6769
From: SSC
Joined: 03-12-2007
Member Rating: 1.5


Message 1213 of 1352 (813429)
06-27-2017 12:20 PM
Reply to: Message 1208 by ringo
06-27-2017 11:53 AM


Re: Ducking, dodging and weaving (same as always)
Hi ringo,
ringo writes:
We're talking about the supposed "fountains of the deep" and edge called it an eruption. We're using HIS concept of an eruption, not yours.
Good then discuss it with edge.
ringo writes:
The Bible doesn't say that.
Are you sure about that?
quote:
And the earth was without form, and void; and darkness was upon the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters.
Sounds to me like He supplied enough water to cover all the land mass as it was covered.
God Bless,

"John 5:39 (KJS) Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me."

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1208 by ringo, posted 06-27-2017 11:53 AM ringo has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 1214 by ringo, posted 06-27-2017 12:26 PM ICANT has not replied
 Message 1216 by edge, posted 06-27-2017 12:48 PM ICANT has replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 412 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 1214 of 1352 (813430)
06-27-2017 12:26 PM
Reply to: Message 1213 by ICANT
06-27-2017 12:20 PM


Re: Ducking, dodging and weaving (same as always)
ICANT writes:
Good then discuss it with edge.
I'm just pointing out where you're wrong. You don't have to respond.
ICANT writes:
quote:
And the earth was without form, and void; and darkness was upon the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters.
Sounds to me like He supplied enough water to cover all the land mass as it was covered.
That doesn't say anything about God providing enough water for the Flood.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1213 by ICANT, posted 06-27-2017 12:20 PM ICANT has not replied

  
JonF
Member (Idle past 168 days)
Posts: 6174
Joined: 06-23-2003


Message 1215 of 1352 (813431)
06-27-2017 12:43 PM
Reply to: Message 1211 by ICANT
06-27-2017 12:12 PM


Re: how much water?
The bible says "mountains of Ararat". Do you deny the Bible?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1211 by ICANT, posted 06-27-2017 12:12 PM ICANT has not replied

  
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