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Author Topic:   Nothing in biology makes sense except in the light of evolution.
JonF
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Posts: 6174
Joined: 06-23-2003


(1)
Message 984 of 1311 (815580)
07-21-2017 11:10 AM
Reply to: Message 983 by Faith
07-21-2017 10:57 AM


Re: Let's call this the Genesis 2:7 message
it clearly says that life CANNOT be created from dirt

In English there is supposed to be an antecedent for a pronoun. To what does "it" refer? If the Bible, then it's not relevant in a science forum.


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JonF
Member
Posts: 6174
Joined: 06-23-2003


Message 1002 of 1311 (815644)
07-22-2017 9:25 AM
Reply to: Message 992 by Dredge
07-21-2017 10:24 PM


Re: Interesting question...
It comes as no surprise all that you can't give me an example.

See the logic error there? Of course not.

Er ... no; I can't see the logic error here. This must mean you are much smarter than I am.

Seems likely. Taq wrote:

Nothing he said indicates in any way that he can't give you an example.


This message is a reply to:
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Replies to this message:
 Message 1008 by Dredge, posted 07-23-2017 5:12 AM JonF has replied

  
JonF
Member
Posts: 6174
Joined: 06-23-2003


Message 1016 of 1311 (815698)
07-23-2017 9:22 AM
Reply to: Message 1008 by Dredge
07-23-2017 5:12 AM


Re: Interesting question...
And true.

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JonF
Member
Posts: 6174
Joined: 06-23-2003


(2)
Message 1115 of 1311 (816037)
07-28-2017 8:49 AM
Reply to: Message 1104 by Dredge
07-28-2017 1:38 AM


Re: Interesting question...
What is the difference between Porsche making a 'family' of sports cars and a nested hierarchy?

A nested hierarchy is a special and very unusual arrangement of items.


  • All items must be placed in a labeled container.
  • No two containers may share the same label.
  • Containers may be placed inside containers.
  • All items in any container must have the property named by that container and all containers containing that container.
  • All items that have the property named by a by a container must appear n that container and no other,

So the difference is that no significant number of vehicles or any man-made objects can be arranged in a nested hierarchy. Many have tried, none have succeeded. Whenever anyone does produce a nested hierarchy of man-made objects it's trivial to produce an example that breaks the nesting.

Maybe I can post Michael Denton's allegedly nested hierarchy of vehicles to see if you can figure out where it fails. There's lots of possibilities.

Now, the fact that life can be arranged in a nested hierarchy of literally hundreds of millions of items is incredibly unusual in the universe of all possibilities of relationships or lack thereof. It demands explanation. Further, there are two independent ways of producing a nested hierarchy of life and they agree almost exactly.


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JonF
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Posts: 6174
Joined: 06-23-2003


Message 1125 of 1311 (816072)
07-28-2017 7:48 PM
Reply to: Message 1124 by CRR
07-28-2017 7:03 PM


Re: Self replicating molecule
In the real world you address all the evidence.

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JonF
Member
Posts: 6174
Joined: 06-23-2003


Message 1169 of 1311 (816278)
08-02-2017 8:48 AM
Reply to: Message 1167 by Dredge
08-02-2017 6:18 AM


Re: Gould's observations do support Creationism
He knew. He was pissed. But that's no reason for discarding a theory.

Eminent biologist hits back at the creationists who 'hijacked' his theory for their own ends


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JonF
Member
Posts: 6174
Joined: 06-23-2003


(1)
Message 1184 of 1311 (816349)
08-03-2017 8:23 AM
Reply to: Message 1177 by Dredge
08-03-2017 2:05 AM


Re: seven "assumptions"
If the first parts of Genesis are allegorical, when does the allegory stop and the literal begin?

Ah, there's the rub. You are probably one of those who's scared to death of losing your get-out-of-hell-free card. If you have to decide what's literal and what is not, you might decide wrong, and then it's the fiery pit for you, boyo. So you avoid the problem by deciding everything is literal.

Which immediately leads to no end of contradictions and a worldview that has no connection to reality.

Step up to the plate, belly up to the bar, and decide.

Edited by JonF, : No reason given.


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JonF
Member
Posts: 6174
Joined: 06-23-2003


Message 1190 of 1311 (816366)
08-03-2017 11:50 AM
Reply to: Message 1186 by Faith
08-03-2017 8:53 AM


Re: seven "assumptions"
What kind of "lesson about God" could one get from a mythicized story?

Myths are used in many cultures to teach about the society and its values and its relation to the outside world (including whatever God(s) they worship).


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JonF
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Posts: 6174
Joined: 06-23-2003


Message 1219 of 1311 (816420)
08-04-2017 9:25 AM
Reply to: Message 1207 by Dredge
08-04-2017 2:58 AM


Re: seven "assumptions"
God arranged to have his Word recorded in written form to preserve its accuracy down through the centuries.

That's your fallible interpretation.


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JonF
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Posts: 6174
Joined: 06-23-2003


Message 1220 of 1311 (816421)
08-04-2017 9:26 AM
Reply to: Message 1207 by Dredge
08-04-2017 2:58 AM


Re: seven "assumptions"
Human intelligence is infallible? I didn't know that!

Nor does Ringo, because he didn't claim that. He never claimed all errors are corrected and ,of course, if human intelligence were infallible there wouldn't be any errors to correct.


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JonF
Member
Posts: 6174
Joined: 06-23-2003


Message 1222 of 1311 (816423)
08-04-2017 9:29 AM
Reply to: Message 1214 by herebedragons
08-04-2017 8:11 AM


Re: Gould's observations do support Creationism
So... you think God created some species of animal and it thrived for a time and then died out so God created a new species that was very similar to the original species but had some modifications, but that also died out after a number of years, so God tried again... and again... and again... until he finally hit upon a suitable design - and those are our modern species

All in a few thousand years. But wait... didn't all those animal exist at the time of the Fludde?


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JonF
Member
Posts: 6174
Joined: 06-23-2003


Message 1223 of 1311 (816424)
08-04-2017 9:33 AM
Reply to: Message 1217 by CRR
08-04-2017 8:55 AM


Except that I read your link and while the quote is an extract from the 5 pages it is representative of what Ruse said, and as such is not quote mining.

Eminent biologist hits back at the creationists who 'hijacked' his theory for their own ends

Did you read that link?

Do you know better than him what he meant?


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JonF
Member
Posts: 6174
Joined: 06-23-2003


Message 1236 of 1311 (816456)
08-04-2017 5:41 PM
Reply to: Message 1230 by Faith
08-04-2017 3:55 PM


Re: seven "assumptions"
That's your fallible interpretation.

Might be right.

Might not be right.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 1230 by Faith, posted 08-04-2017 3:55 PM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
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JonF
Member
Posts: 6174
Joined: 06-23-2003


(1)
Message 1238 of 1311 (816460)
08-04-2017 7:56 PM
Reply to: Message 1237 by Faith
08-04-2017 7:25 PM


Re: seven "assumptions"
No, of course not.

You can decide, obviously you have. You cannot prove your decision correct without more evidence.

"I've decided" is not enough. "A lot of people have decided" doesn't work either.

Edited by JonF, : No reason given.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 1237 by Faith, posted 08-04-2017 7:25 PM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
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JonF
Member
Posts: 6174
Joined: 06-23-2003


Message 1246 of 1311 (816480)
08-05-2017 8:10 AM
Reply to: Message 1241 by Faith
08-05-2017 3:17 AM


Re: seven "assumptions"
I don't feel any need to try to prove it. It remains a fact that if God inspired the writers the writing has no errors and should be taken as God's own communication. My opinion is irrelevant, as is yours.

So your unsupported opinion is a now a fact?

You have obviously acknowledged that your opinion is unsupportable and is just as irrelevant to reality as mine. Personally, I doubt God dictated the bible but I don't claim any certainty; because such opinions are unsupportable.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 1241 by Faith, posted 08-05-2017 3:17 AM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 1247 by Faith, posted 08-05-2017 9:33 AM JonF has replied

  
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