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Author Topic:   Is it "Politically Correct"...
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1444 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 3 of 195 (816908)
08-13-2017 12:26 PM


There is no right of "peaceful assembly" when a group advocates violence of any sort. The white supremacists with their threatening of violence to Jews among others, should be banned from public demonstrations. I don't understand why such a group would be allowed a public forum at all as they were in Charlottesville.

Replies to this message:
 Message 4 by jar, posted 08-13-2017 12:33 PM Faith has replied

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1444 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 5 of 195 (816912)
08-13-2017 12:57 PM
Reply to: Message 4 by jar
08-13-2017 12:33 PM


I don't know how the law is worded with respect to violent speech but I thought that free speech is limited by the rule that "you can't falsely yell 'fire' in a crowded theater." Threatening to kill Jews as one of the crowd did in an interview I heard in my opinion ought not to be allowed.

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 Message 6 by ringo, posted 08-13-2017 2:18 PM Faith has replied

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1444 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 7 of 195 (816920)
08-13-2017 2:52 PM
Reply to: Message 6 by ringo
08-13-2017 2:18 PM


True, but it sounded rather like a platform statement that could possibly be found in official statements of their organization. He listed three objectives he imputed to the gathering as a whole, something about protesting the Leftist attack on white culture and something else I don't remember and the third was "killing Jews." If his statements do represent the published objectives of the organization, my question is whether an organization that threatens violence to the Jews, or to anybody, has the rights granted by the Bill of Rights.

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 Message 6 by ringo, posted 08-13-2017 2:18 PM ringo has replied

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 Message 8 by ringo, posted 08-13-2017 3:20 PM Faith has replied

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1444 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 10 of 195 (816924)
08-13-2017 4:16 PM
Reply to: Message 8 by ringo
08-13-2017 3:20 PM


the right to demonstrate, protest etc
The question I'm asking is whether an organization with stated objectives of violence toward anyone would legally be granted a right to protest or demonstrate in public. Those gatherings normally require legal permission, don't they? So what is the law regarding the right to assemble for such an organization? I'm not asking about the legal rights of individuals.

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 Message 8 by ringo, posted 08-13-2017 3:20 PM ringo has replied

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 Message 27 by ringo, posted 08-14-2017 11:49 AM Faith has replied

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1444 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 11 of 195 (816925)
08-13-2017 4:31 PM


This is a complicated situation in some ways. I'm with the group protesting the removal of historical monuments, I'm against the Leftist position on that, and also am aware that it's been Leftist protests that have turned violent in the last few months, and that there are Leftists who openly advocate such violence too. I'm against their right to demonstrate as well. This just raises a lot of questions for me about the right to public assembly, protest, demonstrate and so on, by any group that advocates any kind of violence against anybody. For me the advocacy of killing Jews should take away the rights of the protesting group to any kind of public display or forum, but my opinion may not be shared by the law; the point is I don't know.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1444 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 17 of 195 (816932)
08-13-2017 6:42 PM


As usual I find a strange lack of simple intelligence in some posts by some leftists. My post ought to have been clear enough to any fair thinking person: I am with the protest against removing historical monuments, not with the group currently protesting it. Really, that's quite clear in what I said. And I'm against ADVOCACY OF VIOLENCE on either side, and in the case of the Left we're talking actual violence, not advocacy. Excuse me, I should add the car attack of course, I was only thinking of the protest itself. Of course I'm against actual violence on either side; my question has to do with organizations whose platform includes advocacy of violence. I really would deny them the right to any sort of public demonstration myself.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

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 Message 18 by Chiroptera, posted 08-13-2017 8:37 PM Faith has replied

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1444 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 19 of 195 (816940)
08-14-2017 12:21 AM
Reply to: Message 18 by Chiroptera
08-13-2017 8:37 PM


I don't think general advocacy of the kind you mention is the problem. I'm thinking of characterizing the goals of an organization as "killing Jews" in so many words. See what cites you can find that address that situation.

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 Message 18 by Chiroptera, posted 08-13-2017 8:37 PM Chiroptera has replied

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 Message 78 by Chiroptera, posted 08-15-2017 8:26 PM Faith has not replied

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1444 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 22 of 195 (816954)
08-14-2017 10:09 AM
Reply to: Message 21 by Diomedes
08-14-2017 9:58 AM


Would someone please address the situation I'm talking about. I'm not talking about general statements, wishes that some groups be dead, insults etc., I'm wondering about the legal status of an organization that has as its stated platform a statement like:
We advocate the killing of Jews.
or
Our platform is to defend white culture and kill Jews.

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 Message 23 by jar, posted 08-14-2017 10:15 AM Faith has replied

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1444 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 24 of 195 (816958)
08-14-2017 10:32 AM
Reply to: Message 23 by jar
08-14-2017 10:15 AM


Re: civil vs criminal
You've offered no evidence whatever.
I still hope someone will come along who knows something.

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Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1444 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 29 of 195 (816982)
08-14-2017 12:00 PM
Reply to: Message 27 by ringo
08-14-2017 11:49 AM


Re: the right to demonstrate, protest etc
I was asking a hypothetical question.

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 Message 27 by ringo, posted 08-14-2017 11:49 AM ringo has replied

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 Message 30 by ringo, posted 08-14-2017 12:06 PM Faith has replied

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1444 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 31 of 195 (816994)
08-14-2017 1:18 PM
Reply to: Message 30 by ringo
08-14-2017 12:06 PM


Re: the right to demonstrate, protest etc
It's a better policy to follow the discussion.

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 Message 30 by ringo, posted 08-14-2017 12:06 PM ringo has replied

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 Message 32 by ringo, posted 08-14-2017 1:24 PM Faith has not replied

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1444 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 43 of 195 (817137)
08-15-2017 2:26 PM
Reply to: Message 41 by PaulK
08-15-2017 1:25 PM


Re: And Alex Jones blames...Jews
There are many strongly Leftist Jews. There are also many strongly Rightist Jews. ABE: David Horowitz, Michael Savage, Mark Levin come to mind and at least Horowitz and Savage appear on Alex Jones' show from time to time.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

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 Message 41 by PaulK, posted 08-15-2017 1:25 PM PaulK has replied

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 Message 45 by PaulK, posted 08-15-2017 4:31 PM Faith has not replied

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1444 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 62 of 195 (817191)
08-15-2017 5:37 PM
Reply to: Message 54 by PaulK
08-15-2017 5:15 PM


Re: And Alex Jones blames...Jews
Alex Jones is not anti-Semitic. There are known Jewish leftist conspiracies, they ARE Jewish and they ARE leftist. He says he saw the KKK without their hoods and they "looked" Jewish. Well some Jews do look Jewish, that's not anti-Semitism, it's fact. Some Jews DON'T look Jewish. He said these looked Jewish. Not having seen them I don't know what I would think but I don't see any reason to assume he made it up. He's condemned anti-semjitism, he's condemned the KKK. People have trouble with Jones because he's consistent and he will call a Jewish conspiracy a Jewish conspiracy while being very supportive of Jewish conservatives. When I saw the protestor saying he wants to kill Jews I knew the guy would be happy to kill all the conservative Jews too and all my politically confused Jewish relatives too, and THAT scares me. But identifying a Jewish leftist conspiracy, though it's going to get you falsely branded by the Left as a racist anti-Semite hater pig, is just being precise.
He's also condemned the KKK. So identifying a KKK appearance as a fake put on by a Jewish leftist conspiracy has nothing to do with supporting the KKK. He's objecting to any implication that all white people are racists, symbolized by the KKK and he sees that as the message the Leftist Jewish conspiracy is trying to get across.
https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=Infowars+KKK...

This message is a reply to:
 Message 54 by PaulK, posted 08-15-2017 5:15 PM PaulK has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 67 by PaulK, posted 08-15-2017 5:46 PM Faith has replied
 Message 71 by Taq, posted 08-15-2017 5:50 PM Faith has replied

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1444 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 68 of 195 (817201)
08-15-2017 5:46 PM
Reply to: Message 64 by PaulK
08-15-2017 5:41 PM


Re: And Alex Jones blames...Jews
I agree he's "targeting" meaning identifying Jews - a particular group of Jews, Leftist activist Jews who do have an agenda that comes out of their early Communist identity, then their identity in the 60s Frankfurt School/Cultural Marxism which has wreaked so much havoc since the 60s and fueled a lot of the hatred on the Left against America and against white people. You may ask why it's a particularly Jewish conspiracy, but the only answer is that it simply is. They somehow see it as their mission to bring down the West. That was Marx's mission, and in his own different way, Freud's as well.
David Horowitz used to be one of them. Fortunately we now have a lot of conservative Jews fighting against them.

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Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1444 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 70 of 195 (817203)
08-15-2017 5:48 PM
Reply to: Message 67 by PaulK
08-15-2017 5:46 PM


Re: And Alex Jones blames...Jews
I can tell the difference between a nutty statement and a sensible statement even by the same person. I don't tar a person for his errors if he also says a lot of intelligent thngs. I don't recall anything he said about chimeras. I only listen to him once in a while and probably miss a lot of his stuff.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 67 by PaulK, posted 08-15-2017 5:46 PM PaulK has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 81 by PaulK, posted 08-15-2017 11:56 PM Faith has replied

  
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