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Author Topic:   Flat Earth Society
NoNukes
Inactive Member


Message 19 of 119 (706507)
09-12-2013 7:39 PM
Reply to: Message 4 by nwr
09-09-2013 9:17 AM


Topologically, it is a sphere with handles. And every time a new clover-leaf highway interchange is built, we add more handles. There are also natural handles (natural bridges, caves with multiple openings).
Geometrically, it is not a sphere -- there are too many hills and valleys for that.
Those are all fairly minor deviations from a sphere. Far more significant is that the earth is actually bulges out into something like an oblate spheroid due to gravity and spin. The equator bulges out at about 26.5 miles which is far larger than any hill or ocean trench.
Geodesy and the Earth's Size and Shape
quote:
Local topography also plays a role in the Earth's shape, but on a global scale its role is very small. The largest differences in local topography across the globe are Mount Everest, the highest point above sea level at 29,035 ft (8,850 m), and the Mariana Trench, the lowest point below sea level at 35,840 ft (10,924 m). This difference is only a matter of about 12 miles (19 km), which is very minor overall. If equatorial bulge is considered, the world's highest point and the place that is farthest from the Earth's center is the peak of the volcano Chimborazo in Ecuador as it is the highest peak that is nearest the equator. Its elevation is 20,561 ft (6,267 m).

Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)
I believe that a scientist looking at nonscientific problems is just as dumb as the next guy.
Richard P. Feynman
If there is no struggle, there is no progress. Those who profess to favor freedom, and deprecate agitation, are men who want crops without plowing up the ground, they want rain without thunder and lightning. Frederick Douglass

This message is a reply to:
 Message 4 by nwr, posted 09-09-2013 9:17 AM nwr has seen this message but not replied

  
NoNukes
Inactive Member


Message 49 of 119 (819104)
09-06-2017 9:35 AM
Reply to: Message 48 by Rrhain
09-06-2017 4:11 AM


Re: Neil deGrasse Tyson is a Flat Earther!
So get yourself on the dock and set up a sufficiently powered light source (a common laser will do). Put yourself on a boat with a target and note where on the target the laser hits. Then, simply putt on out into the lake, paying attention to where the laser hits the target.
Be careful with this experiment. After reading a post by Dr. Adequate on the subject, I looked up the details of the experiment and found that it was possible to get a flat earth answer if atmospheric refraction kicks in. Such problems can be aggravated by a temperature inversion. You can avoid this by setting up your sight line a few meters above the surface of the lake.

Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)
I was thinking as long as I have my hands up they’re not going to shoot me. This is what I’m thinking they’re not going to shoot me. Wow, was I wrong. -- Charles Kinsey
We got a thousand points of light for the homeless man. We've got a kinder, gentler, machine gun hand. Neil Young, Rockin' in the Free World.
Worrying about the "browning of America" is not racism. -- Faith
I hate you all, you hate me -- Faith

This message is a reply to:
 Message 48 by Rrhain, posted 09-06-2017 4:11 AM Rrhain has not replied

  
NoNukes
Inactive Member


Message 50 of 119 (819105)
09-06-2017 9:42 AM
Reply to: Message 44 by ringo
09-05-2017 12:38 PM


As long as gravity is orthogonal to the surface, I don't think it makes any difference whether the surface is flat or convex - gravity will pull the bullet toward the surface. To fit the physics, a flat earth would need "lines of gravity" that were parallel instead of convergent at the center of mass.
Gravity is orthogonal to a finite surface only when the surface is spherical. Also, gravity is not directed towards the center of mass for shapes that are not roughly spherical. See Gauss law for the details.

Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)
I was thinking as long as I have my hands up they’re not going to shoot me. This is what I’m thinking they’re not going to shoot me. Wow, was I wrong. -- Charles Kinsey
We got a thousand points of light for the homeless man. We've got a kinder, gentler, machine gun hand. Neil Young, Rockin' in the Free World.
Worrying about the "browning of America" is not racism. -- Faith
I hate you all, you hate me -- Faith

This message is a reply to:
 Message 44 by ringo, posted 09-05-2017 12:38 PM ringo has seen this message but not replied

  
NoNukes
Inactive Member


Message 57 of 119 (819178)
09-07-2017 4:12 PM
Reply to: Message 56 by caffeine
09-07-2017 1:21 PM


Re: Do the Math!
Assuming no air resistance, the drop time would be closer to 1 1/2 seconds (sqrt of 2). You're mixing up the downward speed and the downward acceleration.
More to the point. He is making silly ridiculous errors in computation while complaining about an approximation by Galileo. His own answer is about 40% too low.
By the way, heavy "objects hit the ground first due to air resistance" requires a lot of qualifiers. Example, what hits the ground first, a three pound package of nearly folded cotton shirts or a one pound steel ball?
Or a man with an opened heavy parachute versus a man with no chute?
Or a fat man versus a lighter, skinny man?
Edited by NoNukes, : No reason given.

Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)
I was thinking as long as I have my hands up they’re not going to shoot me. This is what I’m thinking they’re not going to shoot me. Wow, was I wrong. -- Charles Kinsey
We got a thousand points of light for the homeless man. We've got a kinder, gentler, machine gun hand. Neil Young, Rockin' in the Free World.
Worrying about the "browning of America" is not racism. -- Faith
I hate you all, you hate me -- Faith

This message is a reply to:
 Message 56 by caffeine, posted 09-07-2017 1:21 PM caffeine has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 58 by caffeine, posted 09-07-2017 4:34 PM NoNukes has replied
 Message 61 by CRR, posted 09-07-2017 6:08 PM NoNukes has replied

  
NoNukes
Inactive Member


Message 59 of 119 (819182)
09-07-2017 4:49 PM
Reply to: Message 58 by caffeine
09-07-2017 4:34 PM


Re: Do the Math!
Can a fat man actually fall slower by presenting a bigger surface area?
Yes, he can. In fact, a skinny man can alter his terminal velocity considerably by reorienting himself. (Laying out flat vs. a headfirst dive)

Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)
I was thinking as long as I have my hands up they’re not going to shoot me. This is what I’m thinking they’re not going to shoot me. Wow, was I wrong. -- Charles Kinsey
We got a thousand points of light for the homeless man. We've got a kinder, gentler, machine gun hand. Neil Young, Rockin' in the Free World.
Worrying about the "browning of America" is not racism. -- Faith
I hate you all, you hate me -- Faith

This message is a reply to:
 Message 58 by caffeine, posted 09-07-2017 4:34 PM caffeine has not replied

  
NoNukes
Inactive Member


Message 74 of 119 (819248)
09-08-2017 9:22 AM
Reply to: Message 61 by CRR
09-07-2017 6:08 PM


Re: Do the Math!
Indeed it does, which is why I said "cannon balls'. Same density, same shape, different sizes.
Not correct.
You have not consistently limited your statement to cannon balls. Here is your initial statement on the subject.
In a similar vein I also say Galileo was wrong in his experiment dropping weights off the leaning tower of Pisa; the heavy one should hit the ground first.
Just for some background, the pre-Scientific method conclusion was that objects would fall at speeds proportional to their mass. Galileo's experiments were performed with balls rolling down ramps and were conclusive that gravity did not work this way at all. To complain about the effect of air resistance, which was the reason why the Aristotle view survived so long, is to miss the entire point of Galileo's creation of the scientific method.
In short Galileo's contribution was to separate the force of gravity from other forces like air resistance. Your contribution is to be a buffoon.
Edited by NoNukes, : No reason given.

Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)
I was thinking as long as I have my hands up they’re not going to shoot me. This is what I’m thinking they’re not going to shoot me. Wow, was I wrong. -- Charles Kinsey
We got a thousand points of light for the homeless man. We've got a kinder, gentler, machine gun hand. Neil Young, Rockin' in the Free World.
Worrying about the "browning of America" is not racism. -- Faith
I hate you all, you hate me -- Faith

This message is a reply to:
 Message 61 by CRR, posted 09-07-2017 6:08 PM CRR has not replied

  
NoNukes
Inactive Member


(1)
Message 108 of 119 (819631)
09-13-2017 4:04 PM
Reply to: Message 106 by Rrhain
09-11-2017 7:20 PM


Re: Do the Math!
Well, no wonder you don't understand a thing about what Galileo said and keep getting the physics wrong.
After you quoted Galileo explicitly acknowledging the air resistance issue, there is really no honest thing for CRR to do other than admit that he was wrong about Galileo. I know exactly what to make of his refusal to do exactly that, and I would hope that everyone else does too.
Something to think about when you are watching CRR make other ridiculous arguments. Is it really worthwhile to try pinning down Jello after exposing the slimy fluid that Jello is by nature?

Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)
I was thinking as long as I have my hands up they’re not going to shoot me. This is what I’m thinking they’re not going to shoot me. Wow, was I wrong. -- Charles Kinsey
We got a thousand points of light for the homeless man. We've got a kinder, gentler, machine gun hand. Neil Young, Rockin' in the Free World.
Worrying about the "browning of America" is not racism. -- Faith
I hate you all, you hate me -- Faith

This message is a reply to:
 Message 106 by Rrhain, posted 09-11-2017 7:20 PM Rrhain has not replied

  
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