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Author Topic:   Evidence of the flood
Percy
Member
Posts: 20766
From: New Hampshire
Joined: 12-23-2000
Member Rating: 2.1


Message 181 of 899 (819189)
09-07-2017 6:08 PM
Reply to: Message 176 by Faith
09-07-2017 1:24 PM


Re: Utter lies from jar
Faith writes:

Percy writes:

In the meantime, why don't you say something on topic and provide evidence for the Flood.

Sure. Strata and fossils.

Wow, the walls are going up already. Plus that's evidence for an ancient Earth and evolution.

--Percy


This message is a reply to:
 Message 176 by Faith, posted 09-07-2017 1:24 PM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 187 by Faith, posted 09-07-2017 8:18 PM Percy has replied

  
riVeRraT
Member (Idle past 169 days)
Posts: 5755
From: NY USA
Joined: 05-09-2004


Message 182 of 899 (819197)
09-07-2017 6:38 PM
Reply to: Message 151 by jar
09-05-2017 5:11 PM


Re: Learn basics rr.
jar writes:

Physical evidence is objective.

Belief is subjective.

Yes, that is what I am saying. Your belief, the cult of jar is subjective.


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 Message 151 by jar, posted 09-05-2017 5:11 PM jar has replied

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jar
Member
Posts: 33906
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004
Member Rating: 2.8


(1)
Message 183 of 899 (819198)
09-07-2017 6:42 PM
Reply to: Message 182 by riVeRraT
09-07-2017 6:38 PM


Re: Learn basics rr.
LOL

There is no Cult of jar.

But if you send money I will try to hum a few bars.

The fact remains that there is physical evidence that shows there has never been a world-wide flood during the time humans have existed. That is objective.

There is no evidence of either a God or any world-wide flood. That is objective.


My Sister's Website: Rose Hill Studios     My Website: My Website

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riVeRraT
Member (Idle past 169 days)
Posts: 5755
From: NY USA
Joined: 05-09-2004


Message 184 of 899 (819199)
09-07-2017 6:45 PM
Reply to: Message 158 by Percy
09-05-2017 6:56 PM


Percy writes:

Those organizations and people believe that creationists do conduct real science, so you have no reason to exclude yourself from the ranks of the creationists.

No Percy. I do not try to prove creation with science. I've already expressed my subjective belief multiple times, but I will write it one more time just for you. God does not want us to find physical evidence of His existence because John 3:16

You're not seeking evidence to help decide between competing explanations of the real world.

The REAL world is part subjective. We cannot live by objective means only for multiple reasons.

1. It is impossible
2. Some objectiveness changes over time and knowledge

If you're looking for evidence of the fictional, I think your hawk is better evidence of Horus than of the flood.

I am not looking for evidence. It found me. The story of the flood is amazing, be it fake or real.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 158 by Percy, posted 09-05-2017 6:56 PM Percy has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 186 by Percy, posted 09-07-2017 7:31 PM riVeRraT has replied

  
riVeRraT
Member (Idle past 169 days)
Posts: 5755
From: NY USA
Joined: 05-09-2004


Message 185 of 899 (819200)
09-07-2017 6:48 PM
Reply to: Message 166 by ringo
09-06-2017 3:20 PM


ringo writes:

The keyword is "created". If you believe a creator was necessary to the process, you're a creationist. To be fair though, we most often use the word for the worst kind of science-deniers. You're only the second or third worst kind.

Fine, I am a creationist who does not believe in creation science, fair enough?

I don't like labels. Liek I prefer not to be called a Christian. Disciple is better, because I am always learning.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 166 by ringo, posted 09-06-2017 3:20 PM ringo has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 208 by ringo, posted 09-08-2017 11:44 AM riVeRraT has replied

  
Percy
Member
Posts: 20766
From: New Hampshire
Joined: 12-23-2000
Member Rating: 2.1


(1)
Message 186 of 899 (819201)
09-07-2017 7:31 PM
Reply to: Message 184 by riVeRraT
09-07-2017 6:45 PM


riVeRraT writes:

No Percy. I do not try to prove creation with science.

Sure you do. Science is about gathering evidence in support of hypotheses. You titled this thread Evidence of the flood and offered Harvey the Hawk as your evidence. What you *do* try to do is be absurdly contrary and argumentative at every opportunity, which is actually a good strategy for those with no support for their position.

I've already expressed my subjective belief multiple times, but I will write it one more time just for you.

The search facility here isn't perfect, but it couldn't find where in this thread you've expressed what you say next about John 3:16:

God does not want us to find physical evidence of His existence because John 3:16

Well that's just daft. John 3:16 says, "For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life." It has nothing to do with your point.

I am not looking for evidence. It found me.

More irrelevant nonsense. You're arguing that a hawk in a car is evidence for a Biblical myth.

The story of the flood is amazing, be it fake or real.

It's fake.

--Percy


This message is a reply to:
 Message 184 by riVeRraT, posted 09-07-2017 6:45 PM riVeRraT has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 193 by riVeRraT, posted 09-07-2017 9:33 PM Percy has replied

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 683 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 187 of 899 (819202)
09-07-2017 8:18 PM
Reply to: Message 181 by Percy
09-07-2017 6:08 PM


Re: Utter lies from jar
Sure. Strata and fossils.

Wow, the walls are going up already. Plus that's evidence for an ancient Earth and evolution.

My participation on this thread has been cursory at best, on the level of "strata and fossils" all along. I don't think Riverrat would miss me if I didn't post any more.

Strata and fossils. Works a lot better as evidence for the Flood than for your OE and evolution, LOTS better. Ridiculous really, the idea of time periods sandwiched between slabs of rock, physically impossible for it to happen that way-- many of those slabs extend thousands of square miles, flat flat sediments that must have wiped out whatever living things had been there in that "time period" -- which all managed somehow to get smushed down into the sediments, a bit of flora and scattered fauna and no other evidence that such a scenario ever actually existed on that spot -- not to mention the simple absurdity of expecting a time period to have any kind of neat physical demarcations at all, let alone a whole series of them over hundreds of millions of years.

Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

Edited by Faith, : No reason given.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 181 by Percy, posted 09-07-2017 6:08 PM Percy has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 188 by jar, posted 09-07-2017 8:48 PM Faith has replied
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jar
Member
Posts: 33906
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004
Member Rating: 2.8


Message 188 of 899 (819204)
09-07-2017 8:48 PM
Reply to: Message 187 by Faith
09-07-2017 8:18 PM


Re: Utter lies from jar
So once again absolutely no model, method, process, procedure or thingamabob to explain how a flood can produce the very real, very objective evidence that exists.

My Sister's Website: Rose Hill Studios     My Website: My Website

This message is a reply to:
 Message 187 by Faith, posted 09-07-2017 8:18 PM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 189 by Faith, posted 09-07-2017 8:58 PM jar has replied

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 683 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 189 of 899 (819205)
09-07-2017 8:58 PM
Reply to: Message 188 by jar
09-07-2017 8:48 PM


Re: Utter lies from jar
Go find the model, it's been posted many times on threads put up for that purpose.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 188 by jar, posted 09-07-2017 8:48 PM jar has replied

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jar
Member
Posts: 33906
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004
Member Rating: 2.8


Message 190 of 899 (819206)
09-07-2017 9:07 PM
Reply to: Message 189 by Faith
09-07-2017 8:58 PM


Re: Utter lies from jar
Faith writes:

Go find the model, it's been posted many times on threads put up for that purpose.

I searched and it has not been found. Please post a link to the message.

If you like, we can go through the issues one at a time.

To begin at the beginning, how does your flood sort millions of recurring and repeating layers of fine sediment alternating with coarser sediment?

Edited by jar, : appalin grammber


My Sister's Website: Rose Hill Studios     My Website: My Website

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Replies to this message:
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RAZD
Member (Idle past 643 days)
Posts: 20714
From: the other end of the sidewalk
Joined: 03-14-2004


Message 191 of 899 (819207)
09-07-2017 9:25 PM
Reply to: Message 170 by Faith
09-07-2017 11:42 AM


Re: Utter lies from jar
I can say it again.

You can say it till the cows come home on the moon, but that doesn't make it real.

The evidence is so obvious for the Flood it pre-empts the supposed order of the fossils, which is an ililusion anyway.

That is how cognitive dissonance and delusion work.

And the Bible is evidence of God, ...

That fakes evidence and creates lies.

... that's a big part of what it's intended for whether it persuades you or not.

Oh, I'm persuaded that only a desperate delusional gullible foolish person would give up reason and evidence of reality to believe feel-good fantasy.

Enjoy


we are limited in our ability to understand
by our ability to understand
RebelAmerican☆Zen☯Deist
... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ...
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Coyote
Member (Idle past 1345 days)
Posts: 6117
Joined: 01-12-2008


(1)
Message 192 of 899 (819208)
09-07-2017 9:27 PM
Reply to: Message 190 by jar
09-07-2017 9:07 PM


Re: Utter lies from jar
To begin at the beginning...

Another fundamental question: How is it that all of the many different dating methods agree very closely?

These are methods which rely on many different phenomena, but they agree very closely.

And they show that the Earth is old, and the YEC belief/claim is inaccurate.

Unless YECs can show how these dating methods are all wrong, their YEC belief is disproved.


Religious belief does not constitute scientific evidence, nor does it convey scientific knowledge.

Belief gets in the way of learning--Robert A. Heinlein

In the name of diversity, college student demands to be kept in ignorance of the culture that made diversity a value--StultisTheFool

It's not what we don't know that hurts, it's what we know that ain't so--Will Rogers

If I am entitled to something, someone else is obliged to pay--Jerry Pournelle

If a religion's teachings are true, then it should have nothing to fear from science...--dwise1

"Multiculturalism" demands that the US be tolerant of everything except its own past, culture, traditions, and identity.

Liberals claim to want to give a hearing to other views, but then are shocked and offended to discover that there are other points of view--William F. Buckley Jr.


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riVeRraT
Member (Idle past 169 days)
Posts: 5755
From: NY USA
Joined: 05-09-2004


Message 193 of 899 (819209)
09-07-2017 9:33 PM
Reply to: Message 186 by Percy
09-07-2017 7:31 PM


Percy writes:

Sure you do. Science is about gathering evidence in support of hypotheses. You titled this thread Evidence of the flood and offered Harvey the Hawk as your evidence. What you *do* try to do is be absurdly contrary and argumentative at every opportunity, which is actually a good strategy for those with no support for their position.

Wait a sec, did you just call me a scientist? Are you accusing me of using the scientific method?

There you go, putting words in my mouth. I never offered a hypotheses. I just offered evidence. As I stated earlier, it was because I am tired of hearing the phrase "there is no evidence". There is evidence, you just choose to ignore it based on other evidence.

So my position is that you are lying saying that there is no evidence. The end.

Well that's just daft. John 3:16 says, "For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life." It has nothing to do with your point.

If you don't have the Holy Spirit, or a Godly understanding of the bible, of course you wouldn't understand. I;ve said it 3 different ways, lets make it 4.

You must believe in God by faith.

In order for that statement to be true, you cannot use objective evidence to believe in God. That's my hypothesis, based on John 3:16 and many other verses.

More irrelevant nonsense. You're arguing that a hawk in a car is evidence for a Biblical myth.

What does that have to do with the fact that the evidence found me? I wasn't looking for evidence, it just happened, and as I watched it I felt the Holy Spirit telling me this is the way God designed animals.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 186 by Percy, posted 09-07-2017 7:31 PM Percy has replied

Replies to this message:
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riVeRraT
Member (Idle past 169 days)
Posts: 5755
From: NY USA
Joined: 05-09-2004


Message 194 of 899 (819210)
09-07-2017 9:36 PM
Reply to: Message 187 by Faith
09-07-2017 8:18 PM


Re: Utter lies from jar
Faith writes:

My participation on this thread has been cursory at best, on the level of "strata and fossils" all along. I don't think Riverrat would miss me if I didn't post any more.

You can post all you want. I support freedom of speech. I may not agree with you, so I am staying out your sidebar discussions, but you are free to post.


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RAZD
Member (Idle past 643 days)
Posts: 20714
From: the other end of the sidewalk
Joined: 03-14-2004


(2)
Message 195 of 899 (819211)
09-07-2017 9:46 PM
Reply to: Message 192 by Coyote
09-07-2017 9:27 PM


Re: Utter lies from jar
Dear faith and other YECies

Explain the consilience of results from multiple different sources and systems of measuring the age of the 14C samples that makes this composite graph ... if you can.

Denial is not an explanation.

Saying the evidence lies means the whole world is lies and illusion, and - if you believe it was created by god/s - that means the god/s created lies and illusions and not one piece of reality. Everything.

Think about it. Think it through.

Enjoy

Edited by RAZD, : .


we are limited in our ability to understand
by our ability to understand
RebelAmerican☆Zen☯Deist
... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ...
to share.


• • • Join the effort to solve medical problems, AIDS/HIV, Cancer and more with Team EvC! (click) • • •

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Replies to this message:
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